Algae scrubber

[Robert D'Amaro]

So is it true that if you run an algae scrubber you don't have to do water changes?

Some even claim it makes the water too clean removing 100% of nitrate and phosphate.

Do you have one? Is this true?

 

[leepink23]

So is it true that if you run an algae scrubber you don't have to do water changes?

Some even claim it makes the water too clean removing 100% of nitrate and phosphate.

Do you have one? Is this true?

I have a scrubber, I think I could get away without water changes but it doesn’t feel right, lol. I am down to 2x a month. My nutrients stay low but not zero, but I feed a lot. Overall I am very happy with my scrubber.

 

[Orm Embar]

It depends on your perspective.

Algal filters, such as algae scrubbers/reactors/Chaeto refugia, can certainly keep nitrates and phosphates down and, potentially, even too low depending on the tank setup. I run a Chaeto filled refugium as my primary filtration and my tank does very well with that. Skimmerless, although having a skimmer isn't a problem.

Partial water changes will still dilute any unwanted compounds and replace calcium/alkalinity/magnesium/trace elements. I don't know if anyone has done experiments on this, but as a general rule I've always read and been taught that regular partial water changes are simply a really good thing.

I will say that I do partial water changes far less than I feel that I should, and with Ca/alk/Mg/trace supplementation, my tank looks great except for some stubborn Valonia.

I strongly recommend some type of algae to filter reef tanks, as I think that a refugium with Chaeto is very simple, effective, and easy to maintain (sell, trade, or throw out some of the Chaeto when it gets too thick). I think of reactors and scrubbers as smaller versions of a refugium.

 

[lvsuckerfish]

I do not have one I will tomorrow I have to pick up some Acrylic to put one together. I have everything else I need.

I do not really do water changes now I also only been up and running for 4 months or so. I have done one water change in that time.

I do have a Chaeto reactor and also Skimmer But I run a Equipment Sump 95% equipment and some Spiral octagons for filtration.

I have been reading a lot about ATS's I love the concept and relative ease of use. A lot of good info on this site about it also.

I have always ran Chaeto in a refugium but it is space consuming. Which IMO a good and Bad thing Good as you have More water volume bad as you have less space.

 

[Turbo's Aquatics Verified Sponsor]

You can, the question is - should you?

This decision is highly dependent on your system. If you have a scrubber that keeps the nutrients where you want them, then obviously you don't need to do water changes for purposes of nutrient reduction. However there are other reasons to perform water changes, depending on your livestock. Some may stay healthier with regular water changes. Others may be just fine with none.

I attended a presentation by Bob Fenner a few years back where he discussed this issue. One thing that happens when you stop water changes is that all of your tank livestock (both fish and corals, but his topic in particular concerned corals) was that everything will get used to the "soup that it is in". Now, if you try to introduce anything new, it's likelihood of survival diminishes. This has to do with chemical warfare, essentially. Everything gets used to each other and there is balance. Changing the water occasionally upsets this balance a bit (for lack of a better way to put it).

His presentation also was about acclimating corals to a new tank by keeping them in a QT and then transferring water between the 2 tanks to allow the corals in each system "get used to" each other so when the new corals were placed in the tank, the chemical warfare would not be an issue (or as much of an issue). So by using that method, theoretically you could do no water changes and still be able to introduce new corals to the "soup"

For the record, I have 2 tanks I maintain (mine and one in an office in town) and I can't recall the last time I even mixed salt. If I had the time, I'd do some regular water changes. I just stay too dang busy....it's not LARS ;Drowning

 

[ScottR]

If you plan on skipping water changes all together - and you have a reef tank - you’ll need to dose obviously. Even having inverts will suck some of those minerals out of the water.

 

[Matt Carden]

You can, the question is - should you?

This decision is highly dependent on your system. If you have a scrubber that keeps the nutrients where you want them, then obviously you don't need to do water changes for purposes of nutrient reduction. However there are other reasons to perform water changes, depending on your livestock. Some may stay healthier with regular water changes. Others may be just fine with none.

I attended a presentation by Bob Fenner a few years back where he discussed this issue. One thing that happens when you stop water changes is that all of your tank livestock (both fish and corals, but his topic in particular concerned corals) was that everything will get used to the "soup that it is in". Now, if you try to introduce anything new, it's likelihood of survival diminishes. This has to do with chemical warfare, essentially. Everything gets used to each other and there is balance. Changing the water occasionally upsets this balance a bit (for lack of a better way to put it).

