Acros/Montis dying

[djorijun]

I've had my tank for about 6 months now and my parameters are on point except for Nitrates, no matter what I do I can't seem to get those lower.

I've had several Acros seem to thrive and suddenly after about 2 weeks they begin to white out from the bottom up or brown out. I dip every single coral that comes into my tank and I feed coral frenzy every other day. I know this isn't the forum for it, but I had a Torch die and also a couple of acans, this was about a month ago. I just can't seem to get the sweet sweet color I see everyone else have.

Are the Nitrates too high?
Am I running too much flow or not enough flow?
Am I feeding too much or not enough?

NanoCube 28
AI Prime HD 10" above water line- Light settings attached, this number is at it's peak for about 3 hours then it ramps down.
2 Cobalt Powerhead returns
1 MP10 at 70% Reef Crest mode
Eshopps Nano Skimmer running the pump at half not full
Kalkwasser via ATO

Calc - 400 ppm
Mag - 1500 ppm
Alk - 9 dKH
Amo - 0 ppm
Nitrite - 0 ppm
Phos - 0 ppm
PH - 8.2
Nitrate - 10-15 ppm (it changes every week) I've tried Vodka dosing and it made no difference

 

[AllSignsPointToFish]

Any changes in salt used in the tank? When is the last time you cleaned your powerhead props?

 

[djorijun]

Forgot to post the salt. I get my salt from my trusted LFS and I test it before I use it to make sure the params are good and they are. Actually, I just cleaned the props on the powerheads about 3 weeks ago because there were snails stuck in them. How often should I be cleaning them?

 

[jda]

The parameters are fine - you could tweak them, but there is nothing in that range that will kill stuff.

Six month old tank is not all that easy - they are not stable yet. Have you been interfering with the tank by dosing organic carbon, using GFO or Lanthanum Chloride?

 

[tdileo]

Nitrates are definitely a little high, and phosphates shouldn’t be zero. Should be there but just barely. Also, your calcium is a bit lower than most people keep it but I don’t think it’s a problem.
High nitrates will cause the browning but I don’t believe it will kill them but my nitrates have never been that high.
How often do you do water changes and do you use RODI?

 

[Crabs McJones]

Are you using RO/DI water for your water changes and top offs? and if so what is the TDS of the water and when were the filters changed out last?

 

[AllSignsPointToFish]

Forgot to post the salt. I get my salt from my trusted LFS and I test it before I use it to make sure the params are good and they are. Actually, I just cleaned the props on the powerheads about 3 weeks ago because there were snails stuck in them. How often should I be cleaning them?

I usually clean mine when I have to increase the speed just to keep the water moving. A little organic buildup on the sharp edges can drastically effect the pumping efficiency.

 

[djorijun]

The parameters are fine - you could tweak them, but there is nothing in that range that will kill stuff.

Six month old tank is not all that easy - they are not stable yet. Have you been interfering with the tank by dosing organic carbon, using GFO or Lanthanum Chloride?

Not necessarily dosing but I do have a bag a purigen and a bag of ClearFX Carbon running in the rear baffles

Nitrates are definitely a little high, and phosphates shouldn’t be zero. Should be there but just barely. Also, your calcium is a bit lower than most people keep it but I don’t think it’s a problem.
High nitrates will cause the browning but I don’t believe it will kill them but my nitrates have never been that high.
How often do you do water changes and do you use RODI?

20% water change every Tuesday

Are you using RO/DI water for your water changes and top offs? and if so what is the TDS of the water and when were the filters changed out last?

I'm using RO/DI from my LFS and the TDS reads 000 ppm

 

[DSC reef]

I don't see any issues with your parameters, carbon dosing results don't happen over night. Sounds like you could have an issue with stability or swings. If your gonna carbon dose then be consistent and patient. Just because you've dipped doesn't mean pests aren't there. Could be an acclimation issue with lighting as well but I'm not an led guy so hopefully someone can help in that area.

 

[ihavecrabs]

I think your parameters look fine. While the nitrates may be a little high and could cause some acros to brown out a little, having them in too high a light can do the same also for newly introduced acros.

Note on the nitrates.. there are plenty of SPS gurus that rub higher than you have now. I think most range from 5-10 if they are not trying for zero.

Do you or a local club have a par meter available? Or maybe someone on the forum have measure on this light fixture before you could look up..

You may have had a swing at some point that did it as well. Temp or alkalinity is usually the culprit here.

 

[djorijun]

I think your parameters look fine. While the nitrates may be a little high and could cause some acros to brown out a little, having them in too high a light can do the same also for newly introduced acros.

Note on the nitrates.. there are plenty of SPS gurus that rub higher than you have now. I think most range from 5-10 if they are not trying for zero.

Do you or a local club have a par meter available? Or maybe someone on the forum have measure on this light fixture before you could look up..

You may have had a swing at some point that did it as well. Temp or alkalinity is usually the culprit here.

Besides water changes I wonder, what else can I do to lower it.

