Adventures in keeping a sps reef

[Llorgon]

I have the yellow and kole tang. I think I am maxed out on tangs. Neither of them pick at the rocks much.

I will keep scrubbing and pulling stuff from the tank. Hopefully I can get it short enough for them to eat.

 

[Llorgon]

New snails and crabs have been in the tank for a few days and seem to be doing well.

I have been really focusing on the two top rocks for algae removal this week and I seem to be making some progress.

I have been looking into peroxide dipping euphyllia, everything says they handle it well. So I'm going to try that this weekend to get the algae off the frags.

 

[BAMatter]

New snails and crabs have been in the tank for a few days and seem to be doing well.

I have been really focusing on the two top rocks for algae removal this week and I seem to be making some progress.

I have been looking into peroxide dipping euphyllia, everything says they handle it well. So I'm going to try that this weekend to get the algae off the frags.

If you see snails on the sandbed or walls of the tank, place them directly back on the rocks. It does look like you’re making progress!

 

[Llorgon]

If you see snails on the sandbed or walls of the tank, place them directly back on the rocks. It does look like you’re making progress!

Good idea. I have been trying that. So far the astrea I got have been staying on the rocks.


I did another water change yesterday and sucked out a bunch of the algae and scrubbed the rocks. I'm definitely seeing progress. One of the trochus snails is even on the rocks today!

I tried a h2o2 dip on the euphyllia frags. I put them in a bucket of tank water and then added h2o2 until I saw bubbles and left them in there for 3 minutes. This morning, most are open a bit more than before, but I didn't succeed in killing off the algae. I think I will try a stronger dip later on this week and see if that will kill the algae.

My space invader pectina, which took a big hit still has algae at the dead parts, but is looking way more puffier than it has been.

On the downside, because there always has to be a downside, I can see small red dots on a bunch of my LPS. I'm guessing my original dip of the corals when I put them in the tank, didn't kill them all off. The guy I got these from said they could be red planaria. Hopefully if I do a h2o2 dip of all LPS it will get rid of these guys as well.

 

[BAMatter]

Can get a wrasse for the red planaria. My blue sided fairy keeps the tank free of them. My sump on the other hand is packed. Free food I suppose ?

 

[Llorgon]

Can get a wrasse for the red planaria. My blue sided fairy keeps the tank free of them. My sump on the other hand is packed. Free food I suppose ?

I was thinking of a wrasse. I just need one that doesn't sleep in the sand since I have a small sandbed.

Here's some shots of the tank after cleaning last night.

 

[BAMatter]

I was thinking of a wrasse. I just need one that doesn't sleep in the sand since I have a small sandbed.

Here's some shots of the tank after cleaning last night.

Looks much better… glad you’re seeing some results!

My wrasse doesn’t sleep in the sand. She has a cave, but doesn’t bury herself.

 

[Llorgon]

Looks much better… glad you’re seeing some results!

My wrasse doesn’t sleep in the sand. She has a cave, but doesn’t bury herself.

Thanks. Now if corals can start looking happier that would be great.... At least one pest algae is going away. Bubble algae is coming on the rocks though...

I knew not all wrasses sleep in the sand I just didn't know which those were. I'll have to look into those if they can be a natural way of keeping those flatwoms in check.

I did a test dip on a euphyllia last night in full h2o2 for 2 mins. No adverse effects that I saw last night, once lights come on I will check today and see how it's doing. Hopefully it killed all the algae.

 

[Llorgon]

Last night I did a test dip of one of the euphyllia. I dipped it in h2o2 for 2 mins. Got rid of most algae, but not all so far.

Before and after

 

[Llorgon]

I'm seeing good progress on getting the algae off the rocks and it doesn't seem to be growing back as fast and not growing back in some places.

I haven't seen the turbo snail or emerald crab since the second day they where in the tank. I'm hoping they turn up soon. I've been checking every night to see if I can find them. The cerith, astrea and trochus all seem to be doing well and I see the hermits from time to time. I'll probably order some more next week.

My 2 biggest issues right now seem to getting/keeping algae off the corals and trying to get my euphyllia happy again. The one euphyllia I did the 2 min h2o2 dip on is looking good algae wise, but still hasn't opened up. I'm wondering if part of the euphyllia problem is the low or seemingly low nutrients the tank has. They were 0 and 0.03ppm) when tested on Tuesday night.

I have noticed a bit of an uptick in alk and calcium consumption so hopefully that's a sign things are turning around!

 

[Llorgon]

While the tank is looking better than it was, the fact that corals aren't doing great and it still looks like crap is really getting to me.

I did another water change over the weekend. I have been making sure to match the alk of the new water to the tank water. During the water change I vacuumed more of the sand and sucked out as much algae as I could.

I also dipped all the euphyllia except the big one in h2o2 for 30s. Got rid of the algae, but mostly all the frags are still unhappy. This morning I noticed one head on my large euphyllia colony had completely died overnight.

