Am I going overstocked soon?

[Alpha_and_Gec]

So I run an 80 gal reef with currently 1 cleaner wrasse, 1 dusky(marginatus) wrasse, 1 pholidicthys, 1 Valenciennea strigata, 1 longnosed hawk, and 1 unimaculatus foxface. Am I overstocked? How much extra capacity do I have if I'm not?

All of these except for the pholidicthys are middle - of - the - column fish, which I didn't expect, especially for the goby. Nutrients are all under control(god bless chaeto)

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

So I run an 80 gal reef with currently 1 cleaner wrasse, 1 dusky(marginatus) wrasse, 1 pholidicthys, 1 Valenciennea strigata, 1 longnosed hawk, and 1 unimaculatus foxface. Am I overstocked? How much extra capacity do I have if I'm not?

All of these except for the pholidicthys are middle - of - the - column fish, which I didn't expect, especially for the goby. Nutrients are all under control(god bless chaeto)

I had to look up the dusky wrasse - what a beautiful fish!

I think the answer to your question depends a lot on what type of fish you still want to add. Do you have a full tank shot?

 

[Alpha_and_Gec]

I had to look up the dusky wrasse - what a beautiful fish!

I think the answer to your question depends a lot on what type of fish you still want to add. Do you have a full tank shot?

This is the best I can get this late. The cleaner and the hawk went to bed already.

My mum wants a trio of cardinals and a pair of clowns, I want to add a rare butterfly(debating between copperband, kleini, longnose and parachaetodon) or a G. lamarck.

Stil reeeeeeealy want that horseshoe crab, but I'll have to rehome the goby beforehand.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

What are the tank dimensions?

You're not going to like this, but here are my thoughts.
I don't think a butterfly is a good idea for an inexperienced reefer as they can be very difficult to keep alive (they often won't eat). Butterflies are also known to eat coral and inverts and are not generally considered reef safe. The butterflies you listed tend to get relatively large and you already have some fish that will likely be 7-8" when full grown so a larger tank would be needed if adding a butterfly.

The lamark angel is a no-go for a tank as small as yours. It needs a 125 gallon or larger.

Horseshoe crabs rarely survive in captivity... even in a mature tank, once they have stripped the sand bed, they starve.

As for the cardinals and clowns, pick one or the other since you want multiples. You have 6 fish in an 80 gallon and adding more than a few smaller fish is pushing it. (You COULD get by with some small gobies though).

You'll also want to consider adding more rock for the fish you already have; It does not appear that your scape provides a lot of hiding places but that could just be the photo. My foxface, for example, is quite skittish and has multiple "safe spots" in my tank.

 

[Alpha_and_Gec]

What are the tank dimensions?

You're not going to like this, but here are my thoughts.
I don't think a butterfly is a good idea for an inexperienced reefer as they can be very difficult to keep alive (they often won't eat). Butterflies are also known to eat coral and inverts and are not generally considered reef safe. The butterflies you listed tend to get relatively large and you already have some fish that will likely be 7-8" when full grown so a larger tank would be needed if adding a butterfly.

The lamark angel is a no-go for a tank as small as yours. It needs a 125 gallon or larger.

Horseshoe crabs rarely survive in captivity... even in a mature tank, once they have stripped the sand bed, they starve.

As for the cardinals and clowns, pick one or the other since you want multiples. You have 6 fish in an 80 gallon and adding more than a few smaller fish is pushing it. (You COULD get by with some small gobies though).

You'll also want to consider adding more rock for the fish you already have; It does not appear that your scape provides a lot of hiding places but that could just be the photo. My foxface, for example, is quite skittish and has multiple "safe spots" in my tank.

I'm pretty happy with the aquascape situation right now. What has happened is that my engineer goby had almost entirely hollowed out the back of the tank of 3 - 4 inches of substrate, making a bunch of huge caves and piling most of the sand in the front and the right side, and he seems hospitable enough to let all of the fish sleep in there. I really liked this setup because it opened up most of the front for viewing, but there's enough secure hiding spots that all my current fish becomes nice and complacent within one or two days of introduction, even the skittish ones like the goby and foxface. As soon as they get into the rocks they're completely invisible. The tank only has one and a half sides you can view from excluding directly above so that adds an extra layer of security too.

Regarding the butterflies, it's mostly the rarity factor that makes them desirable. I've been pretty wary of butterflies but as of late I've heard constant good things about the longnose in particular in terms of both hardiness and reefsafety, in combination to my lfs getting the first one in a very long time makes me want to give them a go(given it's a confirmed chungus and feeder ofc). I think it'll be a pretty easy rehome to do too, never ever seen one in my area.

For the horseshoe crab, I've been developing a full on game plan for tackling them... it's not complete and it involves taking some fish and corals out, but eventually it's something I want to keep after reading enough literature on them. Right now the urchin collection takes a little precedent though.

The lamarck is just an impulse remark lol, it's pretty cheap at my lfs rn but I've seen what an adult looks like in their display tank. I won't get it unless my mum makes me.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Regarding the butterflies, it's mostly the rarity factor that makes them desirable. I've been pretty wary of butterflies but as of late I've heard constant good things about the longnose in particular in terms of both hardiness and reefsafety, in combination to my lfs getting the first one in a very long time makes me want to give them a go(given it's a confirmed chungus and feeder ofc). I think it'll be a pretty easy rehome to do too, never ever seen one in my area.

I fear you're falling prey to confirmation bias, only paying attention to the butterfly fish reviews that agree with you having one... while individuals might not eat coral or inverts, as a species, no butterfly is reef safe besides the pyramid.

 

[Alpha_and_Gec]

I fear you're falling prey to confirmation bias, only paying attention to the butterfly fish reviews that agree with you having one... while individuals might not eat coral or inverts, as a species, no butterfly is reef safe besides the pyramid.

