AEFW correlation to pods present in a reef tank?

[hinovak]

Hey guys, I finnaly got the dreaded AEFW in my sps system...this was completely my fault for getting lax with dipping over time. I have over 70 Sps species in my tank, half of them are large colonies I have grown out. If you look at some of my previous started threads, you will see pictures of my tank. That being said, many people that are very sucessful in growing large amounts of acros have told me if you go long enough growing sps, there is a strong possibility you will eventually encounter them. I must admit, they are bad, but not as bad as I anticipated, I lost about 8 colonies, and with the help of flatworm stop most are slowly starting to recover, some were not affected at all. Enough with the blabbing. The interesting thing that the infestation correlated with, was the dosing of interceptor to kill red bugs. I am pretty sure flat worms have been present in my system for some time. Now that I know what to look for, it seems I have noticed very minor damage in years past, but nothing to cause any alarm. As soon as I dosed interceptor a couple times and completely killed of all traces of pods, is when the infestation began. I have talked to two more individuals that had experienced a AEFW infestation after treating for red bugs and killing off their entire pod population. Now this is completely speculation, as I have yet to have any scientific studies yet to try and confirm this theory, which I plan on doing. But I have a theory that there is a pod/microvert that is present in some reef systems that may be some sort of predator or parasite to AEFW. The reason behind my theory, is the obvious, that they presented their selves after the complete collapse of my pod/microvert population, and the fact that I am a check my prameters almost every other day. My tank has remained very stable for a long period of time. Some of my acros are six years old! And the honest truth, is I was an idiot and rarely ever dipped any of my corals, so I have a feeling I have had AEFW for years...none of my wrasses have recently died or fish that might have kept the population in check, so the only thing I can come up with, is that some microvert is a natural deterrent of flat worms. Now, please feel free to tell me I am an idiot, haha because I might be way off base with my theory....but if anywhere, r2r is the place to have an open discussion about this. Thanks guys!!

 

[TUSI]

I think you are on to something. My believe is that there is always a natural way of keeping a balance. The ocean don't get treated with any medication . Very interesting and thx for sharing

 

[hinovak]

I think you are on to something. My believe is that there is always a natural way of keeping a balance. The ocean don't get treated with any medication . Very interesting and thx for sharing

Thanks!! I would have just chalked it up as dumb luck, had I not talked with two other people that experienced this same phenomenon. Also, I have talked to some local fish store guys that are very well versed in growing acros, and they have expericed outbreaks in frag systems before, but never in their main sps display system. So it makes me feel as if their is something present in established reefs that keeps them in check. I think when people have horrible out breaks, it is probably triggered by some environmental trigger, such as a prameter is off that weakens the acros, or in my case, a collapse in a pod population. It's just very interesting.

 

[jgarza]

Maybe you should learn to dip your corals.. I see no correlation with them. It's coincidence!

 

[hinovak]

Maybe you should learn to dip your corals.. I see no correlation with them. It's coincidence!

Haha, whatever hillbilly!! You probably put them in my tank when I was not looking garza, because you are soooo jealous of my tanks acro awesomeness!! You know you just could not handle how many chicks I have picked up with my sps tank....they are soooo into it...haha

 

[TUSI]

Thanks!! I would have just chalked it up as dumb luck, had I not talked with two other people that experienced this same phenomenon. Also, I have talked to some local fish store guys that are very well versed in growing acros, and they have expericed outbreaks in frag systems before, but never in their main sps display system. So it makes me feel as if their is something present in established reefs that keeps them in check. I think when people have horrible out breaks, it is probably triggered by some environmental trigger, such as a prameter is off that weakens the acros, or in my case, a collapse in a pod population. It's just very interesting.

Agree with you 100% a mature tank will behave different. we have not figured out yet what is their predator that kill them. There are a lot of reefers that have them and never noticed until a possible infestation due to something that used to keep them in check. If it's a wrasse, shrimps, crabs etc. this theory is very interesting

 

[jgarza]

Haha, whatever hillbilly!! You probably put them in my tank when I was not looking garza, because you are soooo jealous of my tanks acro awesomeness!! You know you just could not handle how many chicks I have picked up with my sps tank....they are soooo into it...haha

Yes you caught me! I was just jealous of your insanely amazing sps system. Can you teach me your ways??

 

[hinovak]

You are like anakin skywalker, and I am pretty much yoda. You have so much to learn young skywalker, but yet you will ultimately join the dark side, and start bragging about some soft coral you bought, and how sps tanks are overrated...haha

 

[hinovak]

Haha, Jesus...how nerdy am I??? I just mixed Star Wars in with reef tanks...I'm am destined to die alone...

