RO/DI question
- Thread starter DPayne
- Start date
- Tagged users None
redfishbluefish
Stay Positive, Stay Productive
Staff member
Super Moderator
Reef Squad
Partner Member 2024
Excellence Award
Article Contributor
NJRC Member
Hospitality Award
Something is not right. That's only an 88% reduction.....you should be closer to 98%. Also, I've got to believe that seven stages include DI resin....so it should be zero TDS.
What unit do you have, how old is it, how much water do you make, and when's the last time filters were changed?
Also calling @AZDesertRat on this one.
What unit do you have, how old is it, how much water do you make, and when's the last time filters were changed?
Also calling @AZDesertRat on this one.
redfishbluefish
Stay Positive, Stay Productive
Staff member
Super Moderator
Reef Squad
Partner Member 2024
Excellence Award
Article Contributor
NJRC Member
Hospitality Award
I think I've figured this out....with speculation. I'm guessing you have a "drinking water" RO system that includes a 3 - 5 gallon storage tank attached. Using water from the spigot will give you high TDS, from breakthrough from constantly filling the holding tank, and most likely from an "alkalinity" filter to put minerals back into the water so it has some taste.
The good news is that you could still use this unit for your tank. Put in a tee with a valve right after the membrane. Run this tee'd line through DI resin canister, and you're now producing zero TDS water.
The good news is that you could still use this unit for your tank. Put in a tee with a valve right after the membrane. Run this tee'd line through DI resin canister, and you're now producing zero TDS water.
What is in each of the 7 "stages"? Where did you draw the sample reading 16 from, with what and how?
What is the tap water TDS, RO only TDS and DI TDS after each DI stage if you have DI? What is your water pressure and water temperature? What is your exact measured waste ratio? I assume this system has a drinking water pressure tank, what does this tank store, RO water or RO/DI water? Does it have any post RO carbon taste and odor filters?
I think you are figuring out a drinking water RO system is nowhere similar to a reef quality RO/DI system no matter how many little hollow tubes of resin you add to it. There are major differences and it is always much easier and cheaper to add a drinking water kit to a reef ready RO/DI than to add DI to a drinking water system and expect reef quality water.
What is the tap water TDS, RO only TDS and DI TDS after each DI stage if you have DI? What is your water pressure and water temperature? What is your exact measured waste ratio? I assume this system has a drinking water pressure tank, what does this tank store, RO water or RO/DI water? Does it have any post RO carbon taste and odor filters?
I think you are figuring out a drinking water RO system is nowhere similar to a reef quality RO/DI system no matter how many little hollow tubes of resin you add to it. There are major differences and it is always much easier and cheaper to add a drinking water kit to a reef ready RO/DI than to add DI to a drinking water system and expect reef quality water.
wow i am very new at this i will have to find out what is in stages,the 16 came from the fresh ro discharge into a clean clear glass cup.Tap is 131ppm do not know what DI tds is,water press is 60 psi, temp going in is around 59,do not know how to get measured waste water ratio.As far as i know this is not a drinking water ro system.
redfishbluefish
Stay Positive, Stay Productive
Staff member
Super Moderator
Reef Squad
Partner Member 2024
Excellence Award
Article Contributor
NJRC Member
Hospitality Award
"Seven" stage Liquigen unit:
That is a pretty low end system, much like most ebay drinking water systems where the vendor tacks a bunch of little hollow tubes with some resin bobbing around in them and calls it a reef RO/DI.
You will not find any good reef quality RO/DI systems containing GAC, it only lasts about 300 total gallons ( that is 60 treated gallons and 240 waste gallons at the normal 4:1 waste ratio)so is next to worthless. The sediment and carbon block are very coarse so don't do much to protect the RO membrane and the little horizontal DI tubes are more for show than useful.
Thats not to say you can't install better filters and spend 30 minutes reconfiguring things to make it work though. If it were me I would install a 0.5 or 1 micron near absolute rated sediment filter, a single 0.5 or 0.6 micron extruded carbon block capable of removing chlorine from 20,000 gallons or normally chlorinated or chloraminated water, get rid of all the little DI tubes and convert the extra vertical canister into a real vertical refillable DI with parts you already have and maybe 15-20 minutes time. The complete filter replacement kit would be this 1 micron version with super sized reef specific DI
http://spectrapure.com/MPDI-System-Cartridge-Replacement-Kit-High-Capacity-DI
or this one with 0.5 micron filters and the same super sized DI.
http://spectrapure.com/CSPDI-System-Cartridge-Replacement-Kit-SuperDI-High-Capacity
The issues with the GAC in front of the carbon block and membrane are not only it has such a short life but it also degrades or pulverizes to dust and plugs the carbon block downstream so it soon becomes useless too and it eats your RO membrane. It also lowers pressure available to the membrane making it even less efficient.
