Are LED's worth upgrading to from T5s?

[SurlyT]

Since you already have the T5 fixture, don't spend the extra money on changing it out. T5s work great if your tank isn't too deep.

Check out some of the frag tank builds by Bulk Reef Supply on YouTube. Unless they're actually pimping LEDs, they select T5 fixtures because they're tried and true for coral propagation.

 

[Stephanie11]

I've been using less for 4 years. I just ordered a few t5 units for supplement. I love acans but my LEDs don't cut it for them. LEDs grow coral and most corals will be fine color wise, but there is still room for improvement. I'll tell you I'm not looking forward to replacing bulbs. Knowing me I'll do it every 6 months.

This being said my vote is for led t5 combo!

 

[Harold Green]

Since I have no experience with t5's I can't really comment on them. I have been running led's for the last two years and I kind of like them. Previously I had been running vho's and I had them pretty much dialed in for what I wanted to do. Yet they produced a lot of heat, more than I would have expected. The lamp replacement cost ran several hundred dollars a year and ballasts were just too expensive to replace every couple of years. So I went to led's. I put a diy fixture over a 44g corner and got excellent coral growth. Last year I set up a 210 with a mix of diy and Chinese fixtures and let the tank run. After eight months coral growth was slow and some corals were receding and at that point I doubled the wattage of the led's on the tank. The results showed up almost overnight with corals quickly recovering and growing. Cons- It's tough to get the light where it will grow sps, and lps at the same time. Many of the lps stay open and look great while some are obviously getting too much light and slowly bleach out regardless of tank placement. Pros- I love being able to adjust the tank colors to get the look I find most appealing. Sps seem to be encrusting rapidly with lots of new growth. Coral colors are excellent. Now I would say to you if you're happy with the t-5's I would stay with them but if you're more concerned with cost or color or heat then the led's will give you more options. As someone else suggested if you decide to change then it might be more advantageous to keep some of the t-5's and add led's to the mix.

 

[WetWhistle]

I run three Hydra 52 on my mixed reef and I love them. The you need more LED for them to work doesn't always apply. I have no issue with growing sps or coloring them up unless I adjust them wrong. My LPS and soft corals grow better then when I had MH. My SPS for most species grows just as well for me as when I ran my MH on my DT. I have run MH for over 20 years so I am familiar with coral growth rates under them.

Lighting is not the only factor in influencing color and coral growth. Available food, building blocks like calcium and mag etc, nutrients and water flow all contribute to coral husbandry. Energy that is created from lighting that is used by corals as a food source is usually used for the most part for daily metabolic needs and some growth. Captured pray items, dissolved organics like DOM and POM and particulate matter when used as food items are used in growth as they go well beyond the energy budget that light alone produces or allows. Light saturation levels are reached way sooner then most people realize. In fact most calcification happen at night when the coral is in active feeding mode not during the day as study's have shown. If you have to much lighting when the light saturation levels hit, O2 becomes super saturated within the coral tissue the coral growth stops temporary till the light levels are lowered. So you actually lose calcification for portions of the day if your lighting is to high. Depending on the species these amounts vary amongst them. Any lack of lighting under any of the lighting choices can be compensated somewhat by feeding more. (Within reason) Back in the day we used to use T8 bulbs that are shop lights to grow corals. So the mindset of you need a crazy amount of them for them to work is not always accurate under all conditions. If you run a ULNS tank you will typically need more lighting as food and dissolved organics that are used in nutrient uptake as a food source by the coral are limited. So you can add more food or run more lighting in this case.

When it comes down to it you should get what fits your needs and budget. Factor in running cost for electricity, bulb replacement, heat production, programmability needs.

 

[reefknight]

reefknight

Well Said...

The posted pics are from a customer who has used our LEDs for several years then added more.

As far as LEDs go I'm in the MH camp. Sanjay did some excellent research on MH Spectrum and we used this and other research to develop the best mix to replicate MH lighting.

I can say on my personal 550gal reef, Going all LED has saved me 20 amps and a lot of unwelcome heat.

This mix or as we like to call it a recipe is only one way to light a reef.

Reef Keeping is not an inexpensive hobby. Many have tried cheap pumps, skimmers and lights only to replace with something that works better.

Any aggressive change in lighting or poor environment can cause bleaching. Corals especially SPS are very sensitive to changes in light.

Given the spectrum limits of the ocean, corals with proper acclimation do very well under a 20K mix of LEDs, T5 or MH.

Back in the 80s while on a scuba diving trip in Florida, I saw an amazing LPS tank in a LFS lit by only 420nm 110watt VHO actinics. These were well grown over the size of a salt bucket.

There are a lot of ways to say skin a cat...Why would anyone want to do this literally? ...reef lighting has a lot of options.

I agree with you, it's not an inexpensive hobby. I have had friends and acquaintances that have really tried to cut corners and have learned the hard lessons. You attempt to pass your knowledge on that you too learned the hard way, mine was with fish only systems. Yet they don't listen and either finally get on board or jump ship. I can recall reading Sanjay's study on lighting and it was quite eye opening in many regards. As I mentioned, I love MH. I just do not love the excessive electric bill that comes from it as well as the 1/4hp chiller as well as the excessive heat in my home and noise.

A blending of these technologies is where the real sweet spot lies. I have had the itch for the past couple of years to add LED's to my ATI Powermodule. There just really isn't a really attractive way to do so. My fixture hangs above the DT with no canopy, so no way to hide the LED's and nothing to attach them to. Have considered a couple of the "strip" style LED bars and attempting to angle them into the DT. Again, not very attractive.

