Anyone have an extra long cycle using Dr Tims?

[nim6us]

So I’ve never done a fishless cycle before, but I did so much to make sure I had the cleanest possible setup the idea of ghost feeding raw shrimp seemed to put me off. The Dr Tim’s method with introducing bacteria in a bottle then dosing with ammonium chloride sounded more appealing.

Here we are at week 3, when I dose with ammonia it spikes to 2ppm and then goes down to .25-.5 but even after days it won’t ever hit 0. Same with nitrites, they spike to 4ppm and go back down to .25-.5 but they won’t go to zero either.

Obviously the bacteria must be working on some level because I’m getting nitrate readings, first 10, then 25, 50, now it’s maxed at 100 (as high as the test will detect). So I put some chaeto in my algae reactor last night and fired that up to start bringing down the nitrates.

I just don’t know if this is part of the cycle, and I need to wait longer? In the past I’ve just used rock from another system and the tanks have been cycled in 10 days, so this feels like something is wrong.

Looking for some feedback from experienced reefers.

Also my salinity is solid at 35ppt, but my pH is quite low at 6.6, I’m guessing because of the ammonia, but again thoughts are welcome!

 

[glb]

So I’ve never done a fishless cycle before, but I did so much to make sure I had the cleanest possible setup the idea of ghost feeding raw shrimp seemed to put me off. The Dr Tim’s method with introducing bacteria in a bottle then dosing with ammonium chloride sounded more appealing.

Here we are at week 3, when I dose with ammonia it spikes to 2ppm and then goes down to .25-.5 but even after days it won’t ever hit 0. Same with nitrites, they spike to 4ppm and go back down to .25-.5 but they won’t go to zero either.

Obviously the bacteria must be working on some level because I’m getting nitrate readings, first 10, then 25, 50, now it’s maxed at 100 (as high as the test will detect). So I put some chaeto in my algae reactor last night and fired that up to start bringing down the nitrates.

I just don’t know if this is part of the cycle, and I need to wait longer? In the past I’ve just used rock from another system and the tanks have been cycled in 10 days, so this feels like something is wrong.

Looking for some feedback from experienced reefers.

Also my salinity is solid at 35ppt, but my pH is quite low at 6.6, I’m guessing because of the ammonia, but again thoughts are welcome!

I had a slow cycle with Dr. Tim’s too, but the bottle I used was near the expiration date. I think pH can stall the cycle but hopefully someone who knows for sure can chime in. Is it possible your ammonia and nitrite test kits are off?

 

[Maggie321]

I have only done 1 fishless cycle. It's the only tank I currently have. But it took 8 weeks. Wait longer.

 

[1WildBill]

My 75 only took 2 weeks . I used Bio-Spira and flake food to ghost feed.

 

[glb]

You could buy another bottle if you like. I added Biospira after about 3 weeks and that sped things up. What test kitake are you using?

 

[nim6us]

Thanks for all the feedback. I’m using Salifert on all three test kits, bought new with a 2020 expiration. I tested some tap water as a control and it all came up zeros so unfortunately I don’t think I can blame the test kit.

It’d be a pain in the butt but I could do a 50% water change if that might help? If not maybe I’ll just have to be patient.

 

[lapin]

You need to stop adding ammonia. Your cycle is almost done. In a week or 2 you will be at 0 on both ammonia and nitrites.

 

[User1]

Yup, what @lapin said - stop adding ammonia. You test ammonia at the start, then add Dr. Tim's, then add the ammonia to reach 2 ppm. Then you wait it out and test every other day until Ammonia is 0. Once it reaches 0 and Nitrites have done their thing then you re-dose ammonia to 2.0 ppm, test to verify, then test ammonia again 24 hours later and it should read 0. If that is the case then the tank is cycled.

I just did fishless, dosing ammonia, Dr. Tim's, and it took about 28 days or so with my 210 gallon tank.

 

[SuncrestReef]

I used Dr. Tim's and it took 5 weeks to cycle my new tank. I started with dry Pukani rock, and many people warned me that Pukani leeches phosphate, so I ran a GFO reactor and grew chaeto while cycling to try to keep phosphates in check so I wouldn't have excessive algae problems. Well, after 3 weeks into cycling I had nothing but very high nitrite readings and no nitrates. I then learned that the bacteria responsible for converting nitrite to nitrate needed phosphates in order to multiply, so I had stalled my cycle because my phosphates had dropped to zero. After turning off the GFO reactor the phosphates came back up to 0.05 ppm, and within 2 more weeks the cycling had completed.

This doesn't sound like the problem you are having since you have lower nitrites and high nitrates, but I figured I'd mention it in case others reading this thread may be in a similar situation.

