Alk way too high

Randy Holmes-Farley · Oct 21, 2023

As mentioned, burnt tips comes from high alk and low nutrients. High alk and high nutrients does not appear to have the same issue.

Miami Reef · Oct 21, 2023

Randy Holmes-Farley said:
As mentioned, burnt tips comes from high alk and low nutrients. High alk and high nutrients does not appear to have the same issue.

Can high alkalinity (about 12-13dKH) cause trachyphyllia corals to retract?

Not my photo:

Lavey29 · Oct 21, 2023

Spare time said:
Also, 14KH wouldn't kill all your SPS.

The elevated level would kill SPS if it rose quickly over a 24 hour period such as when his doser failed. Over 1 DKH up or down can really stress SPS. Combined with his stated very low nutrients levels and corals will have problems with alk at that level.

noah.tank3 · Oct 21, 2023

EricR said:
If you're still trying to lower alkalinity, one option is use Sodium Bisulfate in new saltwater mix to achieve really LOW alkalinity in the new water, then do small water changes.
*I won't comment on how much to lower alk and how fast is safe, but I've been using <0.1 dKH new water with tank drops around 0.25 dKH (occasionally more) with no negative effects ... but I have no SPS, only soft corals.

Here's one of Randy's threads on using Sodium Bisulfate in case of interest:

Sodium Bisulfate to Reduce Alkalinity

Thank you!!!

noah.tank3 · Oct 21, 2023

gbroadbridge said:
If you're saying your Alk went from around 11 to 14 when the doser went nuts, in itself that would not kill Acros overnight.

The combination of High Alk (even at 11) and low nutrients (you mentioned basically zero) - would over time starve them to death.

If your Alk previously was 11, your nutrients should have been much higher.

I don't think this is an overnight problem - you probably simply noticed the problemndue to the Alk spike.

I would not make any rapid adjustments to the Alk.

Hello, my alk went from 9 to 14 within a span of 3 days because I had my water tested 3 days before and it was 9. Took it to the store 3 days later and it was 14. My nutrients are super low and I’m trying hard to bring them up but they will not I have even completely turned off my skimmer.

noah.tank3 · Oct 21, 2023

Randy Holmes-Farley said:
As mentioned, burnt tips comes from high alk and low nutrients. High alk and high nutrients does not appear to have the same issue.

My mixing container is a 50 gallon drum. How much muriatic acid/ sodium bisulfate should I put in a new batch of salt?

hexcolor reef · Oct 21, 2023

here's what you can do to lower Alk safely

dilute it with RO water, set up a drip system into your sump and allow it the RO water to run for 24hrs. get a quart size container and fill it with water and a lot of reef salt so its above 100ppm. when the salinity in your tank drops 1ppm add a turkey baser full of high salinity water to the sump. after 24hrs your Alk should drop down to 12kh, continue until your Alk is back to your normal levels

before you do this stop whatever it is your dosing

Randy Holmes-Farley · Oct 21, 2023

noah.tank3 said:
Hello, my alk went from 9 to 14 within a span of 3 days because I had my water tested 3 days before and it was 9. Took it to the store 3 days later and it was 14. My nutrients are super low and I’m trying hard to bring them up but they will not I have even completely turned off my skimmer.

Are you sure one of those values was not an error?

Randy Holmes-Farley · Oct 21, 2023

noah.tank3 said:
My mixing container is a 50 gallon drum. How much muriatic acid/ sodium bisulfate should I put in a new batch of salt?

My recipe is here:

Sodium Bisulfate to Reduce Alkalinity in New Salt Water or in Display Tanks

I just want to record these calculations in their own thread to refer back to in other threads. When alkalinity is too high in new salt water or in a display tank, acid can be used to lower the alkalinity. You can easily use muriatic acid (hydrochloric acid), or sodium bifulfate (e.g...

www.reef2reef.com

Doctorgori · Oct 21, 2023

just my “drive by” 2 cents….
RC is some funky brown salt…honestly I’m a lil surprised it actually “improved” your bucket crud…
I’ve used both RC and IO for decades, not sure salt brand makes any dang difference whatsoever…
I’ve found corals deal “ok” with some small daily alkalinity swings, but I get nervous of over 1 dkh change/24hrs… ….personally I would just shut off the doser for a week or so or whatever and test daily till it drops naturally ….

