Algae issues? Why dont more people use algae scrubbers?

[ScubaSkeets]

Running water horizontally over a screen at the surface will grow turf algae. I believe this is how early scrubber designs were back in the…80s? 90’s? I forget when, it was before my time in the hobby

Edit:the “horizontal river” style scrubbers were from the 1990’s into approx 2007

Ahhhh...just one more reason to like the 80s and 90s more!! Lol

Do you think I would benefit any if I added an air pump to my contraption by maybe placing tubing beneath the screen?

 

[feeduall]

Works amazing. Very easy maintenance clear water scrubber. Newest model.

 

[VintageReefer]

Ahhhh...just one more reason to like the 80s and 90s more!! Lol

Do you think I would benefit any if I added an air pump to my contraption by maybe placing tubing beneath the screen?

I don’t think it’s needed. There is air in the unit above the water and below the led and the unit is growing algae fine

For upflow scrubber styles the bubbles from air pump are needed to create water flow. For waterfall style, or horizontal style, water flow comes from water pumps and oxygen is from an area at and around the screen material

 

[Mikeltee]

I was kidding haha I will keep the skimmer in case I ever accidentally get something in water I need to skim out.

I did buy second scrubber but it is for a second tank

I have a 40g with no sump. I'm considering buying a Santa Monica HOB for it but using it in the main until the Phos is in check. I'll not sure which one to go with though. I wish he had had a way to configure the lights either with a potentiometer or seperate power supplies. That is why I went with the 2xxx as it has 2 power supplies.

I don't understand why he states the surf 2xxx is 2 Cubes a day and the surf 4 is 4 Cubes and the only difference is that one is 1" deeper.

I really like that one brand that had the potentiometer however it's a rainfall type. I love the simplicity of the air fed ones. Im not a fan of the $100 spent on the whisper AP 300 though. I was lucky to drag one for $40 on ebay.

 

[Mikeltee]

Thanks, but my tank is nowhere close to looking as great as some others on here

From what I gather, and others may chime in as I may have misunderstood, nuisance algae does not grow on top of coralline.


No offense, but I've always had an issue with that. Personally, I don't own a microscope and I don't know how many people actually do, and even if I did, I wouldn't know what I'd be looking for in the first place. Perhaps it's easier to figure out once you use one though?

I really enjoy viewing stuff through my microscope. I got my kids into microscopy. I culture pods and phyto and I get to verify that strains are not being contaminated. Lots of people suggest a $100 scope but I'm not a fan. I spent $300 on a Swift triocular and its really nice. Different dino strains require different measures to combat them. It is a necessary tool to giving yourself an edge in this hobby just like this thread has shown to be IMHO. $300 is the same as a few decent frags but it will last a lifetime unlike those frags usually. Lol

 

[VintageReefer]

I have a 40g with no sump. I'm considering buying a Santa Monica HOB for it but using it in the main until the Phos is in check. I'll not sure which one to go with though. I wish he had had a way to configure the lights either with a potentiometer or seperate power supplies. That is why I went with the 2xxx as it has 2 power supplies.

I don't understand why he states the surf 2xxx is 2 Cubes a day and the surf 4 is 4 Cubes and the only difference is that one is 1" deeper.

I really like that one brand that had the potentiometer however it's a rainfall type. I love the simplicity of the air fed ones. Im not a fan of the $100 spent on the whisper AP 300 though. I was lucky to drag one for $40 on ebay.

Surf 2xx - 6x8x3 = 144 cubic inches
Surf 4x - 8x10x4 = 320 cubic inches

As for air pump he finds a compatible pump and recommends it, but others can be used. As long as it meets minimum requirements for the surf. Surf 2xx needs dual outlet that can push 10 air stones. Or two single outlets that each push 5 air stones.

You got a great deal on your ap300. It also has lifetime warranty

And I agree also I like waterfall style but what sold me on the surf is the simplicity, no plumbing needed, no noise. One extra bonus of surf - in waterfall style if the pump dies, then algae is left without water flow and can die out. With the surf the unit is always under water - I had air pump die for about a month and didn’t realize, and my algae survived. Growth slowed of course but the culture remained alive.

 

[ScubaSkeets]

I really enjoy viewing stuff through my microscope. I got my kids into microscopy. I culture pods and phyto and I get to verify that strains are not being contaminated. Lots of people suggest a $100 scope but I'm not a fan. I spent $300 on a Swift triocular and its really nice. Different dino strains require different measures to combat them. It is a necessary tool to giving yourself an edge in this hobby just like this thread has shown to be IMHO. $300 is the same as a few decent frags but it will last a lifetime unlike those frags usually. Lol

Absolutely! I would love to have a decent microscope, not just for reefing but so many other things as well.
I'm not dissing them. I just wondering out loud how many people actually have one and personally knowing what I'm even looking for to distinguish different strains of algae. But like I said, perhaps it's easier than I assume.

 

[VintageReefer]

I’ve been researching microscopes extensively and have found one with over 5000 positive reviews and it’s not too pricy

https://a.co/d/gjDyEX0

 

[ScubaSkeets]

I’ve been researching microscopes extensively and have found one with over 5000 positive reviews and it’s not too pricy

https://a.co/d/gjDyEX0

Yes!! That's what I'm talking about!! But at $1999, it's a bit out of my price range. I am correct in assuming that the first "$19" is bigger than the second "99" is just a typo, right?