 

[JCTReefer]

I cycled with Dr Tims one and only and it took about 7 weeks. I guess really about day 43. Followed the directions to a T..
And also used his brand ammonia. Took much longer than I expected. Started out with 40 lbs of cured Fiji dry rock. Cured for about a month after bleaching. Used lanthanum chloride to speed up the curing process. Phosphate levels were about .03 when I added it to the display per Hanna Ulr checker.
Started cycle

Day 1 3-22-18 - added Dr tims and ammonia drops.
Day 2 tested ammonia .75ppm
Day 3 dosed 3ml ammonia
3-25-18 tested 2ppm ammonia
Day 5 3-26-18 tested 2ppm ammonia
Day 6 3-27-18 tested 1-2ppm
Day 7 3-28-18 tested 1-2ppm ammonia,8.1ph, 0 nitrates, 0 nitrites, 6dkh,
Day 8 3-29-18 tested 1-2ppm ammonia
Day 9 3-30-18 tested 2ppm ammonia for
Day 10 3-31-18 tested 2 ppm ammonia
Day 11 4-1-18 tested 2-4ppm ammonia
Day 12 4-2-18 tested 2ppm ammonia
.25ppm nitrites
Day 13 4-3-18 tested 1ppm ammonia
.50 ppm nitrites 1.025spg 8.0 ph
Day 14 4-4-18 tested 1-2ppm ammonia 1ppm Nitrites.
Day 15 4-5-18 tested 1ppm ammonia 1ppm nitrites.
Day 16. 4-6-18 tested 1ppm ammonia 2-5ppm nitrites
Day 17. 4-7-18 tested
Day 18 4-8-18 tested .25 ppm ammonia 2-5ppm nitrites
Day 19. 4-9-18 tested 0-.25ppm ammonia
2-5ppm nitrites
Day 20. 4-10-18 tested 0-.25ppm ammonia
2-5ppm nitrites
Day 21. 4-11-18 tested 0-ppm ammonia
2-5ppm Nitrites
Day 22. 4-12-18 tested 2-5 ppm nitrite
Day 23. 4-13-18 tested 2-5 ppm nitrite
Day 24. 4-14-18 tested 2-5 ppm nitrite
Day 25. 4-15-18 tested 2-5 ppm nitrite
Day 26. 4-16-18 tested 2-5ppm nitrite
20ppm nitrates
Day 27. 4-17-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
Day 28. 4-18-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
Day 29. 4-19-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
Day 30. 4-20-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
20ppm nitrates
Day 31. 4-21-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
Day 32. 4-22-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
Day 33. 4-23-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
Day 33. 4-24-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
Day 35. 4-25-18 tested 2ppm nitrites
Day 36 4-26-18 tested 5ppm nitrites
Day 37 4-27-18 tested 5ppm nitrites
Day 38 4-28-18 tested 5ppm nitrites
Day 39 4-29-18 tested
Day 40 4-30-18 tested
Day 41 5-1-18 tested
Day 42 5-2-18 tested .50ppm nitrites
Day 43 5-3-18 tested 0ppm nitrites
Dosed 2ppm ammonia
Day 44 5-4-18 ammonia .25-.50ppm
Nitrites 0
Day 45 5-5-18 ammonia .25-.50ppm nitrites .25ppm
Day 46 5-6-18 ammonia 0-.25ppm nitrites 0-.25ppm
Day 47 5-7-18 ammonia 0ppm
Nitrites 0ppm.

 

[scuzy]

Biospira took about as week. 6 tanks so far works great.

 

[nim6us]

Okay I guess I’m going to wait it out.

My only concern is the mega high nitrates. Do I need to water change to bring those down, or should I just ignore nitrates until ammonia and nitrite are at zero?

 

[lapin]

If you are doing the cycle in your tank I would recommend a water change. Best to start now reducing nitrates. If it was in a tub you would just pull out the rock and put it in your tank with new water leaving the nitrates behind.

 

[nim6us]

Yeah I’m cycling the tank, 120g, so a 50% water change is pretty substantial. What about NoPoX, is that an option or a bad choice for such a new tank?

 

[SuncrestReef]

Okay I guess I’m going to wait it out.

My only concern is the mega high nitrates. Do I need to water change to bring those down, or should I just ignore nitrates until ammonia and nitrite are at zero?

Dr. Tim’s instructions say to do water changes only if nitrite is over 5 ppm. High nitrate is not a problem while cycling. Once cycling is complete, then do a water change to bring down nitrate.

 

[nim6us]

@SuncrestReef

Yeah so hold off on the water change?

My concern is doing a massive water change, then nitrates build up again, and then another water change. So yeah didn’t know if I should just wait until the end.

 

[MTBake]

I've done two tanks with fishless cycles. One with Tim's one and only took about 8 weeks before it was ready. One with Bio-Spira took 21 days and it was ready. If I use Tim's one and only again, I'll double the dose to see what happens.

 

[SuncrestReef]

@SuncrestReef

Yeah so hold off on the water change?

My concern is doing a massive water change, then nitrates build up again, and then another water change. So yeah didn’t know if I should just wait until the end.

Yes, I’d hold off on the water change until the end of cycling if I were in your situation.

In my situation with high nitrites, I had to do several water changes because over 5 ppm nitrite will stall the cycle.

 

[lapin]

@SuncrestReef
Yeah so hold off on the water change?
My concern is doing a massive water change, then nitrates build up again, and then another water change. So yeah didn’t know if I should just wait until the end.

If its in your tank change out some of the water. You dont need to do a massive one until its over. You dont need to maintain 100ppm nitrates while cycling. Its just going to give algae a head start. Same with a light. Dont use one while cycling.
And dont start with any additives or reactor stuff. Your tank needs to mature. You dont run a marathon the first day of training.

 

[wangspeed]

It takes a lot of bacteria to kick start things. I used the Fritz version and their recommended dose. It’s a HUGE amount of stinky bacteria, but I had 0 ammonia after dosing it up within a week.