accidentally breeding yellow tail damsels. . .

[MoshJosh]

My two large yellow tail damsels cohabitate and chase away their tank mates (other yellow tail damsels). This seems like totally normal behavior and sort of the anticipated result of keeping so many damsels (trying it out "experimentally" knowing it might fail?). . . then today I noticed one of the big ones keeps hiding in a cave. . . and it's hard to see but. . . I am pretty sure the wall of the cave is lined with eggs. . .

I tried taking a photo but it doesn't really capture the translucent spheres that I can see in person:

 

[Timfish]

Congradulations! Damsels are sequential hermaphrodites like clowns so it reasoanble to get a breeding pair if you have several of the same species.

 

[MischiefReef]

And thus a new generation of tank bullies was born

 

[MoshJosh]

aaaand I think all the eggs hatched and. . . I think. . . all the fry (larva?) got blasted around by the wavemaker and became coral food or took a trip to the filter sock. . .

easy come easy go I guess

 

[blaxsun]

The thought of hundreds of little terrors not roaming another tank brings a smile to my face...

 

[MoshJosh]

Congradulations! Damsels are sequential hermaphrodites like clowns so it reasoanble to get a breeding pair if you have several of the same species.

Will the pair continue to be a "pair" after breeding? Like will they continue to cohabitate now or will they go back to hating each other?

 

[Timfish]

Will the pair continue to be a "pair" after breeding? Like will they continue to cohabitate now or will they go back to hating each other?

As I understand it the female keeps her position in the hierarchy teh same way clowns do by continually intimidateing and harrassing all the males and juveniles in her harem, so "Yes", "Yes" and "Yes"..

 

[MoshJosh]

I caught all the little ones and left the pair in the tank. . . not sure what I will do now. . .

Either try to breed them or. . . aggressive only tank???

 

[Timfish]

Not my problem.

 

[naterealbig]

Curious to know outcome here, as I'm planning 20-30 for my upcoming reef. Would be great to not have to pay $10 ea for them...

Feasibility for in-tank propagation, assuming no filter socks? I imagine there is a planktonic stage of the lifecycle where my skimmer would surely get them, but I'm curious...

 

[MoshJosh]

Not my problem.

fair haha BUT STILL

think it's "worth" trying to actually breed them. My LFS sort of said they would want them if I could captive breed them. I don't necessarily mean monetarily. . . Like how challenging is this going to be haha

 

[MoshJosh]

Curious to know outcome here, as I'm planning 20-30 for my upcoming reef. Would be great to not have to pay $10 ea for them...

Feasibility for in-tank propagation, assuming no filter socks? I imagine there is a planktonic stage of the lifecycle where my skimmer would surely get them, but I'm curious...

I run a sock and a skimmer. . . so yeah they all died. .

That said if and when they breed again I would try to get the eggs and move them to a breeder box or separate tank.

 

[Reefing102]

I think it’s worth a shot to captive breed. Though I wouldn’t make it a career unless you can ship nationwide as I don’t think flooding the locals with Yellow tail damsels is sustainable. That said, it’s pretty cool to see

 

[dwest]

I have a pair that breed frequently. I’ve never seen young though. (I guess they become food like clownfish fry) I’m 90% sure that I bought the damsels as captive bred as well. Likely purchased from live aquaria back in the day.

 

[areefer01]

One of the challenges you will have is "if" you introduce new fish to the established system today. The paired up damsels will defend their nesting area and the new fish won't know its location or what to stay away from. Turning off the lights isn't going to help in this case because everything is set. If this makes sense.

I had 7 sapphire damsels in my 210 gallon display and while everything coexisted peacefully it was difficult to introduce new fish for the very reason I mentioned above. I would have to catch the breeding pair, move them to my refugium, introduce the new fish, wait a few weeks, then move the sapphires back to display. A lot of work.

The second problem will be that some fish by nature know there are eggs there which one of them is protecting so fisticuffs happen. The other fish says oh, look. Food. In most cases the squabble is over quickly. Sometimes it isn't and damage is done. One of my larger male sapphires and medium sized coral beauties went to town for about 3 days. In the end I couldn't catch and remove either which lead to the coral beauties death. The speed and angle of attacks by the sapphire was incredible to watch but what a hopeless felling.

One pair of spawning sapphires was fun to watch yet I never was able to rear. Well I didn't really try to be honest but it was fun to watch nature. Two spawning pairs, well, became too much. They dig, burrow, and defend. The mating dancing is disruptive to some of the more calm fish. In the end I had nest holes throughout my display and it made introducing new fish impossible. So I collected them all and gave them to a local hobbyist who had more room and was willing to take them all.