 

[Gweeds1980]

I've had the exact same issue, mine came from an accidental overdose of alk... do you see swings in alk?

The prime is a good light, but doubt it's causing acros to bleach, unless the LFS is keeping them under a vastly different par reading. Nitrates seem fine. Slight imbalance in mag, a little on the high side for the calc level, same with alk and ph. But as long as stable, shouldn't be the root cause.

My only thought would be an immature tank... so many things we don't test for and 6 months is still very young. I'd cut back the coral frenzy feeding as this will be contributing to the nitrates.

Only other thing is consider is an IPT test... it's possible the issue is something your not testing for... heavy metal contamination for example.

 

[ihavecrabs]

Besides water changes I wonder, what else can I do to lower it.

Feeding less and Wet skimming will help pull more out before it becomes NO3. However wayer changes would be best (matched temp, alk, and calc)

Carbon dosing or adding some bacteria would help but wouldn't be a quick fix.

What is your salinity at and how do you measure it? How stable is your temp?

 

[djorijun]

I've had the exact same issue, mine came from an accidental overdose of alk... do you see swings in alk?

The prime is a good light, but doubt it's causing acros to bleach, unless the LFS is keeping them under a vastly different par reading. Nitrates seem fine. Slight imbalance in mag, a little on the high side for the calc level, same with alk and ph. But as long as stable, shouldn't be the root cause.

My only thought would be an immature tank... so many things we don't test for and 6 months is still very young. I'd cut back the coral frenzy feeding as this will be contributing to the nitrates.

Only other thing is consider is an IPT test... it's possible the issue is something your not testing for... heavy metal contamination for example.

IPT test has not been done, but I will check on it. The LFS's I've purchased from either run LED or MH/T5. The age of my tank I've been told is pretty young. When would you say my tank would be a bit more mature.

Feeding less and Wet skimming will help pull more out before it becomes NO3. However wayer changes would be best (matched temp, alk, and calc)

Carbon dosing or adding some bacteria would help but wouldn't be a quick fix.

What is your salinity at and how do you measure it? How stable is your temp?

Salinity has been maintained at 1.026 and the temp is at a constant 78 degrees.

 

[Bouncingsoul39]

I've had my tank for about 6 months now and my parameters are on point except for Nitrates, no matter what I do I can't seem to get those lower.

I've had several Acros seem to thrive and suddenly after about 2 weeks they begin to white out from the bottom up or brown out. I dip every single coral that comes into my tank and I feed coral frenzy every other day. I know this isn't the forum for it, but I had a Torch die and also a couple of acans, this was about a month ago. I just can't seem to get the sweet sweet color I see everyone else have.

Are the Nitrates too high?
Am I running too much flow or not enough flow?
Am I feeding too much or not enough?

NanoCube 28
AI Prime HD 10" above water line- Light settings attached, this number is at it's peak for about 3 hours then it ramps down.
2 Cobalt Powerhead returns
1 MP10 at 70% Reef Crest mode
Eshopps Nano Skimmer running the pump at half not full
Kalkwasser via ATO

Calc - 400 ppm
Mag - 1500 ppm
Alk - 9 dKH
Amo - 0 ppm
Nitrite - 0 ppm
Phos - 0 ppm
PH - 8.2
Nitrate - 10-15 ppm (it changes every week) I've tried Vodka dosing and it made no difference

Most Hobby nitrate test kits are virtually useless. Only Red Sea and Nyos are proven to be semi accurate but they are still way off. So, yeah. If you followed the established method for carbon dosing for the amount of time it takes for it to kick in, it's nearly impossible to maintain that high of Nitrates, so yeah. Forget about Nitrates. That AI prime HD will not produce enough PAR to color up Acroporas, so yeah.

 

[Gweeds1980]

IPT test has not been done, but I will check on it. The LFS's I've purchased from either run LED or MH/T5. The age of my tank I've been told is pretty young. When would you say my tank would be a bit more mature.



Salinity has been maintained at 1.026 and the temp is at a constant 78 degrees.

Cool, I'd say 12 months really, but it largely depends how you started out... 'mature' I guess is a bit misleading, what we generally mean by this is that the 'war for nutrients' has been won by some bacteria dominating... up until this point the rate at which ammonia / nitrite / nitrate is converted fluctuates a lot... so if you started with dry rock and didn't seed with anything, it might take 3 yrs to be fully mature... if you started with fully LR then it'll be a lot quicker, say 12 months. Sorry, long winded way to say it depends on how you started / seeded / cycled!

Re the LFS lighting... bare in mind that no two leds are the same, with all the spectral and intensity options available, not to mention photoperiod. MH and T5 the same... generally LFS tend to run more blue and less intensity than at home... it's cheaper and gives more pop to the corals.

 

[Macdaddynick1]

I've had my tank for about 6 months now and my parameters are on point except for Nitrates, no matter what I do I can't seem to get those lower.