The issues with the horizontal DI tubes is water takes the path of least resistance so travels along the bottom of the tubes or short circuits and not all resin and water come into contact with each other, poor contact time. Their solution is to add more of thesame inefficient tubes rather than use a vertical canister that fills from the bottom and exits the top so all resin and water contact each other. Yes, you can take the horizontal tubes off the top and fasten them vertically on one of the canisters or mount them to the wall with the tubing coming in the bottom and out the top but they still are not as efficient as a well packed vertical DI cartridge. If you upgrade the filters you would have a spare vertical canister not being used for the GAC and it is very easy to unscrew the lids from the wall bracket, unscrew the nylon nipple between the two carbon cansiters, turn one 90 degrees so the lines enter andexit front and back then move acouple 1/4" lines around. The plumbing then would be sediment filter, carbon block, RO mermbrane then back down to the new rotated DI canister and no more tubes clipped to the top to leak and get bumped. Much simpler and a whole lot more efficient.
You will not find any good reef quality RO/DI systems containing GAC, it only lasts about 300 total gallons ( that is 60 treated gallons and 240 waste gallons at the normal 4:1 waste ratio)so is next to worthless. The sediment and carbon block are very coarse so don't do much to protect the RO membrane and the little horizontal DI tubes are more for show than useful.
Thats not to say you can't install better filters and spend 30 minutes reconfiguring things to make it work though. If it were me I would install a 0.5 or 1 micron near absolute rated sediment filter, a single 0.5 or 0.6 micron extruded carbon block capable of removing chlorine from 20,000 gallons or normally chlorinated or chloraminated water, get rid of all the little DI tubes and convert the extra vertical canister into a real vertical refillable DI with parts you already have and maybe 15-20 minutes time. The complete filter replacement kit would be this 1 micron version with super sized reef specific DI
http://spectrapure.com/MPDI-System-Cartridge-Replacement-Kit-High-Capacity-DI
or this one with 0.5 micron filters and the same super sized DI.
http://spectrapure.com/CSPDI-System-Cartridge-Replacement-Kit-SuperDI-High-Capacity
The issues with the GAC in front of the carbon block and membrane are not only it has such a short life but it also degrades or pulverizes to dust and plugs the carbon block downstream so it soon becomes useless too and it eats your RO membrane. It also lowers pressure available to the membrane making it even less efficient.
The issues with the horizontal DI tubes is water takes the path of least resistance so travels along the bottom of the tubes or short circuits and not all resin and water come into contact with each other, poor contact time. Their solution is to add more of thesame inefficient tubes rather than use a vertical canister that fills from the bottom and exits the top so all resin and water contact each other. Yes, you can take the horizontal tubes off the top and fasten them vertically on one of the canisters or mount them to the wall with the tubing coming in the bottom and out the top but they still are not as efficient as a well packed vertical DI cartridge. If you upgrade the filters you would have a spare vertical canister not being used for the GAC and it is very easy to unscrew the lids from the wall bracket, unscrew the nylon nipple between the two carbon cansiters, turn one 90 degrees so the lines enter andexit front and back then move acouple 1/4" lines around. The plumbing then would be sediment filter, carbon block, RO mermbrane then back down to the new rotated DI canister and no more tubes clipped to the top to leak and get bumped. Much simpler and a whole lot more efficient.
Throw them as far away as you can throw, you don't want nor need them. Once you get the new filter kit let me know and I can walk you through the plumbing in about 3 minutes or you can probably look up some of my previous posts on the subject on any of the reef forums. It has been discussed many times and is simple to do with a couple of the fittings you will unscrew off one of the little clear tubes.
Search for my directions on how to convert the second carbon canister into a DI.basically you unscrew the three lids from the top bracket, unscrew the last carbon lid and 1/4" nylon nipple connecting it to the middle canister, screw a 90 degree speed fitting in place of the nipple so if faces the rear and reattach the first two lids to the bracket. Turn the loose lid 90 degrees so the inlet is in back and outlet is in front and reattach it to the bracket. Some brackets have predrilled holes, some need you to drill two new holes. Screw a straight speed fitting in both the front and back I let and outlet, you should have them available from the little clear tubes. Now the 1/4" tube that used to lead from the second carbon to the RO inlet gets moved over to the 90 degree fitting in the middle canister you have facing the rear, the RO treated water line that used to go to the little tubes now gets run to the back of the new vertical DI canister and the treated RO/DI comes out the front.
Install a 0.5 or 1 micron sediment filter in the clear canister, a 0.5 or 1 micron in the middle canister, then up to the horizontal RO membrane in top and finally back down to the new full size vertical DI cartridge.
Install a 0.5 or 1 micron sediment filter in the clear canister, a 0.5 or 1 micron in the middle canister, then up to the horizontal RO membrane in top and finally back down to the new full size vertical DI cartridge.
