180 Predator FOWLR Tank

[Chef Mateo]

Hi, I will be eventually buying this tank to place on top of my other 180 gal. It would be a predator FOWLR tank. I'm still working out that stocking if you would like to help out: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/180-gallon-stocking.414181/#post-4871353

This is what I would like to have:
A pair of Radiata Lionfish (if I can't find anywhere would get antennata lion)
1 Snowflake Eel

I feel like this is under-stocking for a 120 and would love to have as much fish as possible so here are so options for additional fish:

Humu Humu Trigger (Love this fish kind of a hit or miss but, pretty risky w/ lion)
Niger Trigger (much more peaceful than above)
Porcupine Puffer (I know lot's of waste)
Leaf Scorpion Fish (Same family as lionfish should synergize well)
Wartskin Angler (Have heard of them eating lionfish which results in both dead so definitely leaning towards not getting one just love the look)
Possible Ray? Not sure what type though

Thanks for your feedback also could you help w/ my other stocking list.
Thank you very much!

 

[SPR1968]

Hi and welcome to R2R!

 

[Chef Mateo]

Forgot to add. Are there any sharks that would go in 180? I know they may need a bigger tank. Also, on LiveAquaria it says Humu Humu needs 180 gal. On many other websites it only says 50-70 gal. Can I have your guys opinion on that. Thanks

 

[Chef Mateo]

plz help

 

[lion king]

I'll immediately sign off on the snowflake, humu, and niger; here are my thoughts on the rest. You really should just drop the shark and ray idea, do some more research and see why.

I would choose an antennata over a radiata, both are very difficult species to acclimate long term. You really need an observation tank for these; mainly to train them to dead food, your set up would not allow for live feeding in necessary once in the dt. Radiata's are very tough, much slower moving and may not compete well at feeding time, an antenata will be a vit more aggressive and agreeable to taking dead food, although very very tough and some find impossible. Consider this addition carefully, maybe a volitan instead. Feeding challenges go the same for the angler and leaf fish, I would not put these guys in that mix. They are stationary fish that could draw negative attention from the triggers, and they do not live long on a dead only diet. A warty and a leaf fish make a great pair for a small species tank, like a 30g.

I've keep many triggers with my lions and have never had an incident, but I have never met a porcupine puffer that was not a nipper. I like them but would never keep one personally. A dogface puffer would be a much better choice.

Have you thought about a tang or angel. Just for your perusal, here's what I have in my 210g which is just a bit taller than your 180g.

Flagfin angel
majestic angel
orange shoulder tang
scopus tang
one spot foxface
black volitan lion
yellow belly dogface puffer
a blind pinktail trigger
a very boring pair of bluejaw triggers

Liveaquaria offers the only real advise on tank sizes, although not perfect. The other vendors just want to sell fish, keeping a humu in a 50g is ridiculous. I've grown out my baby triggers in a 40b for like the 1st year when they are still well under 2". At the very least you might get away with a 125g for a humu, they do grow incredibly slow.

 

[Chef Mateo]

I'll immediately sign off on the snowflake, humu, and niger; here are my thoughts on the rest. You really should just drop the shark and ray idea, do some more research and see why.

I would choose an antennata over a radiata, both are very difficult species to acclimate long term. You really need an observation tank for these; mainly to train them to dead food, your set up would not allow for live feeding in necessary once in the dt. Radiata's are very tough, much slower moving and may not compete well at feeding time, an antenata will be a vit more aggressive and agreeable to taking dead food, although very very tough and some find impossible. Consider this addition carefully, maybe a volitan instead. Feeding challenges go the same for the angler and leaf fish, I would not put these guys in that mix. They are stationary fish that could draw negative attention from the triggers, and they do not live long on a dead only diet. A warty and a leaf fish make a great pair for a small species tank, like a 30g.

I've keep many triggers with my lions and have never had an incident, but I have never met a porcupine puffer that was not a nipper. I like them but would never keep one personally. A dogface puffer would be a much better choice.

Have you thought about a tang or angel. Just for your perusal, here's what I have in my 210g which is just a bit taller than your 180g.

Flagfin angel
majestic angel
orange shoulder tang
scopus tang
one spot foxface
black volitan lion
yellow belly dogface puffer
a blind pinktail trigger
a very boring pair of bluejaw triggers

Liveaquaria offers the only real advise on tank sizes, although not perfect. The other vendors just want to sell fish, keeping a humu in a 50g is ridiculous. I've grown out my baby triggers in a 40b for like the 1st year when they are still well under 2". At the very least you might get away with a 125g for a humu, they do grow incredibly slow.

I was thinking of eventually getting a 30 gal for a warty. As, I do have a 30 gal on hand. I have thought more of angels since i love the look just didn't even think of them with preds. I love all triggers so would be fine with any except crosshatch way too expansive! Humus are my favourite but if they'er too much of a problem I really don't need them. I would be able to get a lion that already eats dead food. So would a radiata/antennata still be a problem? I amfine w/ Volitan expecially the black one as I prefer it's colouration. Do you think I could have a very similar stock list as yours in a 180. I would probably take out the orange shoulder tang from that list and I uld take out foxface if you think I'm overstocking a 180. I feel like that's pretty good stocking for a FOWLR tank. Also, would switch flagfin to goldflake angel as my lfs has had several shipments so they only around $200. Also would a mimic lemon peel tang be a good substitute for orangeshoulder, it's a bit smaller but I like it unless, I take it out of my list. Or would a powder blue/brown be good just feel like they're too fragile. I don't mind the look of the bluejaw triggers, they're actually quite nice. Do they just float around and not do much?

