Algae Scrubber Vs Refugium -- Do you have a Nitrates issue?
- Thread starter zemuss
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jedimasterben
Bubble coral sting good
630nm is close, but not really where it should be optimally. I just looked at some the other day that had a 6:1 ratio of 660nm to 450nm. 450nm is really optional, but difference in growth and 'puffiness' of the algae is significant, and it should definitely be included.
How much do you plan on feeding?
How much do you plan on feeding?
OP
OP
I feed three times a week.
So a 6 : 1 ratio would require me to build the unit. Darn I haven't even got my LED light done yet. Need to kick it into high gear and finish these projects.
So a 6 : 1 ratio would require me to build the unit. Darn I haven't even got my LED light done yet. Need to kick it into high gear and finish these projects.
jedimasterben
Bubble coral sting good
Nah, you can find PAR38 bulbs that have basically that same ratio, give or take a little bit.
Algae scrubbers won't really work if you feed sparsely. The smallest of scrubbers (12 square inches) lit on both sides can handle the equivalent nutrients of a single cube of food given daily.
Algae scrubbers won't really work if you feed sparsely. The smallest of scrubbers (12 square inches) lit on both sides can handle the equivalent nutrients of a single cube of food given daily.
OP
OP
Well currently I am feeding small because I don't want to raise nutrients. This is the problem I am trying to resolve with this discussion. If you have a PAR 38 bulb to recommend I am open to that. However i might go the route of building because I found that par 38 I bought had a flaw with the heat dissipation. Basically it almost gave me blisters from touching and shouldn't have gotten that hot. So i am steering clear of lamps.
I get mostly cyano growth on my ATS than Hair Algae. FWIW.
I get mostly cyano growth on my ATS than Hair Algae. FWIW.
jedimasterben
Bubble coral sting good
Here are two PAR38 bulbs: Amazon.com: ABI 12W PAR38 High Power Red & Blue LED Grow Light 660nm RED and 450 nm Blue: Patio, Lawn & Garden and E27 9x3 27W PAR38 LED Plant Grow Light Red Blue Flowering Hydroponics Lamp | eBayall PAR38 bulbs are going to be about the same. Do you not have any ventilation in your stand? There needs to be some kind of airflow over the heatsink.
Building your own is the best bet. Best setup would be a pair of 6" MakersLED heatsinks, each having 4x 660nm and 1x 450nm Luxeon Rebels. That should be good for around 1.5 cubes daily if lit for 9 hours.
Building your own is the best bet. Best setup would be a pair of 6" MakersLED heatsinks, each having 4x 660nm and 1x 450nm Luxeon Rebels. That should be good for around 1.5 cubes daily if lit for 9 hours.
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OP
OP
I am currently working on a 18 X 6 hour schedule. My lights come on at 12 AM and go off at 6 PM.
I am about to place an order for the Makers Controller and three of the Makers Drivers. I will be purchasing two maker six inch heat sinks with 8 660 nm and 2 450 Luxeon Rebels. Hey nothing is cheap I guess.
I am about to place an order for the Makers Controller and three of the Makers Drivers. I will be purchasing two maker six inch heat sinks with 8 660 nm and 2 450 Luxeon Rebels. Hey nothing is cheap I guess.
SchnitzelReef
Valuable Member
I've been running caulerpa in my fuge for a year. I also have chaeto in there as well. I would say the caulerpa grows about 10-20x faster then chaeto. It's insane how fast it grows. I've never had an issue with it going asexual and growing in my tank. It's not like Aptasia, where one day ur whole tank is covered in caulerpa. Even if that were to happen, it would be very easy to remove by hand.
My fuge is about 20 gallons. My display is 180g. If I had to do it over again, I would have made my sump alot bigger and made the fuge twice as big. It gets full every 3-4 weeks. I mean so full, that when I prune it, it fills up a plastic grocery bag. And that's still leaving a good amount in the fuge to keep growing. Caulerpa def likes attaching to things, so I keep a few rocks in my fuge
My fuge is about 20 gallons. My display is 180g. If I had to do it over again, I would have made my sump alot bigger and made the fuge twice as big. It gets full every 3-4 weeks. I mean so full, that when I prune it, it fills up a plastic grocery bag. And that's still leaving a good amount in the fuge to keep growing. Caulerpa def likes attaching to things, so I keep a few rocks in my fuge
SchnitzelReef
Valuable Member
I'm running a DIY led over my fuge. 10-6500k bridgelux, 1-660nm red and 1-royal blue. (I had the red and blue laying around from a previous build so I threw them in. If/when I decide to rebuild it, I will be using 4500k whites mixed with 660reds.
jedimasterben
Bubble coral sting good
What do you need those for? If you're just running a scrubber, no controller, and use 2x bare LDD-700 and the smallest 48v power supply.
Rebels have much higher output and higher quality with the deep red (tested by me about 50% higher, using a bit less power), and the royal blue is about the same output, but cheaper.
If you want to keep the 18 hour schedule, then cut the LEDs in half. An 18 hour schedule with 4:1 at full power would start dying very quickly if you don't double your feeding versus having them on for nine hours.