 

[Z Burn's Reefing]

Many have said this - there was even one hobbyist that even reintroduced red bugs back into his tank and found the effects of AEFW to be drastically reduced in addition to be rarely found during basting. I have had red bugs in my tank for some time, but have held off dosing interceptor as the correlation is just too strong. Btw, red bugs don't seem to be causing me too much trouble...

 

[hinovak]

Many have said this - there was even one hobbyist that even reintroduced red bugs back into his tank and found the effects of AEFW to be drastically reduced in addition to be rarely found during basting. I have had red bugs in my tank for some time, but have held off dosing interceptor as the correlation is just too strong. Btw, red bugs don't seem to be causing me too much trouble...

I hear you on that. The red bugs never really caused me much of an issue either, the only reason I dosed, was because I had 2 corals that the red bugs actually irritated enough to slow growth. They were smooth skin acros, the rest of my acros never seemed that affected by red bugs. I really think we might all be on to something here with this. The hard part, will be isolating individual microverts with an affected acropora, and seeing long term results...this would be so much easier if I owned a fish store to test...for all you guys that do own a fish store, this is a hint hint towards you guys!!

 

[trido]

I've lived with both for years and recently wiped out all the AEFW's and then took care of the red bug after they were gone. I personally believe the red bug compete for real estate on certain SPS which helps to keep the two populations in check with one another. I have definitely heard of exploding AEFW's populations after red bug treatments on many occasions

 

[hinovak]

So do you think it is actually the red bugs? That is interesting about competing against each other. The one thing I am sure of, is whatever it is, it can be killed by interceptor. And unfortunately, that does not narrow it down. What I wonder, do we think it is actually the red bugs competing for turf, or is it something that is being indirectly killed while dosing for red bugs..

 

[mic209]

I witnessed with my own eyes, an asternia star eat a cluster of AEFW eggs in my last tank. I'm wondering if the asternias kept the eggs in check, if the adults would of eventually died out? I didn't want to chance losing any Acros, so I ended up QT all my Acros and doing weekly dips for 8 weeks which got rid of them.

 

[ritter6788]

It's been brought up here and there but no hard evidence really. There are MANY mentions of aefw infestation after treating with interceptor for red bugs.


https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/correlation-between-red-bugs-and-acropora-eating-flatworms.147773/

Luckily we have Bayer dip now, solved all my sps pest problems. You really don't see the red bug posts as much as there used to be since Bayer dip started being used. Aefw eggs will survive a dip but ref bugs don't.

 

[Diesel]

Maybe this theory will help............ the use of interceptor might made the eggs hatch faster or the AEFW lay eggs faster.
For what ever it is my new acro's go through 8 week of Quarantine and Bayer dip process.
I'm a firm believer that most AEFW is making the rounds through vendors and LFS even hobbyist.
Of course there are Vendors that do dip as are LFS but most of them aren't going to sit on a acro order of $10.000 or more for 8 weeks to see if they are pest free.
I know these are harsh statements but the ultimate responsibility is by the end user to QT and treat everything that will enter the tank.

 

[hinovak]

Maybe this theory will help............ the use of interceptor might made the eggs hatch faster or the AEFW lay eggs faster.
For what ever it is my new acro's go through 8 week of Quarantine and Bayer dip process.
I'm a firm believer that most AEFW is making the rounds through vendors and LFS even hobbyist.
Of course there are Vendors that do dip as are LFS but most of them aren't going to sit on a acro order of $10.000 or more for 8 weeks to see if they are pest free.
I know these are harsh statements but the ultimate responsibility is by the end user to QT and treat everything that will enter the tank.

I completely agree, it's really no one fault but your own in the end. As you said, I think some people dip, and have the bad luck of getting eggs. I think the best deterrent of this would be to break off the base of the new acro as well as dip. Or, as you said quarantine. I really think some vendors, LFS, and hobbyist have had flat worms for years, but their tanks have been well maintained, and there is some critter that keeps them to manageable populations. It has been a month now since having them, I reintroduced microverts, and other than losing a few colonies. Most of my acros have rebounded and are starting to color up again.

 

[mic209]

I'm a firm believer that most AEFW is making the rounds through vendors and LFS even hobbyist.

Specially a lot of these "high end" vendors who are bringing in wild pieces, and chopping them up, I picked up a frag from reef raft once that was covered in AEFW bites.

 

[Diesel]

Specially a lot of these "high end" vendors who are bringing in wild pieces, and chopping them up, I picked up a frag from reef raft once that was covered in AEFW bites.

I don't think this is a place to categorize who or what but just in general.
I have seen pest too on corals but it never was a big deal as I just QT them and treated them accordingly.

 

[Endoz]

I've lived with both for years and recently wiped out all the AEFW's and then took care of the red bug after they were gone. I personally believe the red bug compete for real estate on certain SPS which helps to keep the two populations in check with one another. I have definitely heard of exploding AEFW's populations after red bug treatments on many occasions

@trido What was your protocol for getting rid of them?