Apex Controller - Controlling Variable Speed Return Pump

[CJ Monty]

I am looking to control my return pump with that variable via the variable speed port and an optical sensor. What I would like to do is step down or up the pump by 10% based on the water level and continue to do so. For I would like it to run at 80% during normal operation. For some reason if the water gets low sets the pump at 70%, waits a minute, if still low sets to 60% etc.

I am making several assumptions based on the apex documentation when writing the code. If any are wrong please let me know:
1. The only way to control the variable speed port on the apex is with profiles. I would have to 11 profiles with PF_0, PF_10,...PF_100.
2. There is no way to get the profile or % the variable speed port is set to.
3. Virtual Outlets are only on or off (booleans). There is no way to store a number.

Based on these assumptions I think what I need to do is:
Create a bunch of virtual outputs (PUMP_10,PUMP_20,...)
In each virtual outputs configuration use the optical sensor status along with the current values of the other virtual outputs (this is where it gets tricky and could use some guidance) to set its value
For the return pump check these virtual outputs and turn on the corresponding profile. For example IF Output PUMP_10 THEN PF_10.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!!

 

[P-Dub]

I am looking to control my return pump with that variable via the variable speed port and an optical sensor. What I would like to do is step down or up the pump by 10% based on the water level and continue to do so. For I would like it to run at 80% during normal operation. For some reason if the water gets low sets the pump at 70%, waits a minute, if still low sets to 60% etc.

I am making several assumptions based on the apex documentation when writing the code. If any are wrong please let me know:
1. The only way to control the variable speed port on the apex is with profiles. I would have to 11 profiles with PF_0, PF_10,...PF_100.
2. There is no way to get the profile or % the variable speed port is set to.
3. Virtual Outlets are only on or off (booleans). There is no way to store a number.

Based on these assumptions I think what I need to do is:
Create a bunch of virtual outputs (PUMP_10,PUMP_20,...)
In each virtual outputs configuration use the optical sensor status along with the current values of the other virtual outputs (this is where it gets tricky and could use some guidance) to set its value
For the return pump check these virtual outputs and turn on the corresponding profile. For example IF Output PUMP_10 THEN PF_10.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!!

An easier workaround is to place more than one optical sensor, one for each stage of water drop. I don't know if what you are wanting to do is possible any other way. Have you posted this question to the Neptune forums? I'm curious as to why you would like to do this. Are you anticipating an ATO failure in the off position?

 

[CJ Monty]

Honestly, I dont trust my overflow system. It always seems to get out of of wack. Go to bed water level is fine, wake up and pump is almost dry and the water level in the tank has risen with nothing blocking the overflow return. Right now I just add water at an interval which is less than the evaporation rate and then top of manually every couple days to the desired level. I am scared to let it go full auto since I have kalk in my top off. Dont want to add too much.

 

[P-Dub]

Honestly, I dont trust my overflow system. It always seems to get out of of wack. Go to bed water level is fine, wake up and pump is almost dry and the water level in the tank has risen with nothing blocking the overflow return. Right now I just add water at an interval which is less than the evaporation rate and then top of manually every couple days to the desired level. I am scared to let it go full auto since I have kalk in my top off. Dont want to add too much.

How about using the sensor as a low water sensor to shut off the return if it gets that low. What you are describing sounds as though the speed of the return pump is becoming variable and not staying consistent. A dirty (even a little slime buildup on a DC pump) return pump can do that. What make/model return pump do you have? When was the last time it was cleaned and, what is the ATO that you are using?

 

[CJ Monty]

How about using the sensor as a low water sensor to shut off the return if it gets that low. What you are describing sounds as though the speed of the return pump is becoming variable and not staying consistent. A dirty (even a little slime buildup on a DC pump) return pump can do that. What make/model return pump do you have? When was the last time it was cleaned and, what is the ATO that you are using?

Yeah I can do that. Was trying to be fancy with my variable speed port and avoid completely shutting down the pump. In case I am at work and can not attend to it right away. Varios 4 pump that I run at 80%. Ato is just an aqualifter that turns on for 30 seconds every half hour.

 

[P-Dub]

Invest in this and be done with it.
OSMOLATOR UNIVERSAL 3155 AUTO TOP OFF

The cost of switches and the associated programming far exceeds the piece of mind you get when running a quality ATO. The Varios should have come with a low water cut-off switch anyways. My varios 6 will start to slow down when gunked up with just slime. I clean it every 2 months.

 

[CJ Monty]

Invest in this and be done with it.
OSMOLATOR UNIVERSAL 3155 AUTO TOP OFF

The cost of switches and the associated programming far exceeds the piece of mind you get when running a quality ATO. The Varios should have come with a low water cut-off switch anyways. My varios 6 will start to slow down when gunked up with just slime. I clean it every 2 months.

An apex can do exactly what the product you pointed to. My concern is topping off too much when the system gets out of wack like the situation. I haven't experienced what you are describing. What is happening is sump level lowering, dt tank rising. This is means either the pump is pushing water faster or the overflow is draining slower (maybe due to a siphon break). In that case sensor will add more water to the system then it should. The sump level would rise to where it should be but the DT level will be higher resulting in more water in the system then should be.

What you described it the worse case I will end up. Instead of using a float sensor (not trusting that) I will use an optical sensor and just reduce the pump to have speed and alarm. I was just looking to do better.

Being a software engineer I could write code in 10 minutes on what I want. Apex code in very restrictive and was hoping I was missing something.

 

[P-Dub]

@CJ Monty a thought just occurred to me. Are you running only the pump on the variable dimming/speed ports on your Neptune or is there another piece of equipment in the other port as well? In other words is both the V1/V2 and the V3/V4 being utilized? If so, what is the other port controlling? The reason that I ask is it is entirely possible that the signals through the 0-10v wiring are getting out of whack from interference from power cords or another dimming/speed cable. This happened to me. My Lights were interfering with my Varios pump control and the Varios were causing my lights to flicker. Separated the two and have had flawless function since.

 

[CJ Monty]

@CJ Monty a thought just occurred to me. Are you running only the pump on the variable dimming/speed ports on your Neptune or is there another piece of equipment in the other port as well? In other words is both the V1/V2 and the V3/V4 being utilized? If so, what is the other port controlling? The reason that I ask is it is entirely possible that the signals through the 0-10v wiring are getting out of whack from interference from power cords or another dimming/speed cable. This happened to me. My Lights were interfering with my Varios pump control and the Varios were causing my lights to flicker. Separated the two and have had flawless function since.

Interesting, thanks for the info. I was having the issue I described before my Varios was hooked up to my apex. But that is good info to keep in mind going forward.

Thanks again!