His presentation also was about acclimating corals to a new tank by keeping them in a QT and then transferring water between the 2 tanks to allow the corals in each system "get used to" each other so when the new corals were placed in the tank, the chemical warfare would not be an issue (or as much of an issue). So by using that method, theoretically you could do no water changes and still be able to introduce new corals to the "soup"

For the record, I have 2 tanks I maintain (mine and one in an office in town) and I can't recall the last time I even mixed salt. If I had the time, I'd do some regular water changes. I just stay too dang busy....it's not LARS ;Drowning

This is the first time I've seen this side of the debate of "water change or no water change" . I'll have to look into this. My intention when setting up this tank was to go no water change. I have done maybe 5 - 20% water changes in the last 4 months. The tank is 7 months old. I run a fuge with micro growing wherever and some macro but all macros are dead now.

 

[ScottR]

This is the first time I've seen this side of the debate of "water change or no water change" . I'll have to look into this. My intention when setting up this tank was to go no water change. I have done maybe 5 - 20% water changes in the last 4 months. The tank is 7 months old. I run a fuge with micro growing wherever and some macro but all macros are dead now.

Many of us think about water changes as taking out the bad stuff. But we should always be thinking about water changes as adding back in, the good stuff.

 

[Turbo's Aquatics Verified Sponsor]

This is the first time I've seen this side of the debate of "water change or no water change"

Yeah I really need to document all this random knowledge I've been hoarding

 

[vetteguy53081]

Ive had a scrubber for well over a year now, I would not say no water changes but you can sure prolong them

 

[Robert D'Amaro]

Wow
Great discussion. It would be great if more would sound out. I know 90% of you would say you MUST do REGULAR water changes.
In the next month or so I will be setting up my dream tank. I plan on having a mixed reef and moderate bio load. I will be running a skimmer along with a ATS. I plan on getting away with a 20% WC about twice a year. And probably dosing ca, allk, and trace as needed probably in about (hopfully) a year when corals demand it.
I am in the early set up stage. Working on the "fish room/water making" station in the garage BEFORE setting up a tank to be ready for anything.

I will probably start a build post soon. We'll see.

Thanks for the great replies.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Wow
Great discussion. It would be great if more would sound out. I know 90% of you would say you MUST do REGULAR water changes.
In the next month or so I will be setting up my dream tank. I plan on having a mixed reef and moderate bio load. I will be running a skimmer along with a ATS. I plan on getting away with a 20% WC about twice a year. And probably dosing ca, allk, and trace as needed probably in about (hopfully) a year when corals demand it.
I am in the early set up stage. Working on the "fish room/water making" station in the garage BEFORE setting up a tank to be ready for anything.

I will probably start a build post soon. We'll see.

Thanks for the great replies.

A while back we had a topic on Dream Tank. What is your dream tank?
Mine would be a 2000+ gallons that I could put on a snorkel and dive into and do my maintenance

 

[Robert D'Amaro]

Made my first purchase this afternoon. Going to start a build thread in the right forum tonight.
Nothing major for dream tank. Obviously if money was no object this might be different but with what I have to work with and can aford without breaking the bank. This is what I am going for.
Starting with and maybe most important a dedicated water making station in my garage with a dedicated rodin unit newly plumbed utility sink and storage tanks for both rodin and salt water. Finally at this station a on demand exterior pump to get water from these tanks to display in living room.

I'll get into tank specifics on my build post. See you there.

 

[charlieborg]

Well I was using a scrubbier and stoped because I have a good skimmer , I use filter socks, and use Cheeto. Well I noticed after just two or so weeks I was getting an algae bloom in my tank. So I started it back up this week.
I guess I’m still over feeding. I have 6 clowns, one small blue tang, peppermint shrimp, cleaner shrimp, and several corals with 4 Rainbow BTA’s.

I do about a 15% ever other week. I don’t dose except lime in my top off water.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Well I was using a scrubbier and stoped because I have a good skimmer , I use filter socks, and use Cheeto. Well I noticed after just two or so weeks I was getting an algae bloom in my tank. So I started it back up this week.
I guess I’m still over feeding. I have 6 clowns, one small blue tang, peppermint shrimp, cleaner shrimp, and several corals with 4 Rainbow BTA’s.

I do about a 15% ever other week. I don’t dose except lime in my top off water.

I run both and will continue to run both

 

[farmhand]

I was planning a ATS only system, but my LFS convinced me I needed a skimmer, and that Algae Scrubbers didn’t work, so I purchased a skimmer. Now I’m thinking I shouldn’t have listened and struck with my original plan. Planning on buying a Santa Monica scrubber since I have plenty of compressed air in my fish room. Hoping using both will work. Just dial them back and maybe dose nitrate and phosphate. I have plenty of experience growing plants, er algae .

I run both and will continue to run both