Shock from LEDs

[RamsReef]

Oh I see,
I would suggest you unplug everything that touches the water in your tank and see what you get, you can then plug things in one at a time and see what changes.

You should also be measuring to the ground hole on the receptacle, that is the round one. One probe in outlet ground, one in tank, unplug everything, plug back in one at a time and see what moves the meter.

You can also test your LED lights by putting one probe in the outlet the other on the LED case, but as stated this should be grounded, I guess youll see.

 

[PaReeferJ]

I started with 75v, unplugged Koralia which dropped it to 25v. So I remove 50v by unplugging the Koralia.



I didn't unplug everything at once, just went around unplugging and plugging back in certain things to see if it changed anything. I never unpluged the ATO or the lights though.

I'm inexperienced with this area so any advice is appreciated. Thanks everyone for your help.

Try the lights and ato. If still have 25v I would unplug it all and plug stuff back in one by one testing after each item.

 

[mr11]

Will do!

You should also be measuring to the ground hole on the receptacle, that is the round one. One probe in outlet ground, one in tank, unplug everything, plug back in one at a time and see what moves the meter.

The probes on my meter aren't long enough to reach the wall outlet and the water at the same time. Can I run an extension cord and use that as the ground?

 

[PaReeferJ]

Will do!



The probes on my meter aren't long enough to reach the wall outlet and the water at the same time. Can I run an extension cord and use that as the ground?

Yes just as long as it's a 3 prong cord

 

[mr11]

OK here we go. I don't understand electricity

Nothing plugged in - 7v???
Only micro smart ATO plugged in - 15v
Only light plugged in - 5v
Light plus ATO plugged in - 10v????
Return pump, lights, ATO - 13
Skimmer, RP, Light ATO - 16v in sump, 18v in DT
Heater (apparently I did have one plugged in, whoops), skimmer, RP, light ATO - 25v
Took out heater, added Gyre 130 - 15v
Koralia - 75v.

So. The gist. Take the Koralia out and the heater? I read 50v is acceptable so am I should be ok at 15v?
Why 7v with nothing plugged in, the meter seemed zeroed when I tested it on the outlet ie 120v readout. Why does V drop when I add a new component?

Turns out it's not the lights as you were all saying.

EDIT: Light and ATO share an outlet. Everything else is sharing another outlet.

 

[Brew12]

Sorry, been busy tonight. Glad you got the meter. Can you tell me what model of meter you purchased?
If it is auto-ranging make sure you the range isn't changing from V to mV
You may also want to check your voltage from neutral to ground. Your neutral plug is the one with the wider slot. You should read zero volts. If you read anything more than that you could have an issue with your home wiring.

 

[Brew12]

I read 50v is acceptable so am I should be ok at 15v

No, not really. 50V and below is considered de-energized by code. Not because it is safe, but because it isn't horribly dangerous and the old telephone circuits ran at 48 V. The people writing the regulations understood the nightmare that would be caused by requiring electrical safety measures to be taken when around telephones and so the 50V limit was born.
You really should have almost no voltage to ground. You could have some induced voltage and we can test for that.

 

[mr11]

No problem, you've been a lot of help.

It's a Triplett 2030 -c

Good point, I was never good at keeping track of the units in chem and physics. It looks like I need to manually select to change the range from V to mV so I don't think that's it. I can go back through and unplug everything again tomorrow.

Neutral to ground reads effectively 0 at 0.2 V. Ground to the not neutral plug is 121 v. I'm in an apartment if that matters.

 

[Brew12]

The Triplett 2030-c is an auto ranging meter so it could be going to a mV reading. The other selections do other things.

Ok, I feel better about your neutral. That is always a concern because sometimes a neutral can get separated from ground (normally bonded together in your electrical panel). That is a common cause of electrical house fires. Sounds like you are good here though so no worry.

Unfortunately your meter can only read to 400mA so I may have to rethink how to have you test if the voltage is induced.

 

[Brew12]

Your Koralia is definitely bad. If you have it out of the tank and unplugged I expect you will either see the cord pulling out of the body or a crack in the body of the powerhead.
I suspect your heater has seen better days. Hard to say for sure with the information given but I would be cautious with it.

Your light and your ATO are fine so I wouldn't worry about those.

I believe the rest of the issues you are seeing are induced voltages if the meter isn't auto ranging to mV. Power cords running inside the water or along the outside of the tank can induce voltage in the salt water. To generate electricity you need 3 things. A conductor (the salt water), a magnetic field (energized cables generate magnetic fields), and relative motion (by definition, AC current creates relative motion). There are a few ways to verify this but the safest for you, based on your meter, is to try and minimize the length of cable inside the tank and pull the cords away from the outside edge of the glass and then take your voltage readings again. If they change substantially you know it is an induced voltage issue.

I strongly recommend putting a grounding probe in your sump to help keep you safe. I would also recommend getting a portable GFCI device to plug everything that gets submerged into.

 

[RamsReef]

You really need to do one at a time, and figure out if your meter is autoranging.

