30G HOB - Copepod factory for Dragonet?

nate's reef · Jul 7, 2017

Hey guys,

I have a 10 gallon reef tank in progress. 0ppm all nitrate cycle, 0 phosphates, and stable everything so far but no fuge. Right now I have a thriving purple firefish but like everyone I am mesmerized by the Mandarin Dragonet. I understand a Dragonet needs about a 60 gallon tanks worth of copepods, however I was curious if this could be supplemented with a HOB filter. From what i read on the Dragonet article here, it looks like the hard part of keeping enough copepods for your dragonet is keeping your dragonet from wiping them out. I was considering using an Aquaclear 30 as a copepod sanctuary and possibly getting a dragonet when the populations are stable. I was thinking that simply using filter floss or a coarse foam block would collect enough debris to house a massive amount of copedpods and could be run essentially non stop except to clean the impeller or to knock out some larger pods into the tank for food. What are some of your thoughts, especially people who have tried to or do keep them? I used a HOB with floss when cycling and had a pile of pods in my floss before, but i know these guys eat endlessly. Right now I feed my firefin once a week because he also eats copepods and has an endless supply, i would estimate 50+ sexually mature adults and then hundreds of younger pods. I am curious if this has been tried but i have not been able to find anything on it related to dragonets.

saltyfilmfolks · Jul 7, 2017

Nope. Don't do it.

I kept a small Mandy in a 30gal with a large hob fuge and it was a full time job and expense to keep him fed.

nate's reef · Jul 7, 2017

saltyfilmfolks said:
Nope. Don't do it.

I kept a small Mandy in a 30gal with a large hob fuge and it was a full time job and expense to keep him fed.

Well, thank you for the honest advice. I wish they would just lie and say they get 12" or something because it is so hard to accept that little 2" fish is such a handful lol. Guess ill just get this tank going and frag my way to a dragonet tank someday.

Thanks

saltyfilmfolks · Jul 7, 2017

nate's reef said:
Well, thank you for the honest advice. I wish they would just lie and say they get 12" or something because it is so hard to accept that little 2" fish is such a handful lol. Guess ill just get this tank going and frag my way to a dragonet tank someday.
Thanks

It's not 2" however. Mine is over a year now and closer to 3. The largest I've seen in person and close to five.
The problem is the have a small stomach basicly. The don't keep food in for long. Add that to there like cats in personality. The do what they want when they want. So getting them to eat frozen at all can be hard. And trying to add food all day to a tiny tank ends badly.

Well at least you know what size tank you'll be getting next!!

Mikeinthekeys · Sep 29, 2017

saltyfilmfolks said:
Nope. Don't do it.

I kept a small Mandy in a 30gal with a large hob fuge and it was a full time job and expense to keep him fed.

I just got a dragonet today! I have a 30 gallon tank with a 50 aqueon HOB filter.
It is a very mature tank, 5+ years. I was without power for 3 days and I only had 2 casualties, a royal gamma, and a starfish that was in the motor when it finally kicked back on. I also had a zoanthid and a small colony of star polyps that are actually making a great comeback, and 2 oscellaris clowns and a Pajama Cardinal that made it through the power outage. Today, almost two weeks after my power was restored, my tank seemed stable enough to get some new fish and frags. My tank was being over run with copepods and the population has not thinned out over 2 weeks so I got a dragonet to hopefully keep up with the population.

Do you think she will wipe them out completely?

saltyfilmfolks · Sep 29, 2017

Mikeinthekeys said:
I just got a dragonet today! I have a 30 gallon tank with a 50 aqueon HOB filter.
It is a very mature tank, 5+ years. I was without power for 3 days and I only had 2 casualties, a royal gamma, and a starfish that was in the motor when it finally kicked back on. I also had a zoanthid and a small colony of star polyps that are actually making a great comeback, and 2 oscellaris clowns and a Pajama Cardinal that made it through the power outage. Today, almost two weeks after my power was restored, my tank seemed stable enough to get some new fish and frags. My tank was being over run with copepods and the population has not thinned out over 2 weeks so I got a dragonet to hopefully keep up with the population.

Do you think she will wipe them out completely?

A green or red mandarin?
IMO a decent sized hob Refugim is a good idea. It keeps them breeding. And if you leave porous rock and even smallish sized sponges in there you can put them from the fuge to the DT. Or even just float the chato in the tank for a couple days to replenish the tank. I still do this in my sumped 55g now. My mandy loves a good fresh sump rock. Mmm bugs.

Mikeinthekeys · Sep 29, 2017

I think it is a green. I will post a pic in a few minutes

saltyfilmfolks · Sep 29, 2017

Mikeinthekeys said:
I think it is a green. I will post a pic in a few minutes

Cool! But it's a red or green mandarin?

Mikeinthekeys · Sep 29, 2017

Is it green or red?

Screen Shot 2017-09-29 at 6.30.18 PM.png

Mikeinthekeys · Sep 29, 2017

Luckily I have access to live rock I can swap out if the supply seems to be getting low. This fish seemed very skinny when I got it. It has been in a small display tank for a while so hopefully my out of control copepod population will fatten it up.

saltyfilmfolks · Sep 29, 2017

Red. Oh yea she's skinny.
If can try to find nutirmar ova. It's a high fat food. Perhaps frozen baby brine too. Spruilina gut loaded if you can.

If she starts picking at the bugs right away, your probably fine.

Fishninja · Sep 29, 2017

Doesn’t biota Palau sell captive bred ones that eat prepared foods?

Paul B · Sep 29, 2017

Nope, not gonna happen, no chance, Nada, sorry. I wish I could lie and say something else but that skinny little mandarin is not going to make it in a 10 gallon tank.

I wrote this just for you. http://www.saltwatersmarts.com/diy-target-feeder-mandarinfish-pipefish-2804/

Mikeinthekeys · Sep 29, 2017

Paul B said:
Nope, not gonna happen, no chance, Nada, sorry. I wish I could lie and say something else but that skinny little mandarin is not going to make it in a 10 gallon tank.

I wrote this just for you. http://www.saltwatersmarts.com/diy-target-feeder-mandarinfish-pipefish-2804/

Right now this fish is in a 30 gallon tank.

saltyfilmfolks said:
Red. Oh yea she's skinny.
If can try to find nutirmar ova. It's a high fat food. Perhaps frozen baby brine too. Spruilina gut loaded if you can.

If she starts picking at the bugs right away, your probably fine.

She's been picking non stop. There are still tons of copepods. I will post an update in about a week. Sooner if anything out of the ordinary happens.

saltyfilmfolks · Sep 29, 2017

Paul B said:
Nope, not gonna happen, no chance, Nada, sorry. I wish I could lie and say something else but that skinny little mandarin is not going to make it in a 10 gallon tank.

I wrote this just for you. http://www.saltwatersmarts.com/diy-target-feeder-mandarinfish-pipefish-2804/

It's a 30 gallon but yea. It's going to be an uphill battle.

I started my first one in a 20 then went to a 30. It's not easy. I had zero other bug eating fish and focused on bug breeding rather than corals and other fish. Lots of water changes. Thank goodness ocean water is free.

Fishninja said:
Doesn’t biota Palau sell captive bred ones that eat prepared foods?

They are just tank conditioned. It's not like a genetic thing. They still need a constant supply of food. The frozen is just a supplement. It has to do with the shortness of their digestive track. They don't sore it in their stomach like we do.

Def read up on Paul's solution there.
I learned my tricks from him and Melev almost ten years ago.