Ammonia to fuel a cycle- how much?

[SallyWho]

About two weeks ago, I fired up the RODI unit via the kitchen sink (until I can get it installed in its permanent spot), mixed up my first batch of saltwater ever (of course, I made it too strong) and filled a 10g QT tank for my eventual cuc. It's got a sponge filter, heater, small powerhead, a fist sized piece of live rick from the LFS, a tupperware dish of sand (for any sand-dwelling cuc members) and an ammonia alert badge. I ghost fed for about five days before picking up some Stability and began dosing it per bottle instructions. I didn't think the ghost feeding was working fast enough, so I bought some ammonia and just...dribbled it in. Just a quick little splash. Is there an actual protocol for dosing ammonia, like a "2tsp per gallon" sort of thing? I definitely put just a bit too much in there! All I can do it keep adding Stability until it goes down, right? There's nothing alive in there other than the piece of rock, so I'm not going to kill anything by waiting it out. Should I add a different bacteria in a bottle product as well, in the hopes that two products will work better together?

Also, what's the best way to feed cuc members in QT? There will be trochus and nassarius snails for sure, probably a couple of hermits, and maybe a cerinth or two. I've left the light on over the QT tank in the hopes of producing some major algae, but it hasn't bloomed yet. Algae wafers? Pieces of lettuce (fresh or blanched?) or nori? Small chunks of raw shrimp for the ones who prefer meatier detritus? Bury some of the meaty stuff in the mini sandbed for the nassarius snails? Any tips are appreciated! Thanks!

 

[HotRocks]

Dosing ammonia to "test a biofilter" is definitely something you would want to do a little more precisely than a splash.

I have never done so. I was trying to find a thread where I saw it discussed, with no luck.

@Humblefish how much ammonia do you dose when testing QTs and what type do you use?

 

[Humblefish]

@Humblefish how much ammonia do you dose when testing QTs and what type do you use?

Ace Janitorial Strength Ammonia: http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1272325

Or any ammonia solution with NO surfactants (soap) in it. It should contain 10% ammonium hydroxide and nothing else.

Once you have that, dose 2pm until your biofilter can process that much in roughly 24 hrs. I wouldn't raise the ammonia level over 3-4ppm, or your cycle might stall.

Use this website to calculate how many milliliters to dose: https://www.hamzasreef.com/Contents/Calculators/AmmoniaCycling.php

 

[SallyWho]

Ace Janitorial Strength Ammonia: http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1272325

Or any ammonia solution with NO surfactants (soap) in it. It should contain 10% ammonium hydroxide and nothing else.

Once you have that, dose 2pm until your biofilter can process that much in roughly 24 hrs. I wouldn't raise the ammonia level over 3-4ppm, or your cycle might stall.

Use this website to calculate how many milliliters to dose: https://www.hamzasreef.com/Contents/Calculators/AmmoniaCycling.php

Thanks Humblefish! Looks like I used approximately 10x too much ammonia. Oops. Should I do a water change or just add a bunch more bacteria-in-a-bottle?

 

[Humblefish]

Thanks Humblefish! Looks like I used approximately 10x too much ammonia. Oops. Should I do a water change or just add a bunch more bacteria-in-a-bottle?

I would test your ammonia level first to see where it stands.

 

[SallyWho]

I would test your ammonia level first to see where it stands.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! It's off the charts! Man am I glad I haven't put anything alive in there yet! So, about a 50% water change, then?

 

[Jason mack]

50% would be a good start .. after that test test test !!!!

 

[brandon429]

Id add this:

the live rock already had as much bacteria as it can hold, and doing anything with ammonia here wont help if it was really live rock from a pet store (hydrated for months or years prior to selling it to you vs dry)

if you have additional surface area that's dry, like a filter of some type, then the ammonia boost w help colonize that but we have an ongoing rule in the cycling thread that live rock needs no additional help, I noticed that detail here possibly.

what other surface area besides the lr are you trying to prep?

*If you've added more ammonia than that amnt of live rock can handle, then waiting wont make it catch up, you might be surface area limited and not bac limited, for the amnt of ammonia added.

Live rock has as much bacteria as it can hold, they only stack so high on the surface of the structure. water shear and other factors control max avail for bacteria, and moving rocks among tanks never kills the bac they just ride into the next tank ready to go. that's why its important to know if you have enough surface area, enough live rock in tow, its not about re waiting for the current live rock to grow more bac

post pics

 

[User1]

Just to clarify since the wording above isn't clear - prior to adding any ammonia run a quick test to see how ammonia is looking before adding anything.

New tank, water, rocks, sand, and what not as you are ready to start your initial cycle - fishless. If Ammonia is 0, and it should be since it is new water, etc, then you dose drops / ml to get your ammonia to 2 ppm. There are several calculators out there to help measure properly based on your tank size, etc. After you added the initial dose let it sit for some time, then test to see how close you got. If you need to add a tick more, do so, let it settle, then test again. Once you have it at 2 ppm you are good to go and the cycle is starting. If you are adding bacteria in a bottle (whatever your brand is, I used Dr. Tims) follow the instructions.

Don't add more ammonia, nothing. Let the tank do its thing and retest ammonia in 2 days. If still reading 2 ppm then let it sit another two day. Test again. Repeat until it is 0. Once it reads 0 then test Nitrites. Once ammonia is 0 you can re-apply the same dose you started with to get it back to 2 ppm then test 24 hours later. Ammonia should be back to 0... Everyone pretty much covered it but the way I read the one post it sort of lead me to believe you keep adding ammonia. You don't. One time to 2 ppm then wait till 0 then re-apply to verify it processes in under 24 hours. Then you are done...more or less.

 

[Rattzreef]

I purchased Dr Tims Ammonium Chloride for my fishless cycle and used that method twice now with great results.. it calls for 4 drops per gallon they recommend to bring it to 2ppm.. that may be a good option to try.. I'm sure most LFS can get hold of some for you.

 

[SallyWho]

Thanks for the advice, guys! My problem was that I didn't initially have the piece of live rock, and I didn't know there were calculators to tell me how much ammonia to add. I just dribbled a little splash in there a few days after starting to dose Stability. I added ammonia after the live rock, because I also added a small container of sand. I figured since the beneficial bacteria needed to increase to colonize the sand, I needed to add a food source. The sand will be for any cuc members who prefer a little sandbed during their stay in QT. Based on the input here, I'm going to do about a 50% water change and test ammonia again. If It's a still off the charts, I'll do another 50% (hopefully by then I'll have gotten my RODI and water mixing station up and running, or this is going to be an unnecessarily big pain). I'll bring ammonia back into measurable range and then start dosing Stability again per package instructions. Thanks so much for all your help, guys!