Can you please measure between your two outlets the little slot (not neutral) to little slot (not neutral) it will either read 0v or 240v let us know which.

We know for sure your powerhead is no good, your heater looks mediocre.

 

[RamsReef]

Your Koralia is definitely bad. If you have it out of the tank and unplugged I expect you will either see the cord pulling out of the body or a crack in the body of the powerhead.
I suspect your heater has seen better days. Hard to say for sure with the information given but I would be cautious with it.

Your light and your ATO are fine so I wouldn't worry about those.

I believe the rest of the issues you are seeing are induced voltages if the meter isn't auto ranging to mV. Power cords running inside the water or along the outside of the tank can induce voltage in the salt water. To generate electricity you need 3 things. A conductor (the salt water), a magnetic field (energized cables generate magnetic fields), and relative motion (by definition, AC current creates relative motion). There are a few ways to verify this but the safest for you, based on your meter, is to try and minimize the length of cable inside the tank and pull the cords away from the outside edge of the glass and then take your voltage readings again. If they change substantially you know it is an induced voltage issue.

I strongly recommend putting a grounding probe in your sump to help keep you safe. I would also recommend getting a portable GFCI device to plug everything that gets submerged into.

Beat me by that much.

 

[mr11]

Thanks again for all your help. So will these two items work? I don't know that I can change the actual wall outlet as it's an apartment.

https://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-O...TF8&qid=1472698600&sr=8-1&keywords=gfci+strip

https://www.amazon.com/RV2735-Rid-Volt-Titanium-Grounding-Probe/dp/B0002DGSWE

Little to little is reading 0V.

I'll go back and look at auto ranging tomorrow. Just to clarify, what problem would determining if the meter is autorangining solve? The 7v with nothing plugged in? I know with what I have plugged in now it is 15V, not mV.

 

[Brew12]

Thanks again for all your help. So will these two items work? I don't know that I can change the actual wall outlet as it's an apartment.

https://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-O...TF8&qid=1472698600&sr=8-1&keywords=gfci+strip

https://www.amazon.com/RV2735-Rid-Volt-Titanium-Grounding-Probe/dp/B0002DGSWE

Little to little is reading 0V.

I'll go back and look at auto ranging tomorrow. Just to clarify, what problem would determining if the meter is autorangining solve? The 7v with nothing plugged in? I know with what I have plugged in now it is 15V, not mV.

Yes, those would both be good choices in my opinion. I purchased a ground probe with a longer probe but that will work fine. Just put it in your sump.
I have a feeling your issue is an induced voltage. At least I hope it is. If you order those items and hook them up you will know for sure. If the GFCI trips you know you still have a faulted component in the tank. If the GFCI does not trip than you know these are induced voltages.

 

[Brew12]

Just to clarify, what problem would determining if the meter is autorangining solve? The 7v with nothing plugged in? I know with what I have plugged in now it is 15V, not mV.

Sorry, missed this. If your meter were showing 15mV right now instead of 15V then there would be no chance you have a problem. At 15V it is possible that it is induced but could be a very minor voltage leak.
I'm calling it a night but I'll keep an eye out for your posts tomorrow in case you need more help.

 

[Brew12]

Thanks again for all your help. So will these two items work? I don't know that I can change the actual wall outlet as it's an apartment.

https://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-O...TF8&qid=1472698600&sr=8-1&keywords=gfci+strip

https://www.amazon.com/RV2735-Rid-Volt-Titanium-Grounding-Probe/dp/B0002DGSWE

Little to little is reading 0V.

I'll go back and look at auto ranging tomorrow. Just to clarify, what problem would determining if the meter is autorangining solve? The 7v with nothing plugged in? I know with what I have plugged in now it is 15V, not mV.

If you haven't ordered anything you could always save money and go with something like this.

https://www.amazon.com/Tower-Manufa...8?ie=UTF8&qid=1472729025&sr=8-8&keywords=gfci

Just plug it into the wall then plug your current power strip into it.

 

[mr11]

Awesome, thanks again. It would be safe to run regular extension cords/power strips out of one of those GFCI outlets?

 

[Brew12]

Awesome, thanks again. It would be safe to run regular extension cords/power strips out of one of those GFCI outlets?

Yes, it would. It will detect leakage current and provide protection for everything plugged into the power strip if the power strip is plugged into the gfci. All the unit you linked from Amazon does is combine the 2. Having 2 separate parts will work the exact same way.

 

[Mjp83]

I know you have found and solved the issue of stray voltage, but the same exact thing happened to me!!!

It was also a korallia power head, which I had bought used. Two out of three were producing voltage, also at about 75v.

Once all was unplugged, I went back one by one, checking after each item, and my tank now has about 12-19 V. This is from water moving.

I have since then removed all 110 v items, and run only 12v or 24v power heads and pumps (Jaebo).

Hope more people read this, and realize Korallias have a "expiration date!"

 

[mr11]

I have a GFCI and grounding probe arriving today so I'll let you know