Achieving Balance

[desertcelt]

Over my relatively short stint in this hobby(about 5 years), nothing has been more maddening than dosing two or three part. Since I received an Apex for Christmas last year I've been going on and off dosing mainly because I get wide swings in readings from day to day. Currently I'm trying again so I can improve the growth of SPS (which I've never been able to keep for very long) and get another clam or an elegance. Lately my Ca is above 500, Alk is around 7-8 and Mg is between 1320 and 1420. Any advice on getting things stable especially reducing the Ca which is concerning.
Tank is not heavily stocked with either fish or corals, and I do weekly water changes and have an ATO and use an RODI to make my own top off. I usually buy natural seawater from my LFS to do water changes.
Any help out there? Thanks

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

First question is which salt mix do you use for water changes, and how do the tank parameters compare to it?

Water changes are the main way that two parts do not appear to be balanced to the tank demand.

500 ppm calcium is no concern, and continued dosing of the two part to meet alk demand is a fine plan. Rarely is calcium "too high" unless you overdose. 550 ppm is fine.

You may not ever need to measure magnesium if you dose the 2/3 part as prescribed since it should maintain it and it moves VERY slowly. If you ever see a change of more than 1-2 ppm per day, it is likely test error, and usually it is less.

 

[GainesvilleReef]

Here is what I did. First I switched salts to regular IO. It mixed closer to what I wanted to run my tank at. Then I limited my water changes to no more than 10% at a time. If I needed to do a larger change I reduced the alk with HCL. I also switched to saturated kalk solution and I dosed that up until the max I can with the evaporation being the limiting factor. For my need above that I does 2 part equally always. All dosing is based on alk consumption and not CA. The test kits we have are not good enough to dial in CA. But the Alk test kits are good enough to dial in alkalinity. With Alk and Ca being consumed in a fixed ratio. The best way to control Ca is by managing the tanks Alk and dosing 2 part in equal amounts or saturated kalk with a dosing pump. I bolus dose mag and Ca every six months if necessary to make up any differences. On my tanks it is usually 50 ppm mag added and 10-20 ppm Ca.

I would just leave your Ca alone. It's not at a level to worry about.

 

[desertcelt]

First question is which salt mix do you use for water changes, and how do the tank parameters compare to it?

Water changes are the main way that two parts do not appear to be balanced to the tank demand.

500 ppm calcium is no concern, and continued dosing of the two part to meet alk demand is a fine plan. Rarely is calcium "too high" unless you overdose. 550 ppm is fine.

You may not ever need to measure magnesium if you dose the 2/3 part as prescribed since it should maintain it and it moves VERY slowly. If you ever see a change of more than 1-2 ppm per day, it is likely test error, and usually it is less.

Thank you for the information sir. I usually buy ocean water from LFS for water changes and only do 15 gal per week on a ~115 gal total water volume tank. I haven't tested that water in a long time and it is probably a good idea to do that once in awhile. Thank you again

 

[Anthony Wood]

Your dosing amount should match the amount that your corals are uptaking. If your Doser is dialed in correctly a WC shouldn't effect your water because the Doser is keeping levels the same from the last WC. This is why keeping the tank levels at the same as fresh SW for a WC reliviates a huge headache. Your water is from the ocean, so unless the store is bumping up the alk, cal and mag. Yes it'll be lower then what commercially bought salt mixes to but there is nothing wrong with that. Consistency is key! As long as your tank levels stay at the NSW levels and don't swing they will thrive.

So you may find you may be dosing to much. Do a WC them test every day for 7 days without doing a WC and test at the same time everyday. If your dosing to much your levels will rise and dosing to little your levels will drop. Adjust the dosage amount accordingly. Once you get the dosage amount dialed in your levels won't change no matter how many WC's you do. That's because the tank levels are already the same as the WC SW. So unless the levels of the NSW you are getting at the store are changing (it won't unless the store is adding something to it), or dosing amount is to much or to little you won't have swinging parameters.

