Ammonia spike

[Lyds]

G'day,

My new 60 L nano went from 0 ppm ammonia to 4.0 in about a week after adding a couple of clowns.

I've done a 25% water change and that lowered it to 1.0 but I don't think that's good enough.

I also added some buffer because my pH was a little low and is now at 8.0

Any tips on how to lower it?

 

[Cory]

If your ammonia is even detectable, this is an emergency. You must add ammonia remover, such as amquel or something like it. Live plants also remove ammmonia.

Ammonia is very toxic to fish.

If you cant get amquel, do a 90% water change.

Are the fish ok? Do they breathe very fast?

 

[Sabellafella]

Welcome to the forum btw. Your goin to have to do water changes and just ride it out untill the bacteria will convert it to 0. You could also buy a bottled bacteria asap as well

 

[Lyds]

When the ammonia was high they looked reasonably stressed but now they're behaving and breathing normally.

Cheers Sabellafella I'll do another water change now

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

FWIW, don't add buffer unless you need to raise alkalinity (buffers are alkalinity supplements).

It should not be added based on a perceived need to raise pH (without knowing if you need alkalinity) because alkalinity can quickly get too high.

 

[Lyds]

Tested the alkalinity and it was a little low so I don't think the buffer was bad. Do you know of any other ways I may raise the pH?

 

[brandon429]

a tank pic is the most important part of ammonia diagnostics, even above the test kit reading can you post one. certain aquarium dosers change readings etc, just handy to see pics for extra details that support the reading, mainly looking for coralline algae strangely enough.

 

[Lyds]

 

[brandon429]

excellent, and that was wet pack live sand right, the caribsea type? the rocks have certain characters that only pics show that make them the most powerful oxidizing filters you could put in a tank using natural items. they are also right recent from the ocean, we can factor in a possible rock source for the ammonia, but tracing that out w be easy too (adds a little twist to the suspect reading)


your rocks due to features we can clearly see make them better and more diverse ammonia scrubbers than my own rocks, which have been in my tank for ten years and are 100% coralline. yours have way more surface area, porosity, for starters, and the attached items indicate bacterial diversity better than most as well because they just came from the ocean not long ago, considered ideal live rock imo.

8ppm ammonia hunts are fun detail works

if wet pack sand, a truly powerful filter as well its fun to piece together clues. how did you verify the rock was not leaching ammonia before the fish am curious

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Tested the alkalinity and it was a little low so I don't think the buffer was bad. Do you know of any other ways I may raise the pH?

pH is determined by the alkalinity and the CO2 level in the water. Low pH is most often caused by high CO2 in the water, and that is usually from high CO2 in your home air.

You can bring in more outside air windows, air line to skimmer inlet, etc.), use a CO2 scrubber on a skimmer inlet, grow more photosynthetic organisms that use CO2 (they all do), or just leave it be.

I discuss it here:

pH and the Reef Aquarium
http://www.reefedition.com/ph-and-the-reef-aquarium/

 

[Lyds]

excellent, and that was wet pack live sand right, the caribsea type?

Just some sand I had lying around from a cichlid tank. I cleaned it properly before I put it in though.

 

[brandon429]

that removes the assistance from wet sand then that's good detail. what brand is your ammonia test, and im curious to know the duration of the spike, still going on partially or fully subsided? im also assuming the rocks cured in tank a little while before adding the fish>

 

[Lyds]

API ammonia is still 1.0 and pH is 8. Live rock was cured and I let it sit in the tank a week before I added fish

 

[brandon429]

is this api

also, since its still reading can you take a sample for comparison using any other kit, even if just an ammonia alert badge? true 1.0 in this case means something way beyond 1 is pumping out, mostly being oxidized by the best possible ammonia scrubber + tank dilution, and still rendering 1.0

it takes a lot of true leaking ammonia to do that imo, more than two fish in a very clean tank with no organic loading in a sandbed. still hunting for clues, I don't think the ammonia matter is closed yet.

toxicity, I know of no fish that will display normal opercular (gill) motion and normal breathing in sustained 1.0 as well, all facts to consider. can you get a comparative test in any way?

also, the handiest trick to see if rock is causing problems is just to lift some out and smell it. 1.0 or 5.0 being oxidized down to 1.0 would literally stink. I bet that live rock smells like the ocean upon whiffal

 

[tcoyle]

Your tank was not cycled before adding fish and the live rock did not have enough time to cure. I might add some Dr. Tim's One and Only to build up your nitrifying bacteria faster. Keep up with water changes to keep the ammonia down.

 

[Lyds]

I'm doing a water change now. Cheers for the help xx

 

[brandon429]

after it cured, did you test zero ammonia>

 

[brandon429]

this rock has better bacteria than any of our currently running tanks, its literally full up. ammonia w be from rotting benthics, not lack of bac. also, a delicate lps has survived all claimed spikes.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Dt T and Seachem Prime and Stability. Bacterial supplements to kick start the cycle and eat the Ammonia.

 

[brandon429]

im thinking bacterial death means this system cant rebound from 8 to 1 ppm without the typical ramp up time.



if we assume bac are weak, and not actually the strongest community of all we keep, our perspectives change massively, polar in fact and we take remedial actions to the side of the ideal action. if you have true sustained ammonia, the source of rot must be found and removed, that's the true fix. but the reading is suspect=fun thread.


is this an api ammonia reading? Adding any bac supplement at any time is harmless agreed.


Additional clues

No fanworms will plume open in the presence of sustained true ammonia... are there any open micro fanworms on that live rock

Skip cycling with uncured in some cases:
http://reef2reef.com/threads/tampa-bay-saltwater-live-rock.245819/#post-2889692