I've had several Acros seem to thrive and suddenly after about 2 weeks they begin to white out from the bottom up or brown out. I dip every single coral that comes into my tank and I feed coral frenzy every other day. I know this isn't the forum for it, but I had a Torch die and also a couple of acans, this was about a month ago. I just can't seem to get the sweet sweet color I see everyone else have.

Are the Nitrates too high?
Am I running too much flow or not enough flow?
Am I feeding too much or not enough?

NanoCube 28
AI Prime HD 10" above water line- Light settings attached, this number is at it's peak for about 3 hours then it ramps down.
2 Cobalt Powerhead returns
1 MP10 at 70% Reef Crest mode
Eshopps Nano Skimmer running the pump at half not full
Kalkwasser via ATO

Calc - 400 ppm
Mag - 1500 ppm
Alk - 9 dKH
Amo - 0 ppm
Nitrite - 0 ppm
Phos - 0 ppm
PH - 8.2
Nitrate - 10-15 ppm (it changes every week) I've tried Vodka dosing and it made no difference

Your po4 is too low. (0 po4 is usually not a problem in a more settled tanks, for example someone with a nice reef usually feeds their tank enough so that there is always some po4 avalible but it’s not staying in the water column long enough to accumulate, however in a newer tank 0 po4 usually means 0 po4) Also stop feeding reef frenzy and just feed your fish more mysis. 10-15 nitrates aren’t your problem but since you are doing water changes it should keep nitrates in line. Your tank is too new to broadcast feed so just feed the fish and layoff the reef frenzy.

 

[djorijun]

Most Hobby nitrate test kits are virtually useless. Only Red Sea and Nyos are proven to be semi accurate but they are still way off. So, yeah. If you followed the established method for carbon dosing for the amount of time it takes for it to kick in, it's nearly impossible to maintain that high of Nitrates, so yeah. Forget about Nitrates. That AI prime HD will not produce enough PAR to color up Acroporas, so yeah.

I considered buying a second AI Prime would that be overkill in this size cube? I also use the Red Sea kit.

Cool, I'd say 12 months really, but it largely depends how you started out... 'mature' I guess is a bit misleading, what we generally mean by this is that the 'war for nutrients' has been won by some bacteria dominating... up until this point the rate at which ammonia / nitrite / nitrate is converted fluctuates a lot... so if you started with dry rock and didn't seed with anything, it might take 3 yrs to be fully mature... if you started with fully LR then it'll be a lot quicker, say 12 months. Sorry, long winded way to say it depends on how you started / seeded / cycled!

Re the LFS lighting... bare in mind that no two leds are the same, with all the spectral and intensity options available, not to mention photoperiod. MH and T5 the same... generally LFS tend to run more blue and less intensity than at home... it's cheaper and gives more pop to the corals.

Not long winded at all, very helpful information. A bit of backstory, I started my tank 6 months ago with Real Reef Rock and a Red Sea seeding kit. It went through the entire "cycle" process and I followed the instructions everyday. I didn't add any fish until the seeding was complete and even then I waited two more weeks to make sure my numbers were staying in place.

Your po4 is too low. (0 po4 is usually not a problem in a more settled tanks, for example someone with a nice reef usually feeds their tank enough so that there is always some po4 avalible but it’s not staying in the water column long enough to accumulate, however in a newer tank 0 po4 usually means 0 po4) Also stop feeding reef frenzy and just feed your fish more mysis. 10-15 nitrates aren’t your problem but since you are doing water changes it should keep nitrates in line. Your tank is too new to broadcast feed so just feed the fish and layoff the reef frenzy.

Great info, what do you recommend in terms of raising the po4?

 

[Mattrg02]

I considered buying a second AI Prime would that be overkill in this size cube? I also use the Red Sea kit.



Not long winded at all, very helpful information. A bit of backstory, I started my tank 6 months ago with Real Reef Rock and a Red Sea seeding kit. It went through the entire "cycle" process and I followed the instructions everyday. I didn't add any fish until the seeding was complete and even then I waited two more weeks to make sure my numbers were staying in place.



Great info, what do you recommend in terms of raising the po4?

I'm keeping mine around 0.06ppm. I am using brightwell neophos everyday. I'll get home from work, check phosphates via Hanna, then dose accordingly. I've found that my tank kills phosphates within hours, so I've begun dosing in the morning, before work, as well.

Check your nitrates if your start dosing phosphates. I found that mine were rapidly used up once I got some phosphates going again. Don't let your phosphates get higher than your nitrates.

 

[Zagreus]

Tell me about your coral. Did you buy maricultured sps acros or tank raised frags?

When your torch started dying did it start getting lighter in color or whitening?

Is your saltwater from your LFS mixed with what salt? or is it ocean water?

Have you had any difficulties keeping fish?

What kind of ATO system do you have and have you ever had a water dump?

How often do you test and how do you test your KH?

What corals are surviving the best in your tank and how long have you had them?

Did you say you do 20% water changes weekly and you do not dose with anything except a bag of puregen and occasional carbon.