 

[reefknight]

I run three Hydra 52 on my mixed reef and I love them. The you need more LED for them to work doesn't always apply. I have no issue with growing sps or coloring them up unless I adjust them wrong. My LPS and soft corals grow better then when I had MH. My SPS for most species grows just as well for me as when I ran my MH on my DT. I have run MH for over 20 years so I am familiar with coral growth rates under them.

Lighting is not the only factor in influencing color and coral growth. Available food, building blocks like calcium and mag etc, nutrients and water flow all contribute to coral husbandry. Energy that is created from lighting that is used by corals as a food source is usually used for the most part for daily metabolic needs and some growth. Captured pray items, dissolved organics like DOM and POM and particulate matter when used as food items are used in growth as they go well beyond the energy budget that light alone produces or allows. Light saturation levels are reached way sooner then most people realize. In fact most calcification happen at night when the coral is in active feeding mode not during the day as study's have shown. If you have to much lighting when the light saturation levels hit, O2 becomes super saturated within the coral tissue the coral growth stops temporary till the light levels are lowered. So you actually lose calcification for portions of the day if your lighting is to high. Depending on the species these amounts vary amongst them. Any lack of lighting under any of the lighting choices can be compensated somewhat by feeding more. (Within reason) Back in the day we used to use T8 bulbs that are shop lights to grow corals. So the mindset of you need a crazy amount of them for them to work is not always accurate under all conditions. If you run a ULNS tank you will typically need more lighting as food and dissolved organics that are used in nutrient uptake as a food source by the coral are limited. So you can add more food or run more lighting in this case.

When it comes down to it you should get what fits your needs and budget. Factor in running cost for electricity, bulb replacement, heat production, programmability needs.

You brought up a very interesting point that a friend and I have discussed on multiple occasions when he gets the LED "bug". Adjusting the multiple channel lights. Recently another friend of ours placed a Kessil 360we on a frag tank and has good results. He has considered now placing them on his display (6' 180g). Currently all of us run T5's, just about the same number of lamps, hours, spectrum and wattage and tanks are all similar. In the discussion we come across that the Kessil acts closer to a MH due to the singular point of light and that the controls (unit controls) are simplistic. You control spectrum and intensity. You cannot really adjust away from their proprietary wave spectrum whereas with other units you have so much more control. In that aspect it reminds you of MH, you chose your spectrum of lamp, the height that you suspended it and the photoperiod.

 

[Reefnjunkie]

Every coral I have in my display and all 4 frag tanks have always been LED, not sure why some people have such bad results or just not as good of results as I experienced. I've ran LEDA for about 5 years andIve built many fixtures from Bill and loved them. Times change and I've swapped all of those over my display to cheap **** Chinese fixtures and can't tell a difference other than after 2 years I have had to replace half the RB diodes. I still use the DIY they just light 4 of frag tanks.

I run T5 over my Acan tank, it's the only light source that keeps the gorgeous colors for me, I've tried many different spectrume of diode and not all morphed but many did. I switched to T5 and now I've got the colors that make one drool

This topic is just going to be full of opions with some experiance (some long term) in the end, if your happy with the T5 stick with it and do more research on LED, I spent months nearly 5 years ago befor I switched from MH to my first DIY LED (back then there was not a worthy fixture IMO )

I honestly believe LED has the ability to be the one light source, the difference spectrums and programmability are unequaled

Good luck with your endeavor

 

[WetWhistle]

MH and T5 are tried and true because people have used them for so long. One of the plus sides for these lighting options is they are plug and play. Like Reefknight said you chose your spectrum of lamp, the height that you suspended them at and the photoperiod you want to run them. LED are not as easy to use as those two options so they do take time to get adjusted. To me I wanted programability, less bulb replacement and good energy usage to light output ratio. I love that I can control LED with my apex on my phone on the fly when I introduce new frags or want to make a change in spectrum if I need to.

MH\ T5 combo are one of my top lighting options but I hate paying the cost to run MH and the yearly bulb replacement cost. LED are the first light source I have run that is not in combination with another. It has been three years that I have been using LED and so far I don't feel the need to add T5. My current DT is just over a year and a half old so possibly down the road I might need to. But we will see.

 

[CKI]

Thanks for all the input

 

[Orly20]

Great thread! Enjoyed reading the entire thread very much.
I've had LED FOR 3 years now and you must learn how to acclimate your corals to this light source to get to your sweet spot. The first fixture I had was not dimmable and it cooked the poop out of my sps but for the last year I've been running an OceanRevive t247 and I couldn't be happier with them. I've had great growth and color on all of my corals, which is primarily sps dominant.
I just started the new tank build upgrade to a 120 gallon and I am leaning towards getting another one of the same led OR fixtures and attaching one or two BRS t5 retro kits In a canopy that can hide all the fixtures. I will have the t5 bulbs on for about 4 or 5 hours in the peak hours. All the reading I've done lately suggests that the LED/T5 combo is the new craze and it gives you the power, low light bill, no replacement bulb cost, controllability of the LED tech with only two or maybe four bulb replacements throughout the year. The t5 would be supplemental to my LED's.

 

[CKI]

Well after much thought I went ahead and just changed out the bulbs. Changed up the spectrum a little and couldnt be happier with how the tank looks. I now plan to add a reefbrite LED to my ati fixture to have the best of both worlds. Thanks for all the input!

 

[twilliard]

What we see may not necessarily be what the coral sees

 

[WetWhistle]

That is a good decision especially if you like the way the tank looks. The mix of T5 , LED should work out great for you. Give us an update in a few weeks and the process.