If you have a spawning pair and it is something you are interested in trying to raise I say go for it. It will just take a bit of planning and research to get the order of what needs to be done. I was going to try since mine used a rock area that was easy to remove. I just never followed up or had the time. Maybe in the future.

 

[MoshJosh]

One of the challenges you will have is "if" you introduce new fish to the established system today. The paired up damsels will defend their nesting area and the new fish won't know its location or what to stay away from. Turning off the lights isn't going to help in this case because everything is set. If this makes sense.

I had 7 sapphire damsels in my 210 gallon display and while everything coexisted peacefully it was difficult to introduce new fish for the very reason I mentioned above. I would have to catch the breeding pair, move them to my refugium, introduce the new fish, wait a few weeks, then move the sapphires back to display. A lot of work.

The second problem will be that some fish by nature know there are eggs there which one of them is protecting so fisticuffs happen. The other fish says oh, look. Food. In most cases the squabble is over quickly. Sometimes it isn't and damage is done. One of my larger male sapphires and medium sized coral beauties went to town for about 3 days. In the end I couldn't catch and remove either which lead to the coral beauties death. The speed and angle of attacks by the sapphire was incredible to watch but what a hopeless felling.

One pair of spawning sapphires was fun to watch yet I never was able to rear. Well I didn't really try to be honest but it was fun to watch nature. Two spawning pairs, well, became too much. They dig, burrow, and defend. The mating dancing is disruptive to some of the more calm fish. In the end I had nest holes throughout my display and it made introducing new fish impossible. So I collected them all and gave them to a local hobbyist who had more room and was willing to take them all.

If you have a spawning pair and it is something you are interested in trying to raise I say go for it. It will just take a bit of planning and research to get the order of what needs to be done. I was going to try since mine used a rock area that was easy to remove. I just never followed up or had the time. Maybe in the future.

Yeah I was thinking that, that no matter what fish I added the breeding pair would treat them the same as the other damsels. . . ie chase them into a corner. I was sort of blindly hoping I could get a tough enough fish that it could hold its own, but sounds like, in the case of your angel, it didn't really matter and they fought to the death. . .

Maybe I'll try to rear the fry.

Was thinking If I could wait until just before the eggs hatch I could turkey baster them out and put them in one of these

I am not sure the slits will be thin enough for damsel fry, however, I used these breeders for my rice fish and they could not fit through the slits.

 

[Crustaceon]

Damselfish. The natural way to get additional flow in your display.

 

[areefer01]

Yeah I was thinking that, that no matter what fish I added the breeding pair would treat them the same as the other damsels. . . ie chase them into a corner. I was sort of blindly hoping I could get a tough enough fish that it could hold its own, but sounds like, in the case of your angel, it didn't really matter and they fought to the death. . .

Maybe I'll try to rear the fry.

Was thinking If I could wait until just before the eggs hatch I could turkey baster them out and put them in one of these

I am not sure the slits will be thin enough for damsel fry, however, I used these breeders for my rice fish and they could not fit through the slits.

If it is something you are interested in I would maybe reach out to Biota (or others) and see if they have any recommendations they can share on how to manage moving or caring of new hatchlings. It couldn't hurt. In my opinion I think hobbyist who try this is next level stuff. Creating and caring for a display is one thing. Raising spawning fish is another. Not many hobbyist have this experience.

Whatever route you go - good luck. The fact that you have spawning damsels, or fish in general, means you are doing well.

 

[Timfish]

fair haha BUT STILL

think it's "worth" trying to actually breed them. My LFS sort of said they would want them if I could captive breed them. I don't necessarily mean monetarily. . . Like how challenging is this going to be haha

Rearing the fry should be pretty much the same process as clownfish but as I understand it the fry take a little longer than to settle out than clowns. You can get rotifers online so one possibility that might make it easier is to look into ordering them instead of raising them yourself, figure out a timeline to place multiple orders to have a constant supply for the larval stage.

 

[MoshJosh]

Rearing the fry should be pretty much the same process as clownfish but as I understand it the fry take a little longer than to settle out than clowns. You can get rotifers online so one possibility that might make it easier is to look into ordering them instead of raising them yourself, figure out a timeline to place multiple orders to have a constant supply for the larval stage.

If it is something you are interested in I would maybe reach out to Biota (or others) and see if they have any recommendations they can share on how to manage moving or caring of new hatchlings. It couldn't hurt. In my opinion I think hobbyist who try this is next level stuff. Creating and caring for a display is one thing. Raising spawning fish is another. Not many hobbyist have this experience.

Whatever route you go - good luck. The fact that you have spawning damsels, or fish in general, means you are doing well.

Maybe a dumb question, but I have only ever breed freshwater fish, will saltwater larva and fry eat tiny prepared foods (was thinking of trying coral foods as I have tons in various sizes), or will they only eat live foods?