I missed 2 days of rock scrubbing as things got busy and I can see the algae has come back significantly. So I guess the daily scrubbing is still needed.

I noticed one hermit has already killed on of the new astrea snails and is wearing it's shell even though I got a bunch of extra shells for them. I still haven't seen the emerald crab or turbo snail since they went in the tank. I assume the turbo snail has died. I found some tuxedo urchins, but I don't want to get one if, like the turbo won't eat the algae and have it die.

I still haven't added the gyre to the tank, not sure where the best place for it would be. I could move the octopulses to the one side or the back wall and have the gyre on the side?

As for positives with the tank, fish are doing well, I still have tons of little snails that come out at night. And my montipora has been getting it's colour coming back.

I'm going to try and rent a par meter from the little LFS just so I can get an accurate reading and rule out any lighting issues.

Other than that, I guess I stay the course and hope I don't lose all my euphyllia too...

 

[BAMatter]

Sorry if I’ve asked, but have you got a positive ID on the algae with a microscope? And what is your source water again? Was going to go back and try to read through but I’m easily distracted…

What’s your dosing schedule and feeding schedule?

Did you start with dry rock?

 

[Llorgon]

Sorry if I’ve asked, but have you got a positive ID on the algae with a microscope? And what is your source water again? Was going to go back and try to read through but I’m easily distracted…

What’s your dosing schedule and feeding schedule?

Did you start with dry rock?

No positive ID. I might take some when I go try and rent a par meter from the little LFS.

Water source is ro/di, last checked 2 weeks ago.

Dosing is 0.2ml alk and 1ml cal daily. I feed once a day. Judging from my recent test tonight nitrate and phosphate are too low (0 and 0.01ppm). So I will start feeding twice a day.

The problem is, with the low nutrients the algae comes off easy, but it could be why the euphyllia are so unhappy. I'm seeing more algae growth in the refugium so maybe it's time to try out some chaeto?

Yes, started with dry rock.

 

[BAMatter]

No positive ID. I might take some when I go try and rent a par meter from the little LFS.

Water source is ro/di, last checked 2 weeks ago.

Dosing is 0.2ml alk and 1ml cal daily. I feed once a day. Judging from my recent test tonight nitrate and phosphate are too low (0 and 0.01ppm). So I will start feeding twice a day.

The problem is, with the low nutrients the algae comes off easy, but it could be why the euphyllia are so unhappy. I'm seeing more algae growth in the refugium so maybe it's time to try out some chaeto?

Yes, started with dry rock.

Yea those nutrient levels are being sponged up by the algae. Personally I’d bring those up. The bacteria needed to outcompete the algae is being starved out. I know it sounds counterintuitive to bring numbers up during an algae issue but that is the course I’d take, course I did take actually. Yea things got worse before they got better, but the long term biome needs to be established. Have you been dosing live phyto, pods, etc? It also may be beneficial to find a very established system and buy some live rock from it and toss it in your sump. I’d also be looking into equipment issues. Maybe grab a TDS pen and check your RODI water to keep that reading honest as well. Just my $.02 obviously. I hope you’re able to make progress!

 

[Llorgon]

Yea those nutrient levels are being sponged up by the algae. Personally I’d bring those up. The bacteria needed to outcompete the algae is being starved out. I know it sounds counterintuitive to bring numbers up during an algae issue but that is the course I’d take, course I did take actually. Yea things got worse before they got better, but the long term biome needs to be established. Have you been dosing live phyto, pods, etc? It also may be beneficial to find a very established system and buy some live rock from it and toss it in your sump. I’d also be looking into equipment issues. Maybe grab a TDS pen and check your RODI water to keep that reading honest as well. Just my $.02 obviously. I hope you’re able to make progress!

This is where I am torn. Some people say bring nutrients up others say stop dosing all other stuff and lower nutrients. I have an easier time removing the algae when nutrients are low vs when I had them at 5 and 0.01ppm. The euphyllia looked like **** either way, but the montipora I have is now getting it's colour back.

But to answer your question, I added a 100gal seed pack of pods + rotifers near the beginning of oct and doesed live phyto for about a month and half or so. Other than the algae really sticking to the rocks/glass I didn't notice any changes to the tank. I also dosed MB7 and same thing, no real difference was seen in the 2 ish months I dosed that. But I have got rid of 95% of the cyano.

I have been thinking of the live rock as well. I did that for my 25g and I think it really did help. I've been keeping my eye out on the local forum, but nothing has come up for really established live rock. Mostly tank shutdowns of ones running for a year or less.

RODI is checked with my little cheap TDS pen about every 2 weeks. Filters switched as needed.

Progress is happening. There is less algae in the tank and much less cyano. I even had to turn on alk dosing again. But it's frustrating how each time I setup a tank it's the same thing, everything goes well for awhile then corals die, algae comes in and I am left with a tank that looks like crap. But usually by this time, I have to take the tank down for some reason and restart giving more false hope things will be different.

