Alk won't raise looking for suggestions

[clangx]

Hi All,

I have an 18 month old cade 1200 512 liter (135 gallon mixed reef.)
Up until now I have maintained stable parameters (Below)

Calc - 440
Mag - 1400
PH - 8.4
Alk - 8.5
Temp - 26
Sal - 34ppt
No3 - 10ppm
Po4 - 0.10ppm


I dose red sea foundation A,B & C products.
Calc - 15ml per day
Alk - 20ml per day
Mag - 25ml per day

I test regularly and adjust them as needed as the corals grow or add more etc.

My alkalinity has crashed to 5.8 in a couple of days, I decided to double up the red sea foundation B dosing (KH/ALK)
I was dosing 20ml per day and uped it to 40ml
There has been minimal changes in the alkalinity level over a couple of weeks i was measuring it between 6 and 6.5dkh
I decided to up the dosing to 60ml and after a couple more weeks i am still measuring it to be around 6dkh
I do weekly 20% water chances with redseas coral salt pro mixed to 34ppt

The biggest change i have noticed on the corals is not really any growth over the last month or 2 and the gonipora has closed up. However I have fairly recently diped them in revive coral cleaner as they had some kind of flatworm on them.

I am looking for advice from you experienced reefers on suggestions to proceed. Do i just keep upping the KH dosing?
I keep zoas, hammers, torchs, frogspawn, couple of small leathers, scollys, trachys, duncan, a bubble tip nem, a few small SPS and some others I have forgotten the names of.

Edit: I use Hannah checkers for NO3, KH, Po4 and redsea for Mag and Calc
Edit (added No3 and Po4 to parameters)

 

[V A R I A N T]

If no decline in Ca or Mg, I would check N03 level for swings. Or get new reagent or gain access to a different test kit to confirm.

 

[clangx]

If no decline in Ca or Mg, I would check N03 level for swings. Or get new reagent or gain access to a different test kit to confirm.

Ok yeh wow. I just used a red sea KH tester. measured at 10.5dkh. lesson learned.
possibly the reagent has gone off or been contaminated.

 

[Reef Quest]

Hanna checkers are rubbish imo, the reagents are always going off or they have bad batches and yielded false results. Then people act on this and cause problems with their aquarium water chemistry and end up killing corals because of them.
Always best to have back up test and for Alkalinity my go to is Salifert.

 

[gbroadbridge]

Hanna checkers are rubbish imo, the reagents are always going off or they have bad batches and yielded false results. Then people act on this and cause problems with their aquarium water chemistry and end up killing corals because of them.
Always best to have back up test and for Alkalinity my go to is Salifert.

The Hanna Alk reagent only lasts a month or two after opening unless refrigerated.
If refrigerated they last at least 6 months - not many people have tried longer then that.

Agree that Salifert is the most reliable test.

 

[homer1475]

The Hanna Alk reagent only lasts a month or two after opening unless refrigerated.
If refrigerated they last at least 6 months - not many people have tried longer then that.

Agree that Salifert is the most reliable test.

I've never refrigerated a hanna ALK regaent. I use one every couple months. Never had an odd reading I could contribute to bad reagents. Yes I do know it's a thing and I'm not doubting it, but these are my observations over the course of 10 years of using the hanna egg.

Just for instance I got a wierd reading, checked the reagent, and it expires this month. Got out a new bottle, same result. Still thinking it's a weird reading I get out my trusty salifert kit, same number. So even though my bottle of reagent has been open for 4 months, and is technically expired, it still reads spot on. NBow I do wonder though since my testing supplies are in a sealed box(dark) and in a cold room(roughly 55 to 60F) if that helps extend the shelf life of my reagents?

This is exactly how bad information is passed along in this hobby. One person sees how possibly refrigerating the reagent can extend the shelve life, and now it's the word of god.

 

[Hats_]

Hanna doesnt specify this themself but theyre reagent for alkalinity is best kept refrigerated i heard. I do agree and i myself keep a salifert test handy at all times

 

[gbroadbridge]

I've never refrigerated a hanna ALK regaent. I use one every couple months. Never had an odd reading I could contribute to bad reagents. Yes I do know it's a thing and I'm not doubting it, but these are my observations over the course of 10 years of using the hanna egg.

Just for instance I got a wierd reading, checked the reagent, and it expires this month. Got out a new bottle, same result. Still thinking it's a weird reading I get out my trusty salifert kit, same number. So even though my bottle of reagent has been open for 4 months, and is technically expired, it still reads spot on. NBow I do wonder though since my testing supplies are in a sealed box(dark) and in a cold room(roughly 55 to 60F) if that helps extend the shelf life of my reagents?

This is exactly how bad information is passed along in this hobby. One person sees how possibly refrigerating the reagent can extend the shelve life, and now it's the word of god.