 

[BeanAnimal]

Mine arrived broken. Santa Monica told me that I am probably not going to need a skimmer so I sent it back and didn't ask for a replacement. I'll test his theory for a few months. It takes longer to rinse a skimmer cup than it does to pull out a hand full of algae.

They do different things. One is not a replacement for other, even if one or both can be arguably omitted from a system, depending on other aspects of the environment and husbandry. As I eluded to above, I think SM makes nice scrubbers and he also makes up his own science as he goes. Your mileage and opinion may vary.

Running water horizontally over a screen at the surface will grow turf algae. I believe this is how early scrubber designs were back in the…80s? 90’s? I forget when, it was before my time in the hobby

Edit:the “horizontal river” style scrubbers were from the 1990’s into approx 2007

This the the Dr. Walter Adey design and very effective at growing turf. He does explain why the turf algae are chosen instead of other variants like GHA. I would suggest reading some of his work. You can find it at his Smithsonian about page.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Thanks. However, my DIY "algae remover" does not use any air source and the screen is indeed fully submerged, albeit only 1/4 - 1/2" below the surface of the water.

Then you are just growing algae in another tank. Albeit maybe with different flow, light and substrate. It is not right or wrong but it is a bit different than a waterfall or tray stye ATS where the substrate is in open air with water moving over it and therefore will have a different growth pattern and algae population.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Works amazing. Very easy maintenance clear water scrubber. Newest model.

Don't give a hoot about your scrubber... but am loving the mangrove. I wanted to put a series of similar mangrove planters on the home theater side of the fishroom wall... the warden said NO.... and I mean it was a firm NO. So never revisited the idea. Can you post some details about the age, flow and care?

 

[BeanAnimal]

Yes!! That's what I'm talking about!! But at $1999, it's a bit out of my price range. I am correct in assuming that the first "$19" is bigger than the second "99" is just a typo, right?

fleabay is full of AmScope stereo scopes, cheap digital scopes and quality vintage AO smith school and lab scopes. You can get an high quality setup for $200 or less and get what used to be a $4000 or setup for $400 or so.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Bro that method is INSANE! I think I'll let it occur naturally.

I have tremendous experience with LaCl and would not likely ever use it again. While many people have success and feel that it is safe, my experience is that is deadly for Zebrasoma tangs if you don't ensure every last bit of LaCl is reacted before it gets into the display. From what I can tell the precipitate attaches at their gill plate and possibly lateral line. My tangs ended up with gill damage, open sores where the slime coat was gone, etc. This was observable on repeated occasions and corresponded directly with the dosing regimens.

 

[BeanAnimal]

I don't understand why he states the surf 2xxx is 2 Cubes a day and the surf 4 is 4 Cubes and the only difference is that one is 1" deeper.

My honest suggestion is to ignore the "cubes per day" marketing on any system. It is such an arbitrary number ad there are dozens of variables. The contents of the "cube", the system volume, the phosphate levels, flow, substrate, chemistry, etc. It is just marketing nonsense.

 

[VintageReefer]

This the the Dr. Walter Adey design and very effective at growing turf. He does explain why the turf algae are chosen instead of other variants like GHA. I would suggest reading some of his work. You can find it at his Smithsonian about page.

I did, many years ago. Was too busy when I posted to reference further details, and didn’t feel a need to, I was only mentioning the general concept

 

[VintageReefer]

My honest suggestion is to ignore the "cubes per day" marketing on any system. It is such an arbitrary number ad there are dozens of variables. The contents of the "cube", the system volume, the phosphate levels, flow, substrate, chemistry, etc. It is just marketing nonsense.

It’s an average. And he does have adjustments to his recommendations for high or low phosphate levels, amount of rock, etc. Yes he made it up but in general he knows what his models are capable of, and came up with a formula that puts things in simple terms so customers can be guided to an appropriate model. It’s not an exact science, it’s a estimate.

IE: if you feed this much a day and have this much problem rock and your phosphate is below x, then this model scrubber would be appropriate for your system.

I see it as an estimate and other products use their own methods / guesses to help guide consumers. Like for skimmers - they will say it’s for this size tank if you are stocked light, this size tank for stocked medium, this size tank for stocked heavy. Who defines the cutoffs between low/medium/high stock? It’s estimates and I’m sure every brand has their own math and reasoning behind their estimates and the consumers that know their system can decide for themselves what their system is like and then are guided to an appropriate model

 

[Garf]

My honest suggestion is to ignore the "cubes per day" marketing on any system. It is such an arbitrary number ad there are dozens of variables. The contents of the "cube", the system volume, the phosphate levels, flow, substrate, chemistry, etc. It is just marketing nonsense.

This is lanthanum reacted with phosphate outside of the aquarium, from a phosphate bound calcium carbonate substrate. Lots of folk think they skim or filter it out, I’m not so sure they do. This is a couple of weeks worth of lanthanum phosphate from a 60g cube, medium stocking (I’d say);

 

[BeanAnimal]

My argument is not with you and no amount of explanation would change my advice to ignore the made up metric or the pages of made up other stuff that accompanies it, even if the scrubbers scrub amazingly and the customer support is wonderful.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Lots of folk think they skim or filter it out, I’m not so sure they do.

I don't want to derail this thread anymore than it has been... but that is my position and experience as well.

I tried every dosing and filtration method that one could imagine. At one point I had basically an IV type setup dripping at an extremely low rate into 3 nested progressively higher micron socks at the intake of the 6' counter current skimmer with another sock at the outflow. I still almost killed the Scopas tang (now ~12+ years old) that is still with me.