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Palting
Active Member
I use a dedicated remote refugium plumbed into the sump, and have been doing so for over 3 years now. Nitrates/phopshates are undetectable, and I have no algae issues in the DT. I cannot compare with a turf scrubber since I have no experience with that, but I can tell you of my refugium opinions.
IMO, a refugium needs to be at least 10% of the DT volume to be effective for nitrate export. I have a 20 gallon refugium for the 150 DT.
IMO, contrary to a lot I've heard, I use high flow. 600 gph flow, so turnover is 30X in mine. The idea is to present as much water to the refugium in any given amount of time, so that the plants are always extracting something.
I keep the lights on 20/24. I can do 24 all the time, but I also like to give any pods growing a period of darkness.
I use Caulerpa racemosa. Very fast growing, very hardy, easy to trim down. I trim it down to a flat bush and the sucker just keeps growing back, eating up the nitrates and phosphates as it does so. I have tangs in the DT, so I feed some of the trimmings to the DT.
It works for me. Don't know if the ATS is better or worse, but if it ain't broke, I ain't fixing it.
20 gallon refugium sitting beside the sump inside the cabinet:
Caulerpa forest, probably time to trim;
IMO, a refugium needs to be at least 10% of the DT volume to be effective for nitrate export. I have a 20 gallon refugium for the 150 DT.
IMO, contrary to a lot I've heard, I use high flow. 600 gph flow, so turnover is 30X in mine. The idea is to present as much water to the refugium in any given amount of time, so that the plants are always extracting something.
I keep the lights on 20/24. I can do 24 all the time, but I also like to give any pods growing a period of darkness.
I use Caulerpa racemosa. Very fast growing, very hardy, easy to trim down. I trim it down to a flat bush and the sucker just keeps growing back, eating up the nitrates and phosphates as it does so. I have tangs in the DT, so I feed some of the trimmings to the DT.
It works for me. Don't know if the ATS is better or worse, but if it ain't broke, I ain't fixing it.
20 gallon refugium sitting beside the sump inside the cabinet:
Caulerpa forest, probably time to trim;
OP
OP
Jedi.. The Controller and two of the drivers would be to finish off my LED light for the tank. The third driver would power the Lights for the scrubber.
Over kill? I have a Druino based board at home which would be used primarly for dimming. Just trying to get both build done quick.
Ok so the best place to buy the Rebels is StevesLEds correct?
Over kill? I have a Druino based board at home which would be used primarly for dimming. Just trying to get both build done quick.
Ok so the best place to buy the Rebels is StevesLEds correct?
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OP
OP
Only problem with Caulerpa racemosa is the potential of it going sexual. IE turning white and dying off. Majority of what I have found is people running lights 24/7 on the refugium to prevent this.
What other algae is fast growing consumes nutrients and doesn't go sexual? There has to be others beside Cheato.
However, I think most people run a ATS because once the hair algae seeds and starts to take over, it has the best potential to suck out the nutrients the fastest. Apparently it is the best for this issue and wonder if others feel the same way. Maybe this is what the ATS has been popular recently and because more people are spreading the word about the system and its benefits.
What other algae is fast growing consumes nutrients and doesn't go sexual? There has to be others beside Cheato.
However, I think most people run a ATS because once the hair algae seeds and starts to take over, it has the best potential to suck out the nutrients the fastest. Apparently it is the best for this issue and wonder if others feel the same way. Maybe this is what the ATS has been popular recently and because more people are spreading the word about the system and its benefits.
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jedimasterben
Bubble coral sting good
Hair algae uptake of dissolved nutrients is far and above any other macroalgae out there.
And as far as macroalgae producing spores to reproduce, as long as they are trimmed often enough to where it doesn't make the macro 'feel' too cramped, like it can't expand any more, it won't try any alternate methods of spreading
And as far as macroalgae producing spores to reproduce, as long as they are trimmed often enough to where it doesn't make the macro 'feel' too cramped, like it can't expand any more, it won't try any alternate methods of spreading
OP
OP
Jedi Ok I reviewed your setup again and am wondering why your using a plastic over the screen? Also, how is the screen setup? Is there a slot it fits in the pipe?
Thanks..
Thanks..
gmoney243
2500 Club Member
Heres mine
I use small pieces of cheap acrylic sitting on the lip of the sump to.prevent splashing that may occur. My whole tank is completely silent. In fact just about everyone who comes over is amazed at how quiet everything is. I imagine the film on jedi scrubber is to keep out splashing as well. I use 26w cfl bulbs and get amazing growth and phos stay at 0.00 on hanna checker. I recently added some biopellets to my system but for use as a coral food and it also competes against other bacteria such as slime algaes. The pellets also make it so that i dont have to clean my algae screens as often. Im using 2 8x8 screens on a 180 with 20+ fish.
I use small pieces of cheap acrylic sitting on the lip of the sump to.prevent splashing that may occur. My whole tank is completely silent. In fact just about everyone who comes over is amazed at how quiet everything is. I imagine the film on jedi scrubber is to keep out splashing as well. I use 26w cfl bulbs and get amazing growth and phos stay at 0.00 on hanna checker. I recently added some biopellets to my system but for use as a coral food and it also competes against other bacteria such as slime algaes. The pellets also make it so that i dont have to clean my algae screens as often. Im using 2 8x8 screens on a 180 with 20+ fish.