That might be true with the kleini or the copperband, but forcipiger longirostris has not been recorded in the literature I’ve read as a corallivore(shrimp specialist) even though its sister species, F. flavissimus is, and the two are highly distinctive. In addition, I have counted only five instances of flavissimus explicitly feeding on coral in internet posts, even though it’s known to do so in literature.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

corallivore = eats coral

 

[littlefoxx]

This is the best I can get this late. The cleaner and the hawk went to bed already.

My mum wants a trio of cardinals and a pair of clowns, I want to add a rare butterfly(debating between copperband, kleini, longnose and parachaetodon) or a G. lamarck.

Stil reeeeeeealy want that horseshoe crab, but I'll have to rehome the goby beforehand.

Ive got a horseshoe crab. Weird invert. Ill go like a month without seeing any sign of her and think she is dead but then she pops up or leaves a molt for me to find and gives me a heard attack lol. I feed a little extra for her and at night she will come out of the sand and eat the food left on the bottom from my other fish. Very cool crab, had her almost a year now!

 

[Alpha_and_Gec]

Ive got a horseshoe crab. Weird invert. Ill go like a month without seeing any sign of her and think she is dead but then she pops up or leaves a molt for me to find and gives me a heard attack lol. I feed a little extra for her and at night she will come out of the sand and eat the food left on the bottom from my other fish. Very cool crab, had her almost a year now!

Yeah, the nutrution plan is to feed them like sharks - whole prey fish, vitamins, salmon food. They are naturally scavengers. I’m not as worried about my corals but I will need to take out my foxface since the crab will definitely kill it in the night.

 

[littlefoxx]

Yeah, the nutrution plan is to feed them like sharks - whole prey fish, vitamins, salmon food. They are naturally scavengers. I’m not as worried about my corals but I will need to take out my foxface since the crab will definitely kill it in the night.

You think so? Mine isnt aggressive at all. She was bigger than my foxface when I got him and never so much as looked at him. Ive also got a blenny and a goby in there she wont touch! My melenarus wrasse sleeps in the sand too and the crab doesnt so much as look at him, only interested in bristleworms, and the extra food!

 

[Dbichler]

Horseshoe crabs are really best left in the ocean. They get huge and often starve like starfish in aquariums.

 

[2020 Worst Year]

I'm pretty happy with the aquascape situation right now. What has happened is that my engineer goby had almost entirely hollowed out the back of the tank of 3 - 4 inches of substrate, making a bunch of huge caves and piling most of the sand in the front and the right side, and he seems hospitable enough to let all of the fish sleep in there. I really liked this setup because it opened up most of the front for viewing, but there's enough secure hiding spots that all my current fish becomes nice and complacent within one or two days of introduction, even the skittish ones like the goby and foxface. As soon as they get into the rocks they're completely invisible. The tank only has one and a half sides you can view from excluding directly above so that adds an extra layer of security too.

Regarding the butterflies, it's mostly the rarity factor that makes them desirable. I've been pretty wary of butterflies but as of late I've heard constant good things about the longnose in particular in terms of both hardiness and reefsafety, in combination to my lfs getting the first one in a very long time makes me want to give them a go(given it's a confirmed chungus and feeder ofc). I think it'll be a pretty easy rehome to do too, never ever seen one in my area.

For the horseshoe crab, I've been developing a full on game plan for tackling them... it's not complete and it involves taking some fish and corals out, but eventually it's something I want to keep after reading enough literature on them. Right now the urchin collection takes a little precedent though.

The lamarck is just an impulse remark lol, it's pretty cheap at my lfs rn but I've seen what an adult looks like in their display tank. I won't get it unless my mum makes me.

if its the rarity factor that makes you want 1 put that out ur head cause a £30 fish is not rare lol

 

[Alpha_and_Gec]

You think so? Mine isnt aggressive at all. She was bigger than my foxface when I got him and never so much as looked at him. Ive also got a blenny and a goby in there she wont touch! My melenarus wrasse sleeps in the sand too and the crab doesnt so much as look at him, only interested in bristleworms, and the extra food!

Just based on my experience with freshwater crustaceans and what people say about arthropods in general. Not trusting anything that's not explicitly a specialist.

 

[littlefoxx]

Horseshoe crabs are really best left in the ocean. They get huge and often starve like starfish in aquariums.

Yes I usually agree, mine actually was a hitch hiker, and Im no where near the ocean so I researched to do the best I can with mine

 

[littlefoxx]

Just based on my experience with freshwater crustaceans and what people say about arthropods in general. Not trusting anything that's not explicitly a specialist.

Oh yeah freshwater crabs are evillll lol

 

[Alpha_and_Gec]

if its the rarity factor that makes you want 1 put that out ur head cause a £30 fish is not rare lol

Price doesn't indicate rarity... have you ever seen a Parachaetodon ocellatus for sale?

 

[Dbichler]

Yes I usually agree, mine actually was a hitch hiker, and Im no where near the ocean so I researched to do the best I can with mine

No judgement whatsoever lol especially on hitchhikers we all get lucky or unlucky once in a while.

 

[Alpha_and_Gec]

Yes I usually agree, mine actually was a hitch hiker, and Im no where near the ocean so I researched to do the best I can with mine

Tbh I've never actually seen anyone have a horseshoe crab die on them, but maybe that's because I've mostly been reading about them in aquaculture conditions.

 

[littlefoxx]

No judgement whatsoever lol especially on hitchhikers we all get lucky or unlucky once in a while.

Yeah not sure what getting her was in way of luck lol but I do actually really enjoy her and with me she doesnt have to worry about ******s bleeding her dry for her blood to sell on the black market!