Are my clowns sick or just lazy?

[Rfamily]

My clownfish have been acting strangely for a couple of days now. The black and white one keeps laying on the sand on his side in the corner. When we feed they both chase after the food but inevitably they both head back to this corner. My wife tried to net him into a makeshift qt but he was too quick.
Quick params
Temp 78.2° PH 7.8 Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0 Nitrate 5 Calc 540
°DkH 10 Phosphates 0.25
I am concerned it may be ich but haven't seen the telltale spots on them or the goby. All 3 fish are from Vivid Aquariums and were drip acclimated about a month ago.
The tank is only 4 months old and was ghost fed for 7 weeks before adding the CUC and another 2 weeks before the 3 fish, a BTA, and a giant Feather Duster were added.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Some stability or prime as a water conditioner and slime coat help. Are you running a skimmer? An airstome will help with oxygenation.
What kind of salt are you using and what is your water source?

A bump for the fish experts.

Do you have a full tank shot?

 

[Rfamily]

For a skimmer I have an AquaEuro HOB. Water is RO/DI using Instant Ocean aquarium salt. Also using an Emperor 400 filter as a makeshift refugium with Chaeto and 5 mangroves.

 

[Humblefish]

How long has your tank been setup? Do the clowns breathe heavy or rub on anything in the tank?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Hello dr. You see the problem. Correct?

 

[Humblefish]

Hello dr. You see the problem. Correct?

I don't like the glass tops, which might be preventing proper gas exchange. But I'm not 100% sure that's the problem, as he also has a HOB skimmer. I would like to know how long the tank has been setup to rule out any possible environmental factors (like cycling) before focusing in on a disease issue.

What are you thinking?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

its brand new. not enough bacteria and new salt with alk and PH probs . Im not sure the best way to oxygenate and help the slime coat.

 

[ThePriceSeliger]

He "looks" like my clowns inside my anemone. Maybe they are just hosting the corner of the tank?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

They can be saved. We just need the rest of the info.

 

[Rfamily]

Thank you all for your input. The black one does look to be breathing heavy and the orange one looks like it's comforting the black one. Other than laying on the sand, they haven't been rubbing up on anything.

 

[Rfamily]

Now I think I see a couple of white spots in the black section. From what I can tell they are not protruding at all.

 

[mcmc1717]

I like how the hermit crab is just eating the snail not caring a lick about whats going on

 

[mcmc1717]

oh, and my female snowflake clown has been doing the same thing except in her pot, I think she is carrying eggs and is going to spawn soon, because the male snowflake acts normal, same with my coral beauty and devil damsel

 

[melypr1985]

That's not normal clown behavior. My clowns host the corner of the tank but they are always moving, never on their side like that.

I'm curious as to how you mix your saltwater. How long do you mix the salt in the water before adding it to your display? Have you ever added salt directly to the display?

Heavy breathing typically means there is something in the gills making it difficult to get oxygen. A fresh water dip would be a good idea to see if there are flukes in there. It's easy and minimally invasive for the fish. I'll the get "how to" for the dip.

 

[melypr1985]

Freshwater Dip: Provides temporary relief for Brooklynella, Flukes, Marine Velvet disease (Amyloodinium); possibly even Ich & Uronema marinum (both unproven). Can be used to confirm the presence of Flukes.

How To Treat - Fill a bucket with RODI water, and use a heater to match the temperature to the water the fish is coming from. Aerate the water heavily for at least 30 minutes prior to doing the dip, then discontinue aeration while performing the dip. Fish aren’t overly pH sensitive for short durations like this, but you can squirt a little tank water into the dip just before the fish goes in to help bring it up.

Place the fish in the freshwater (FW) dip and observe closely. It is not unusual for them to freak out a little at first. Also, tangs are notorious for “playing dead” during a FW dip. The important thing is to watch their gills; they should be breathing heavily at all times during the dip. If breathing slows, it’s time to exit the dip. Dip the fish for no longer than 5 minutes. Multiple dips may be done, but it’s important to give your fish a day to recuperate in-between dips.

For flukes, use a dark (preferably black) bucket so you can see if tiny white worms fall out of the fish (especially out of the gills) at around the 3-4 minute mark. The worms will settle to the bottom, so you can use a flashlight to look for them there as well.

Pros - Provides temporary relief for a wide range of diseases in a chemical free environment. Can “buy you more time” until a proper treatment can be done.

Cons/Side Effects - Not a permanent “fix” for any disease, as FW dips are not potent enough to eradicate all of the parasites/worms afflicting the fish. Some fish can have an adverse reaction to a FW dip by appearing unable to maintain their equilibrium once returned to the aquarium. If this happens, hold the fish upright (using latex, nitrile or rubber gloves), and gently glide him through the water (to get saltwater flowing through the gills again). It is also a good idea to place the fish in an acclimation box until he appears “normal”.

 

[mcmc1717]

oh I see those white spots that's not good and my clowns only look like that orange one

 

[Humblefish]

Be sure those white spots aren't just sand, since they are laying on the bottom.

 

[Rfamily]

Well, I setup a FW dip in a small plastic bucket. When I went to net the black one she darted off. Finally did catch her and can definitely see 4 spots on her. We did not see any worms or anything come out of her gills during the last 2 minutes.

 

[melypr1985]

If the spots didn't go away during all that commotion then ich is a possibility. No flukes lends more weight to ich as well. Here's how to treat ich. Unless Humble can think of anything else it could be...
Treating Ich

Saltwater ich (Cryptocaryon irritans) is best described as salt or sugar-like "sprinkles" on the body or fins. Sometimes however, the parasite can harbor inside the gills - out of sight. Behavioral symptoms such as flashing, scratching, twitching and heavy breathing are other indicators of ich.

Most hobbyists will encounter ich at some point in one of two settings:

1. A newly acquired fish in quarantine (QT) - proceed to "Treatment options" below.
2. Fish in the display tank (DT) - There is no easy way of dealing with this. Even in fish only systems, it can be problematic trying to treat in the DT. Copper (and other medications) can be absorbed by rock/substrate, and doing hyposalinity risks possibly wiping out your bio-filter. You have to catch ALL of your fish, and quarantine/treat using one of the treatment options mentioned below. The DT itself must be left fallow (fishless) for at least 72 days to starve out any remaining parasites. Continue to periodically feed your corals/inverts; a pinch of flake food every 2-3 days will help maintain bacteria levels in the DT. Remember there is no "reef safe" ich treatment that will actually eradicate all of the parasites! Tea tree oil from India or garlic extract or any other herbal/natural "medication" is designed to only help fish manage their symptoms.

If you need help setting up a QT for treatment, this guide will prove useful: https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/fish-disease-treatment-diagnosis/189815-how-quarantine.html

Treatment options: Copper, Chloroquine phosphate, tank transfer method, or hyposalinity. All of which are discussed in detail here:https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/fis...is/189658-treatment-options-my-two-cents.html

 

[Humblefish]

Can we get a closeup pic of the white spots on the clownfish? I would just like to be sure this is ich, and not brook, before advising treatment.