This is just more frustrating because my 25g tank which before this summer I could grow any corals in, even brought an almost dead montipora back to life, which is very new for me, got hit as well and I lost all SPS or anything encrusting, some acans and euphyllia. I just don't have the time to deal with 2 tanks going sideways!

 

[BAMatter]

Look at it this way… your tank needs bacteria and an established biome. This is what will consume nutrients. Long term is also what help keeps NO3 and PO4 in check. If you have a strong base of bacteria, it is what will consume the nutrients, along with what the corals will consume for their own growth as well. This bacteria is established in a few ways… established live rock, bottled bacteria, fish and food waste, etc. You started with dry rock which is the most sterile way of beginning what is otherwise the most complex environment we likely know of on this earth. It takes time, patience, and essentially is a battle ground for all these microorganisms to outcompete each other. If your biome isn’t diverse enough to outcompete the algae, then the algae will continue to win. Now, by adding pods, you’re adding life that consumes life, also more waste, and in turn more bacterial load. By adding live phyto, you’re adding more life and diversity, and also adding a food source for the pods. You can (and should) also feed more, and/or get more fish if you’re not packed, and also get that Tuxedo Urchin! Yes, all of these will increase PO4 and NO3. Yes, the algae will need to be manually removed on a constant basis. Yes, this is a long process that requires a lot of work and some wet hands a couple times a week. But- the excess PO4 and NO3 will be the fuel for your biome, and in turn will slowly start to outcompete the algae.

 

[BAMatter]

FWIW, I went through it… I was constantly pulling large Tupperware containers worth of algae. It was frustrating. I asked my LFS what to do and he told me, and then said “dont worth about high PO4 right now”… so I didn’t. And the algae eventually stopped coming back.

 

[Llorgon]

Look at it this way… your tank needs bacteria and an established biome. This is what will consume nutrients. Long term is also what help keeps NO3 and PO4 in check. If you have a strong base of bacteria, it is what will consume the nutrients, along with what the corals will consume for their own growth as well. This bacteria is established in a few ways… established live rock, bottled bacteria, fish and food waste, etc. You started with dry rock which is the most sterile way of beginning what is otherwise the most complex environment we likely know of on this earth. It takes time, patience, and essentially is a battle ground for all these microorganisms to outcompete each other. If your biome isn’t diverse enough to outcompete the algae, then the algae will continue to win. Now, by adding pods, you’re adding life that consumes life, also more waste, and in turn more bacterial load. By adding live phyto, you’re adding more life and diversity, and also adding a food source for the pods. You can (and should) also feed more, and/or get more fish if you’re not packed, and also get that Tuxedo Urchin! Yes, all of these will increase PO4 and NO3. Yes, the algae will need to be manually removed on a constant basis. Yes, this is a long process that requires a lot of work and some wet hands a couple times a week. But- the excess PO4 and NO3 will be the fuel for your biome, and in turn will slowly start to outcompete the algae.

I'm already scrubbing the rocks every night and changing filter floss every night as well. So hands in the tank isn't an issue. My only concern with raising nutrients is then the algae is dang near impossible to get off the rocks. When my nutrients were 5 and 0.1ppm it didn't pull off the rocks and scrubbing worked on parts I could really scrub hard on. Where as when they are low I can get large patches out fairly easily.

Did you run into this as well? Or does it eventually become easy to pull out?

 

[BAMatter]

I'm already scrubbing the rocks every night and changing filter floss every night as well. So hands in the tank isn't an issue. My only concern with raising nutrients is then the algae is dang near impossible to get off the rocks. When my nutrients were 5 and 0.1ppm it didn't pull off the rocks and scrubbing worked on parts I could really scrub hard on. Where as when they are low I can get large patches out fairly easily.

Did you run into this as well? Or does it eventually become easy to pull out?

I did not run into that in terms of keeping a mental note of how easy it was to remove when nutrients were high vs low, as I didn’t keep much mind on nutrient levels since the numbers were skewed anyways. I scrubbed algae once and it made the algae spread even more, I’m pretty sure you just spread the spores around and it allows them to take hold in new locations. Was a firm believer in just letting it grow and then when it was long enough to get a grip on with my fingers then I’d remove it. Probably once a week or so. Then I would just repeat that process. I also didn’t do any water changes, and allowed the nutrients in the tank feed the biome. I could tell when the algae started to weaken because clumps were coming up when I would pull it off the rocks.

 

[Llorgon]

so here's something interesting. For the last few days I have been feeding some pellets in the morning and frozen at night. I crab a small pinch of pellets, hold them under the water and let the powerheads blow them around and the fish eat them.

Since that is the only change recently, it would seem they make my skimmer go nuts! Like overflowing over the sides of the sump nuts. Even when set to the lowest it will go, it's still overflowing the skimmer cup within seconds.

Looking back, whenever I would go on vacation this summer I setup an auto feeder to go off once a day and every time I came back the skimmer had overflowed a crazy amount. It was weird, but I assumed it was just from me being away for a week and it overflowed. Seems like it may be the pellets?