To wrap up what I said, keep the tank levels at what the new WC water is i.e. don't try to maintain them higher, consistency is key (supports that levels don't need to be higher than NSW) and dial in your dosage amount. In the mean time don't worry about your levels being "high" just get your dosage amount dialed in by the tecnique I said above. Once that is dialed in your tank will naturally balance out all the levels by itself with no help from you.

 

[Anthony Wood]

Addition when dialing in your dosing amount it has to be over the course of 7 days because the tank levels may be changing so small that just 2-3 days you won't notice it in testing.

 

[desertcelt]

Your dosing amount should match the amount that your corals are uptaking. If your Doser is dialed in correctly a WC shouldn't effect your water because the Doser is keeping levels the same from the last WC. This is why keeping the tank levels at the same as fresh SW for a WC reliviates a huge headache. Your water is from the ocean, so unless the store is bumping up the alk, cal and mag. Yes it'll be lower then what commercially bought salt mixes to but there is nothing wrong with that. Consistency is key! As long as your tank levels stay at the NSW levels and don't swing they will thrive.

So you may find you may be dosing to much. Do a WC them test every day for 7 days without doing a WC and test at the same time everyday. If your dosing to much your levels will rise and dosing to little your levels will drop. Adjust the dosage amount accordingly. Once you get the dosage amount dialed in your levels won't change no matter how many WC's you do. That's because the tank levels are already the same as the WC SW. So unless the levels of the NSW you are getting at the store are changing (it won't unless the store is adding something to it), or dosing amount is to much or to little you won't have swinging parameters.

To wrap up what I said, keep the tank levels at what the new WC water is i.e. don't try to maintain them higher, consistency is key (supports that levels don't need to be higher than NSW) and dial in your dosage amount. In the mean time don't worry about your levels being "high" just get your dosage amount dialed in by the tecnique I said above. Once that is dialed in your tank will naturally balance out all the levels by itself with no help from you.

Very helpful Mr Wood, thank you!

 

[Untamedrose]

Thank you for the information sir. I usually buy ocean water from LFS for water changes and only do 15 gal per week on a ~115 gal total water volume tank. I haven't tested that water in a long time and it is probably a good idea to do that once in awhile. Thank you again

Thats your problem right there. Each batch of water will have different parameters, within a range of course but all kinds of things like weather, where exactly they got it from, how long its been there etc. Will change it up. Which is ok for a non dosing, fish only even a softy tank. Wanting to step up, it's not going to work. Whole other level.
IDK how you will ever be able to figure out your dosing measures....and Not knowing the levels are in the water your changing with is.

You say you have an ro/do unit....is it big enough to product the 15 gallons you need for a the WCs? I'd suggest making your own SW OR sticking to a tank plan where you dont have to worry about these "higher levels" as much.

 

[desertcelt]

Thats your problem right there. Each batch of water will have different parameters, within a range of course but all kinds of things like weather, where exactly they got it from, how long its been there etc. Will change it up. Which is ok for a non dosing, fish only even a softy tank. Wanting to step up, it's not going to work. Whole other level.
IDK how you will ever be able to figure out your dosing measures....and Not knowing the levels are in the water your changing with is.

You say you have an ro/do unit....is it big enough to product the 15 gallons you need for a the WCs? I'd suggest making your own SW OR sticking to a tank plan where you dont have to worry about these "higher levels" as much.

I've gravitated towards the ocean water (http://www.catalinawater.com/) from the LFS only on assumption that it would benefit my tank inhabitants more than "synthetic" seawater. I have used multiple salt brands over the years and I've always gone back to Red Sea Coral Pro. My LFS uses it as well to mix their synthetic water. Frankly, I've found that buying, rather than making my own saltwater is more of a convenience. My RODI unit is 150 gal/day so I can make as much RODI water as I need.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

They may have cleaned up their water, but some tests of that Catalina water in the past showed substantial metals (e.g., lead), either from where they collect it, or tanks and plumbing they use(d)

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2004/9/aafeature

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2004/9/aafeature_album/Fig4_trace_elements.jpg