Well, it's not one person - there's a whole thread.

Important findings according how to store open bottles of the reagent for Hanna Marine alkalinity checkers

There is a way to hinder the Hanna alk to show lesser and lesser dKH (or ppm for that matter) with age of open reagent bottle. I had the same story as many have reported here - my reading decrease from a new open bottle with time. Double check with another method show that there was not a real...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[homer1475]

Well, it's not one person - there's a whole thread.

Important findings according how to store open bottles of the reagent for Hanna Marine alkalinity checkers

There is a way to hinder the Hanna alk to show lesser and lesser dKH (or ppm for that matter) with age of open reagent bottle. I had the same story as many have reported here - my reading decrease from a new open bottle with time. Double check with another method show that there was not a real...

www.reef2reef.com

Started by an observation from one person. Again, it's hyperbole provided by one person, that many other have latched onto, and is now the word of god.

Yes I know the thread well, have read it many times. I personally have not seen an issue with not refrigerating my reagents.

 

[Hats_]

Started by an observation from one person. Again, it's hyperbole provided by one person, that many other have latched onto, and is now the word of god.

Yes I know the thread well, have read it many times. I personally have not seen an issue with not refrigerating my reagents.

ive seen weird numbers being thrown by my alk checker at the end of my bottle, used my salifert as a reference and it was off by like 1-2dkh. i always clean the vials very thoroughly and i use a glass pipette to exactly get 10ml all the time. so i believe there may be some truth to it. dont know if anyone has tested it though

 

[homer1475]

ive seen weird numbers being thrown by my alk checker at the end of my bottle, used my salifert as a reference and it was off by like 1-2dkh. i always clean the vials very thoroughly and i use a glass pipette to exactly get 10ml all the time. so i believe there may be some truth to it. dont know if anyone has tested it though

End of the bottle as in the last bit of reagent, or last of the bottle as in the last of the 25 tests, throwing away the 2 or 3 extra ml of reagent left in the bottle.

Yes I would agree with you that if you try to use the last bit in the bottle, it gives weird reading(my own experience as well). Since I have gone to marking my bottle and only using the stated 25 tests(had a long email convo with hanna reps about this), then throwing away the last extra bit left in the bottle, my reading are much more consistent bottle to bottle.

I'm not saying refrigerating the reagent doesn't help extend the shelf life, but as far as I'm concerned and my own personal findings, I do not refrigerate the reagent. I guess I could attribute this to being kept in a cold room(near refrigeration temps), I do not know.

 

[Hats_]

End of the bottle as in the last bit of reagent, or last of the bottle as in the last of the 25 tests, throwing away the 2 or 3 extra ml of reagent left in the bottle.

Yes I would agree with you that if you try to use the last bit in the bottle, it gives weird reading(my own experience as well). Since I have gone to marking my bottle and only using the stated 25 tests(had a long email convo with hanna reps about this), then throwing away the last extra bit left in the bottle, my reading are much more consistent bottle to bottle.

good to know, had a feeling it could have been something like that. might try the refigerator thing too, no harm no foul i guess

 

[homer1475]

good to know, had a feeling it could have been something like that. might try the refigerator thing too, no harm no foul i guess

No doubt, no harm, no foul.

Hey if it works, it works. Who am I to say it doesn't? What sometimes works for some, sometimes doesn't work, or is not the findings of others.

In my emails to hanna, they have stated the reagent will last opened until the expiration date is reached. No where did they tell me the bottle is only good for a couple months once opened. Nor was refrigeration needed to keep the reagent viable.

If refrigerating the reagent works for people, then so be it, but I have a feeling it's just a placebo effect.

 

[gbroadbridge]

In my emails to hanna, they have stated the reagent will last opened until the expiration date is reached. No where did they tell me the bottle is only good for a couple months once opened. Nor was refrigeration needed to keep the reagent viable.

If refrigerating the reagent works for people, then so be it, but I have a feeling it's just a placebo effect.

I think that perhaps you spoke to someone in sales, rather than a technical specialist.

We (my employer) have a support contract with Hanna, and our tech rep has specifically stated in writing that the Alk reagent has a maximum lifetime of 3 months after opening when the reagent is kept in dark and temperature stable conditions around 18 degrees (Celcius).
They do not advise refrigeration - however I do anyway

 

[Icryhard]

Hanna checkers are rubbish imo, the reagents are always going off or they have bad batches and yielded false results. Then people act on this and cause problems with their aquarium water chemistry and end up killing corals because of them.
Always best to have back up test and for Alkalinity my go to is Salifert.

Depends on which one though. You can test for alk with salifert, but po4 would for example be difficult. Below 0.7 salifert detects "0" and you're forced to use Hanna ULR - phosphate (or phosphorus).