are refugiums worth it?

[reefz]

I have been considering starting a chaeto refugium in my new system. I had one in the past that lasted only a few weeks before I had to tear down the whole system. So I just dont have much knowledge of what good refugiums can do. I just dont know If it's worth the hassle to grow chaeto or other macroalgaes, but maybe others have had real beneficial results with doing it. I have an extra chamber in my system that world work great for one, but am worried if I do end up growing chaeto, it wont do much for my tank. Could anyone chime in and tell me their experience with refugiums? Is it worth it??

 

[flashsmith]

Yes it's worth it. All kinds of reasons why. I'm sure somebody else will chime in with that. All I did was get a light and throw a clump in my fuge section. Literally that's it.

 

[HBtank]

If you need the extra export, and other options like skimming, live rock or media, roller matts/socks, or something like carbon dosing are not sufficient, they are a solid option. Although I would probably go for a reactor/scrubber because the one downside to a refugium in the sump for me is extra maintenance from algae growth outside the refugium area, and the fact it can die off, break apart, and make things a bit messier in the sump. I do also consider them direct competition for nutrients with other invertebrates, so I kind of look at it as the last option for nutrient problems.

 

[areefer01]

I have been considering starting a chaeto refugium in my new system. I had one in the past that lasted only a few weeks before I had to tear down the whole system. So I just dont have much knowledge of what good refugiums can do. I just dont know If it's worth the hassle to grow chaeto or other macroalgaes, but maybe others have had real beneficial results with doing it. I have an extra chamber in my system that world work great for one, but am worried if I do end up growing chaeto, it wont do much for my tank. Could anyone chime in and tell me their experience with refugiums? Is it worth it??

It depends on what you are using the "refugium" for. Refugium as the name implies is a place for small gritters like pods and worms to see refuge so they don't become dinner. In theory they work their way through plumbing and end up in the display in which case they "can" become part of the food chain or ecosystem. The key here is how they get from refugium A to display B. Typically the ideal install is above the display for gravity rather than under the display and through return pumps.

You are talking about an area to grow chaeto or other macro algae. In this case some micro fauna life will live but the primary purpose sounds like exporting nutrients via algae growth. Here you need to export enough such that it is worth your time and equipment cost. In short - a handful a week or every two weeks or something like that. Not a small bit but rather a lot of it to export and be worth it.

So worth it depends on what this thing really is and what its use is. Refuge != algae export. It is a place for micro fauna or isolation or place to put something that needs refuge.

 

[Wasabiroot]

Something I'd add is that I love the concept of refugiums and macroalgae - they bring so much life and serve so many functions, but they are absolutely not trouble free and require periodic maintenance.

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

I’ll get blasted and I know it. If your making a sanctuary for something I get it, that’s what its for. Growing macro to feed your tangs, I get it. If your just growing algae for nutrient export….you better get a much bigger fuge than most standard tank setups provide, feed it a lot of nutrients and iron, burn it with light and remove a lot on a frequent basis. The typical 5-10 gallon fuge section in a 200 gallon setup isn’t going to do jack. Same thing if you’re trying to balance your ph at night, it better be one large fuge. Those guys with all in ones running chaeto…..why? What’s it actually doing. I fell for the fuge hype myself, and gave it an honest shot across two systems. I’d rather put the work into my fish and corals. They will typically strip a system of nutrients and you’ll end up having to over feed or dose to keep them in check. Now, if your a triton or similar method, maybe…..I’ve never gone that route but I do know they don’t run filtration. The fuge is the filter.

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

It depends on what you are using the "refugium" for. Refugium as the name implies is a place for small gritters like pods and worms to see refuge so they don't become dinner. In theory they work their way through plumbing and end up in the display in which case they "can" become part of the food chain or ecosystem. The key here is how they get from refugium A to display B. Typically the ideal install is above the display for gravity rather than under the display and through return pumps.

You are talking about an area to grow chaeto or other macro algae. In this case some micro fauna life will live but the primary purpose sounds like exporting nutrients via algae growth. Here you need to export enough such that it is worth your time and equipment cost. In short - a handful a week or every two weeks or something like that. Not a small bit but rather a lot of it to export and be worth it.

So worth it depends on what this thing really is and what its use is. Refuge != algae export. It is a place for micro fauna or isolation or place to put something that needs refuge.

I totally agree….and man this sure sounds like a reefer beefer episode!

 

[HBtank]

It depends on what you are using the "refugium" for. Refugium as the name implies is a place for small gritters like pods and worms to see refuge so they don't become dinner. In theory they work their way through plumbing and end up in the display in which case they "can" become part of the food chain or ecosystem. The key here is how they get from refugium A to display B. Typically the ideal install is above the display for gravity rather than under the display and through return pumps.

You are talking about an area to grow chaeto or other macro algae. In this case some micro fauna life will live but the primary purpose sounds like exporting nutrients via algae growth. Here you need to export enough such that it is worth your time and equipment cost. In short - a handful a week or every two weeks or something like that. Not a small bit but rather a lot of it to export and be worth it.

So worth it depends on what this thing really is and what its use is. Refuge != algae export. It is a place for micro fauna or isolation or place to put something that needs refuge.

Good point, I forgot the refuge in refugium, since they are often synonymous with just growing chaeto.