Rick's Reviews · Oct 21, 2023

I've had high alk for years now, never been a problem in my aquarium, I can only assume tap water or salt.

Rick's Reviews · Oct 21, 2023

Chemicals... But hopefully not
Just my opinion

gbroadbridge · Oct 21, 2023

hexcolor reef said:
here's what you can do to lower Alk safely

dilute it with RO water, set up a drip system into your sump and allow it the RO water to run for 24hrs. get a quart size container and fill it with water and a lot of reef salt so its above 100ppm. when the salinity in your tank drops 1ppm add a turkey baser full of high salinity water to the sump. after 24hrs your Alk should drop down to 12kh, continue until your Alk is back to your normal levels

before you do this stop whatever it is your dosing

I'm not sure I understand exactly what you are proposing however it is plain wrong for several reasons.

The first of which is that you cannot create a super high salinity solution as various elements will precipitate out resulting in a very unbalanced chemical composition.

There are safe ways to drop Alk in a tank, the simplest of which is to simply perform water changes with a lower alkalinity salt mix.

Other methods such as adding an acid to drop Alkalinity of freshly mixed water prior to addition to the tank could also work, but are not necessary in this case.

Spare time · Oct 21, 2023

Lavey29 said:
The elevated level would kill SPS if it rose quickly over a 24 hour period such as when his doser failed. Over 1 DKH up or down can really stress SPS. Combined with his stated very low nutrients levels and corals will have problems with alk at that level.

I was just referring to the alk level itself, not the associated pH swing that seems to be the problem with big alk jumps. ULNS will have burnt tips at a high alk, but its not like it would wipe out the tank.

Lavey29 · Oct 21, 2023

Spare time said:
I was just referring to the alk level itself, not the associated pH swing that seems to be the problem with big alk jumps. ULNS will have burnt tips at a high alk, but its not like it would wipe out the tank.

An alk swing of over 1 DKH in 24 hours can kill off SPS quickly. I think most know this and even though it can not automatically mean it does consistently because other factors may play a role such as PH and some corals are just hardier then others too. Yes ULNS with high alk can burn tips and in and of itself is not automatically fatal to SPS either but anything outside of good stability can affect SPS in varying degrees but big swings seem to be the most common talked a out.

hexcolor reef · Oct 21, 2023

gbroadbridge said:
I'm not sure I understand exactly what you are proposing however it is plain wrong for several reasons.

The first of which is that you cannot create a super high salinity solution as various elements will precipitate out resulting in a very unbalanced chemical composition.

There are safe ways to drop Alk in a tank, the simplest of which is to simply perform water changes with a lower alkalinity salt mix.

Other methods such as adding an acid to drop Alkalinity of freshly mixed water prior to addition to the tank could also work, but are not necessary in this case.

What’s seems wrong to one works for someone who is willing to try.
I had high Alk issues my self and the only way to solve it was to dilute my tank water with RO water while keeping salinity balanced. And it worked. My chemistry is balanced nothing out of wack

Randy Holmes-Farley · Oct 22, 2023

hexcolor reef said:
What’s seems wrong to one works for someone who is willing to try.
I had high Alk issues my self and the only way to solve it was to dilute my tank water with RO water while keeping salinity balanced. And it worked. My chemistry is balanced nothing out of wack

I don’t understand what that means. How can you lower alk by diluting the seawater, and not lower salinity and everything in the water?

It sounds like you are just effectively performing water changes, which will lower alk if the new salt water is lower in alk. The whole ro water dilution and hypersaline add back seems an unnecessary complication that accomplishes nothing other than a water change.

jda · Oct 22, 2023

noah.tank3 said:
Kalk dosing pump fried

If you over dosed kalk enough to raise dKh by 3 in a short time, then your pH could have shot above 10. This is/was your issue.

hexcolor reef · Oct 22, 2023

Randy Holmes-Farley said:
I don’t understand what that means. How can you lower alk by diluting the seawater, and not lower salinity and everything in the water?

Of course salinity, calcium and Mg would be affected.

280ml of RO water/20gallons of salt water drops salinity by 1ppm. That would change calcium by 20ppm.
By adding back that salinity with 1 quart of water mixture with a salinity at 100ppm at a rate of 20ml it replenishes Calc,mg, sanity.

280ml of RO water diluting salt water /20 gallons every hour over an 8-24hr

It’s essentially mixing salt in another way with idea of diluting Alk. By using RO water first