ATO Return in small pump space

[Titleist]

Next on the list is an ATO of some kind. In my sump I have a pretty small return area and I'm putting a ton of flow through the sump, using (2) Syncra Adv 9 pumps full bore. Barely enough room for the two pumps in my return area and I'm thinking it's a bit violent for a float and sensor.

Are there any alternative ideas for placement?

I can throw a video up of the sump in action if someone wants to see whether it's too much surface agitation or not.

 

[AdamNC]

Check out the XPAqua, extremely small sensor. The best place is in your skimmer chamber. That’s where you want the water the most consistent in level to keep the skimmer running smoothly.

 

[JoshH]

There really is no alternative to the return section. Unless you have no baffles in your sump at all. The return section will be the only section where evaporation will have an effect on the water height. Baffles typically control the water height in skimmer chambers so if your sensor is in there your return section can run completely dry before tripping your ato.

Best thing I can suggest is make sure it's as deep as possible to help limit the water movement at the surface of the return section.

 

[Titleist]

Let me make sure I'm interpreting return section like you guys are, you mean where the return pumps are or the "input" section of the sump from the return drains? If it's the input side I'm not sure I can even get anything in there as it's about 6 inches wide, no top access other than through bulkheads and the fuge side baffle doesn't have much room at the top to weasel in the float assembly. It's a reef synergy triton sump.

 

[JoshH]

The return section is where water is returned to your tank, or where your return pumps are located

I'll add I've never heard the term return drain before.

 

[Titleist]

Never considered these terms last time I had a tank and sump. Just worked, that was 15 or so years ago. So the return section still doesn't have much room with both pumps in there. I'll have to see if I can reposition the pumps to allow for a sensor unit and bulb to fit in there. Thanks for the clarification, it's what I originally thought it meant but the more I was reading on it the more it seemed like it could be either section. It's pretty small and it's pretty turbulent. I'll try raising the level in the return section and see if that gives me more room to play with. That'll help me raise the last baffle as well, running this much water through this sump creates a bit of water noise as the stream blasts through the fuge baffle. About an inch higher and those holes are completely covered and won't make a sound.

Last time I added water it seemed like the fuge section water height was increasing rather than the return section.

 

[JoshH]

Never considered these terms last time I had a tank and sump. Just worked, that was 15 or so years ago. So the return section still doesn't have much room with both pumps in there. I'll have to see if I can reposition the pumps to allow for a sensor unit and bulb to fit in there. Thanks for the clarification, it's what I originally thought it meant but the more I was reading on it the more it seemed like it could be either section. It's pretty small and it's pretty turbulent. I'll try raising the level in the return section and see if that gives me more room to play with. That'll help me raise the last baffle as well, running this much water through this sump creates a bit of water noise as the stream blasts through the fuge baffle. About an inch higher and those holes are completely covered and won't make a sound.

Last time I added water it seemed like the fuge section water height was increasing rather than the return section.

How big is your Display tank and how much flow are you putting through the sump? And do you have a picture of your sump you could share? And by bulb are you referring to a Float valve?

 

[Titleist]

200 tank, I haven't found a flow calc that lets me use the pump's rated flow only prechosen pumps but I'm using 2 syncra adv 9 pumps at 2500 each. 1 pump through (3) 90's and a gate valve, the other (4) 90's and a gate valve. It's a custom reef synergy triton TS-70, they extended the skimmer section to make the entire sump 70" long to accommodate drainage. Ugly plumbing I know and I have to find a good pipe support other than a cardboard box :/ Once the controller's online all the cabling gets routed out of the way. I have to get to the lumber yard for some more wood.
1" output and pipe all the way up.

 

[JoshH]

Awesome looking sump, if I was you I would raise your skimmer up a bit so you can raise the water level in the return section. Also at probably 4000 GPH you're looking ar really a crazy amount of flow for any sump. Your working with 20 times tank turnover which is double what even Triton recommends... You could probably dial your pumps back or even take one of them off line and use it as a back up for the main pump.

 

[Titleist]

Awesome looking sump, if I was you I would raise your skimmer up a bit so you can raise the water level in the return section. Also at probably 4000 GPH you're looking ar really a crazy amount of flow for any sump. Your working with 20 times tank turnover which is double what even Triton recommends... You could probably dial your pumps back or even take one of them off line and use it as a back up for the main pump.

That's what I ended up doing between posts I originally had 2 RFG's on it but they were disturbing the surface way too much so I pulled them off, then I had too much sand movement so I dialed down the pumps, then had to adjust the overflow. Now the sump is a bit too high and the skimmer wall is useless at the moment because the water in the return section is too high.

All this might be par for the course as I may have to do a massive water change if my seneye readings are incorrect for ammonia. Thanks guys

 

[JoshH]

That's what I ended up doing between posts I originally had 2 RFG's on it but they were disturbing the surface way too much so I pulled them off, then I had too much sand movement so I dialed down the pumps, then had to adjust the overflow. Now the sump is a bit too high and the skimmer wall is useless at the moment because the water in the return section is too high.

All this might be par for the course as I may have to do a massive water change if my seneye readings are incorrect for ammonia. Thanks guys

You could also raise your skimmer wall and lift your skimmer up with an acrylic stand. Lots of room there for extra live rock for biological filtration

And you could still use your RFGs but run both of them off the single return pump. I'm sure this will balance the flow out and it won't be disturbing the surface an insane amount.

Glad to see things getting back on track for you