This would be final stocking list:
Goldflake Angelfish(possible: flagfin)
Majestic Angelfish
Scopas Tang
One Spot Foxface(or bicolor fox) - Possibly
Radiata/Antennata Lion(Volitan if not)
Dogface puffer
Pinktail Trigger
2 Bluejaw triggers

 

[lion king]

I was thinking of eventually getting a 30 gal for a warty. As, I do have a 30 gal on hand. I have thought more of angels since i love the look just didn't even think of them with preds. I love all triggers so would be fine with any except crosshatch way too expansive! Humus are my favourite but if they'er too much of a problem I really don't need them. I would be able to get a lion that already eats dead food. So would a radiata/antennata still be a problem? I amfine w/ Volitan expecially the black one as I prefer it's colouration. Do you think I could have a very similar stock list as yours in a 180. I would probably take out the orange shoulder tang from that list and I uld take out foxface if you think I'm overstocking a 180. I feel like that's pretty good stocking for a FOWLR tank. Also, would switch flagfin to goldflake angel as my lfs has had several shipments so they only around $200. Also would a mimic lemon peel tang be a good substitute for orangeshoulder, it's a bit smaller but I like it unless, I take it out of my list. Or would a powder blue/brown be good just feel like they're too fragile. I don't mind the look of the bluejaw triggers, they're actually quite nice. Do they just float around and not do much?

This would be final stocking list:
Goldflake Angelfish(possible: flagfin)
Majestic Angelfish
Scopas Tang
One Spot Foxface(or bicolor fox) - Possibly
Radiata/Antennata Lion(Volitan if not)
Dogface puffer
Pinktail Trigger
2 Bluejaw triggers

I had a goldflake die in qt, I paid $430 and didn't want to spend that much again. Funny thing is I actually wanted a flagfin 1st and was talked out of it. You sound like you are dealing with a good lfs, if you can get any of those lions already eating dead food, you can chose any of them you'd like. I mean really eating though, nice chunks of meat until there's a nice bulge in the belly; nippling dead food doesn't cut it. You will still have to target feed them when they get into the dt. Lions will rarely eat anything when it hits the ground, except on maybe the 1st bounce.

Mimic tangs are cool and when in adult colors as a chocolate tang are fantastic in person, pics don't do them justice. I just lost one because I made a horrible miscalculation and my jeweled eel fubar'd him. They are hardy and laid back, won't give you the potential trouble a powder blue might, and are not ich magnets. The adult coloration of the mimic tang is similar to a more spectacular powder brown.

I enjoy the foxface much more than I thought I would, any of the foxface varieties would work. Although the scopus isn't that brilliant, in person they sort of change colors as the light hits them at different angles. Mine changes from black and purple with orange fins and a faint lavender face.

I thought I wanted a much more docile tank in the beginning, so I got a pair of bluejaws, if it wasn't such a chore I'd pull them out and give them to a friend. The humu should cause you no trouble, they are actually one of the nicer triggers. If you like real tough traditional triggers, bluejaws will likely be boring to you as well. Humu and nigers usually go good together, if you have an interest in the pinktail, that would work in the mix as well.

My personal favorite large tank formula is as follows; a volitan lion, a dogface puffer, 2-3 triggers, a couple of tangs, and a couple of angels. A couple of pics for inspiration.

 

[Chef Mateo]

I had a goldflake die in qt, I paid $430 and didn't want to spend that much again. Funny thing is I actually wanted a flagfin 1st and was talked out of it. You sound like you are dealing with a good lfs, if you can get any of those lions already eating dead food, you can chose any of them you'd like. I mean really eating though, nice chunks of meat until there's a nice bulge in the belly; nippling dead food doesn't cut it. You will still have to target feed them when they get into the dt. Lions will rarely eat anything when it hits the ground, except on maybe the 1st bounce.

Mimic tangs are cool and when in adult colors as a chocolate tang are fantastic in person, pics don't do them justice. I just lost one because I made a horrible miscalculation and my jeweled eel fubar'd him. They are hardy and laid back, won't give you the potential trouble a powder blue might, and are not ich magnets. The adult coloration of the mimic tang is similar to a more spectacular powder brown.

I enjoy the foxface much more than I thought I would, any of the foxface varieties would work. Although the scopus isn't that brilliant, in person they sort of change colors as the light hits them at different angles. Mine changes from black and purple with orange fins and a faint lavender face.

I thought I wanted a much more docile tank in the beginning, so I got a pair of bluejaws, if it wasn't such a chore I'd pull them out and give them to a friend. The humu should cause you no trouble, they are actually one of the nicer triggers. If you like real tough traditional triggers, bluejaws will likely be boring to you as well. Humu and nigers usually go good together, if you have an interest in the pinktail, that would work in the mix as well.

My personal favorite large tank formula is as follows; a volitan lion, a dogface puffer, 2-3 triggers, a couple of tangs, and a couple of angels. A couple of pics for inspiration.

Beautiful lion and angels. I do think i'll go with a humu and a niger over the pair of bluethroats then. Goldflake prices are a lot don't really want to risk it but, thet're too beautiful also, do love flagfins though. The lions will eat big chunks of brine and other meaty foods. I do like your formula very much makes a nice looking stock list. Thanks so much for your input and inspiration.