Personally I always have an area of my sump devoted to a cryptic refugium, basically an unlit compartment I no longer care about being clean, and filled with rubble and/or smaller ceramic media (and other structures to create open layers) to allow for whatever wants to populate without competing with photosynthetic organisms, so pods, sponges. bacteria, other filter feeders, whatever.

 

[shakacuz]

personally, yes. @areefer01 couldn't of had said it any better!

 

[ZombieEngineer]

They work pretty good for nutrient export, probably somewhere in the vicinity of about half of what a properly sized skimmer would do if you have one adequately sized to your tank (5-10% display size). Less if undersized.

Thier true value is creating a sanctuary for maintaining large populations of copepods so your display always has plenty of live food for free.

 

[X-37B]

30g remote fuge on my old 120 and now on my 80g.
I have a sump fuge on my 45 frag system. Both keep po4 at <.1 and no3 at <3. I use no po4 reducing media anymore. I prefer the red macro over chaeto.
45's fuge in 40 breeder sump.

30g remote on my 120.

 

[Garf]

I used to export about 600 grammes of algae every 9 or 10 days. Now if you remove the water content (70 to 80%), that means I exported about 150 grammes dry weight, or 15 grammes a day of equivalent nori units. Didn’t seem worth it to me, when using 120 watts of power.

 

[Spare time]

Refugium are the best waste export method in the hobby. Nothing removes nitrate and phosphate as effectively and with so little cost

 

[Baby_Shark]

30g remote fuge on my old 120 and now on my 80g.
I have a sump fuge on my 45 frag system. Both keep po4 at <.1 and no3 at <3. I use no po4 reducing media anymore. I prefer the red macro over chaeto.
45's fuge in 40 breeder sump.

30g remote on my 120.

Nice setup!

 

[PeterEde]

My No3 was up to 50+. I was dosing and pulling my hair out.
Then I added macro algae to my sump. Then my No3 dropped to 20+-.

 

[Robs Reef]

My Refugium, is my main nutrient export, it works so well, My skimmer doesn't pull much. A well tuned eco system and once established, microfauna will explode in turn will feed the corals. And will keep nuisance algae to minimum or none at all. I have a 600g system and I don't have a clean up crew, aside from my tangs. Alot of misinformation on this thread, it's never messy and easy to clean. I try to keep variables to a minimum, so if something does goes sideways I can literally pin point what went wrong. I don't use carbon, gfo maybe 2 to 3 times a year. Other then that I don't use enything else and I don't dose, but the effluent from my calc reactor.

 

[ZombieEngineer]

I used to export about 600 grammes of algae every 9 or 10 days. Now if you remove the water content (70 to 80%), that means I exported about 150 grammes dry weight, or 15 grammes a day of equivalent nori units. Didn’t seem worth it to me, when using 120 watts of power.

I don't know if you realize this, but 15 grams dry weight of cheato removed is the equivalent of exporting 0.36ppm of phosphate and 22ppm of nitrate in a 100 gallon aquarium. Its also 5 full sheets worth of nori. It's actually pretty substantial.

You probably don't need anywhere near 120w to get that amount though. There are some pretty substantial refugium lights that only pull about 20W.

 

[neonreef3d]

I have been considering starting a chaeto refugium in my new system. I had one in the past that lasted only a few weeks before I had to tear down the whole system. So I just dont have much knowledge of what good refugiums can do. I just dont know If it's worth the hassle to grow chaeto or other macroalgaes, but maybe others have had real beneficial results with doing it. I have an extra chamber in my system that world work great for one, but am worried if I do end up growing chaeto, it wont do much for my tank. Could anyone chime in and tell me their experience with refugiums? Is it worth it??

Mine worked too well, and dropped my po4 &no3 down to zero, chaeto grew so much that it was sucking it all out... so remove the chaeto on a regular basis.

 

[damsels are not mean]

Worth it for what?

Nutrient export - while the theory is sound, it doesn't seem to make sense when you look at the size of most refugiums vs the amount of nutrients you need to export. Investigation by BRS suggested it would take an awful lot of chaeto to have much impact at all. If this is your goal, get a turf scrubber (still not sure how effective those are but more efficient than macroalgae)

True "refugium" (a refuge for something) - maybe it is helpful in creating more room for pods to stabilize a population. It may also harbor sponges and other filter feeders that reduce waste in the same way mechanical filtration like a mesh or skimmer does. But skimmers and meshes are easier to control. My tank even with a decent actively hunting fish population has and for as long as I can remember always had a pretty lively pod population. I am not sure how effective a tiny remote filter chamber would be in improving this.

Stabilizing oxygen and pH - sure, this works pretty well. I think it is the best reason to get a fuge besides the next one I list. But I think a small fuge is again not so effective here.

Remote display - This is my favorite kind of refugium. Whatever advantages are listed above are done the best by a remote display that is similar in size or even larger than your reef display. Use it to host a planted marine tank (rare but so pretty) and/or corals and inverts that your main tank may not support/may have predators for. You could also acclimate fish in here. Let them get used to the tank water and smells of the inhabitants so they don't go in blind.

 

[jmichaelh7]

I love my refugium the light is on 24/7 along with skimmer.

ULN system for a sps dominated tank. I don’t think I could feed this heavy for my fish and not have phosphate / nitrate issues if it wasn’t for the refugium

I cut half of a 5 gallon bucket of Chaeto every 3 weeks and have been selling it locally. It’s definitely a win win in my books