A losing algae battle

[SheldonC]

My tank is about 3 months old, having spent the first 6 weeks with the lights off and clownfish as the source of ammonia to cycle.

Well I turn the lights on (Red Sea LED90s) and did an acclimation from 50% to their 100% recommendation. This resulted in a brutal hair algae breakout. I've tested my water using the Hanna Checkers and my nitrates consistently read 0, but my phosphates are hovering around .38-.44 no matter how much I change the water, manually remove the algae, feed less, etc. Regardless, the limited corals I have are definitely suffering from the lack of nitrates, or so I think. My alk was a little low as I'm using the Tropic Marin Pro salt, which mixes at 7dKH, but I don't think it's the root cause of the recessed tissue of the corals.

Anyway, I'm at a bit of a loss. I don't want to simply feed more to bring nitrates up because that will increase my phosphates. Do I dose something like Neo Nitro? I'm also aware that the numbers I get when testing are the remnants of what the algae hasn't taken up, so my phosphates might be a heck of a lighter higher.

I started the tank with dry rock and fresh sand. The rock was from a previous setup, so maybe it's leaching PO4? Any advice would be helpful. At this point I might set up my QT tank as a nursery and run a blackout on the tank to kill off the algae and effectively "start over".

 

[Lavey29]

GHA is common for new tanks between 3 and 10 months. 0 nitrates means your corals are starving to death. You want 10 to 15 nitrates. I had to double dose neophos and neonitro for multiple months before I got measurable numbers. Water changes do not lower phosphates because it binds to rocks. Try a bag of phosguard or few drops of phosphates RX. Avoid pellet and flake food. Limit coral supplements like reef roids. GHA requires daily manual removal and I diverse cleaner crew that includes tuxedo urchins and turbos. Raise magnesium to 1500 which helps weaken GHA.

 

[SheldonC]

GHA is common for new tanks between 3 and 10 months. 0 nitrates means your corals are starving to death. You want 10 to 15 nitrates. I had to double dose neophos and neonitro for multiple months before I got measurable numbers. Water changes do not lower phosphates because it binds to rocks. Try a bag of phosguard or few drops of phosphates RX. Avoid pellet and flake food. Limit coral supplements like reef roids. GHA requires daily manual removal and I diverse cleaner crew that includes tuxedo urchins and turbos. Raise magnesium to 1500 which helps weaken GHA.

I have a bag of GFO in the sump as I don't have room for a reactor of any sort, but it hasn't made a measurable difference. My CUC consists of hermits, trochus snails, astrea snails, cerith snails, and turbos. Food is only frozen foods at this point to avoid additional pollutants.

 

[Lavey29]

I have a bag of GFO in the sump as I don't have room for a reactor of any sort, but it hasn't made a measurable difference. My CUC consists of hermits, trochus snails, astrea snails, cerith snails, and turbos. Food is only frozen foods at this point to avoid additional pollutants.

Ok but with 0 nitrates your phosphates won't decrease either. Mine average .2 to .4 so you level is not critical by any means. What export do you have? Wet skimming? Ditch the GFO and try half dose of phosphate rx.

 

[SheldonC]

Ok but with 0 nitrates your phosphates won't decrease either. Mine average .2 to .4 so you level is not critical by any means. What export do you have? Wet skimming? Ditch the GFO and try half dose of phosphate rx.

Are nitrates and phosphates correlated in such a way that without nitrates your phosphates won't decrease? That's something I've never heard.

Tank is running a skimmer with a pretty dry skim at this point.

 

[Garf]

Are nitrates and phosphates correlated in such a way that without nitrates your phosphates won't decrease? That's something I've never heard.

Tank is running a skimmer with a pretty dry skim at this point.

Not when GFO is mentioned, no.

 

[Lavey29]

Are nitrates and phosphates correlated in such a way that without nitrates your phosphates won't decrease? That's something I've never heard.

Tank is running a skimmer with a pretty dry skim at this point.

Yes

Nitrates and phosphates are consumed by bacteria in a 16:1 ratio, known as the Redfield Ratio, so if you have zero nitrates then your system is nitrate limited. If there is not enough nitrate then the bacteria can't consume phosphate, causing it to rise

 

[SheldonC]

I have two conflicting answers here, which is good - multiple opinions and data points are how we improve.

The bottom line here is that I need SOME nitrates in the tank, that's apparent. So there's no reason to dose something like NOPOX from Red Sea to try and drive those phosphates down.

 

[VintageReefer]

His coral could be consuming nitrates and there aren’t detectable levels leftover for the test kit to pick up

I’m consistently near 0 for both nitrate and phosphate but my growth and coral health is excellent

 

[Garf]

Nitrates and phosphates are consumed by bacteria in a 16:1 ratio, known as the Redfield Ratio

No, they don't. I did a test where bacteria consumed 4ppm ammonia (equivalent to 15ish ppm Nitrate) and they consumed no detectable phosphate.

So there's no reason to dose something like NOPOX from Red Sea to try and drive those phosphates down.

No, carbon dosing is very poor at removing phosphates.

 

[SheldonC]

His coral could be consuming nitrates and there aren’t detectable levels leftover for the test kit to pick up

I’m consistently near 0 for both nitrate and phosphate but my growth and coral health is excellent

My corals are definitely looking more drab lately. Acans that used to be puffy are closed up, favites that used to look good are almost nothing but a mouth left. I'm not growing anything overly demanding, but things are definitely unhappy from SOMETHING.

 

[Badblackdog]

No, they don't. I did a test where bacteria consumed 4ppm ammonia (equivalent to 15ish ppm Nitrate) and they consumed no detectable phosphate.

No, carbon dosing is very poor at removing phosphates.

Your pics are amazing

What App are you using to track your tank?

 

[Garf]

@VintageReefer I think he's refering to you, lol

 

[VintageReefer]

It’s called aquarium manager

 

[jabberwock]

This is a 3 month old tank. Does any one else think the OP is moving WAY TOO FAST?

 

[SheldonC]

This is a 3 month old tank. Does any one else think the OP is moving WAY TOO FAST?

Oh boy, here comes these comments. Maybe to calm your nerves, it's not my first reef, but the first time I've come across this type of situation.

But if you want to provide useless comments then you're a lost cause.

 

[jabberwock]

Oh boy, here comes these comments. Maybe to calm your nerves, it's not my first reef, but the first time I've come across this type of situation.

But if you want to provide useless comments then you're a lost cause.

Best of luck.

 

[arcangelreef]

Yes

Nitrates and phosphates are consumed by bacteria in a 16:1 ratio, known as the Redfield Ratio, so if you have zero nitrates then your system is nitrate limited. If there is not enough nitrate then the bacteria can't consume phosphate, causing it to rise

There is so much wrong with this comment. I don’t even know where to start.
I suggest you do some more research on what the red field ratio is, what it actually was originally applied too and the difference between N, P and No3, Po4.

 

[Garf]

And no pictures

 

[SheldonC]

And no pictures

Speaking of pictures - any recommendations of a phone camera filter to prevent the pictures being washed out? Amazon has a lot, but I'd trust word-of-mouth if folks have one they like.