Auto water change?? Help setup

[Oiseau Reefer]

Hey just curious who has set up an auto water changing system on their tank !!
What equipment did you use how did you set it up
And if you could post some pics that would be awesome
Thankyou!:xd:

 

[divewsharks]

mine came from autotopoff.com. alot of folks also run the tunze osmolator.
very easy to setup. it uses float valves to operate a pump (tom's aqualifter) that draws from the reservoir when the water level dips. I run two valves, a primary and a secondary about an inch higher. Should the primary end up in a 'stuck on' situation, the secondary will kill the pump once any water touches it.

i see you are in Rexburg. I go up to Idaho Falls at least monthly for work (the Lab). where do you get most of your stuff from, all online?

 

[Oiseau Reefer]

Yeah I I have to get most my stuff online I'm trying to bring something to the area but it's slow going without to much money would like to set up a little shop though thanks for the response

 

[Oiseau Reefer]

mine came from autotopoff.com. alot of folks also run the tunze osmolator.
very easy to setup. it uses float valves to operate a pump (tom's aqualifter) that draws from the reservoir when the water level dips. I run two valves, a primary and a secondary about an inch higher. Should the primary end up in a 'stuck on' situation, the secondary will kill the pump once any water touches it.

i see you are in Rexburg. I go up to Idaho Falls at least monthly for work (the Lab). where do you get most of your stuff from, all online?

If your up this area let me know and feel free to stop by and check my system out

 

[Joost's reef]

mine came from autotopoff.com. alot of folks also run the tunze osmolator.
very easy to setup. it uses float valves to operate a pump (tom's aqualifter) that draws from the reservoir when the water level dips. I run two valves, a primary and a secondary about an inch higher. Should the primary end up in a 'stuck on' situation, the secondary will kill the pump once any water touches it.

i see you are in Rexburg. I go up to Idaho Falls at least monthly for work (the Lab). where do you get most of your stuff from, all online?

That is an Auto Top Off system not a Auto water change system

 

[ohridmkd]

this webstie has a nice set ups
Genesis Reef Systems

i'm thinging about getting one

 

[Oiseau Reefer]

Yeah I was checking those out just can't afford it right now other projects In the works there has to be a cheaper way to do it

 

[divewsharks]

That is an Auto Top Off system not a Auto water change system

Oh wow!! Guess that's what i get for posting at 140a, my ability to read and comprehend was apparently failing me......

 

[Oiseau Reefer]

Oh wow!! Guess that's what i get for posting at 140a, my ability to read and comprehend was apparently failing me......

And 3 am is better huh?

 

[Harry_Y]

I have toyed with the idea a few time and have some various thoughts on it

The biggest issue is having the same amount going out as in so you don't get a salinity creep.

There are a lot of ways of doing it:

2 dosing pumps (1 going out 1 coming in)

Containers and float switches.

just depends on how much money you want to spend and your setup

 

[Reggie]

I like Genesis' idea since you don't need to calibrate pumps. It relies on containers and float valves to change 1 gal at a time.

 

[Harry_Y]

I like Genesis' idea since you don't need to calibrate pumps. It relies on containers and float valves to change 1 gal at a time.

I would have to agree, That is how I would most likely do one.

I may have to pick up a couple of maxi-jets and build something up

 

[Oiseau Reefer]

I like those as well but not with in my budget!

 

[Oiseau Reefer]

I would have to agree, That is how I would most likely do one.

I may have to pick up a couple of maxi-jets and build something up

Let me know how it works out!

 

[Joost's reef]

Here ya go:

you have your evap top off device set wherever you want/need the water level in the sump proper (last and lowest sump compartment).

Set the evap float swithc so that it is very finely sensitive (frequently doses small amounts) but is fed by a VERY slow pump (extreme here... 1/4" airline or icemaker line style stream... mere gallons per day rate of speed)

Then you have your auto water change overflow hole drilled either a) slightly higher than the evap-top off level by say... not more than 1/2", or b) drilled at the same level as the evap top off level but with an adjustable elbow that allows you to change the overflow level (my recommendation)

Thus... with the overflow hole/height being less than half inch over the evap-top off level... you can auto (timer) pump new and slightly cooler seawater (no more than 2F cooler) into the display tank which will displace warmer aged water to the sump and out/over the overflow hole! Automatic water change.

And from a waiting/reserve vat (barrel/buckets... whatever) of new seawater... your auto-timer (digital from Radio Shack, for example) can be programmed to do daily, weekly, etc water changes as you wish! Sit down once and calculate how many gallons per day/week you want to change... and how many gallons per minute the pump you use for make-up will push. Simple math.

Then... after just a little bit of evaporation (after each auto water change that bullrushes the sump and overflow hole) the sump proper resumes normal evap top off operations in wait for next auto-water change, which will again slightly overun the evap top off level by just 1/2" or less

Now you may be wondering... isn't that slight overun (<1/2" over float switch level) adding a little bit of salt to the tank and increasing my salinity slowly over time? Well... theoretically yes. But if you will worry about that, then are you also calculating the similarly lost salt due to salt creep? Heehe... point is, either way its a small amount of salt. And either way, with or without salt added or exported (creep)... you still need to make slight corrections over time to the tank by checking salinity. If its a big deal (large sump)... you can compensate then by making your new seawater used for auto-water changes just slightly less saline.

 

[Harry_Y]

I got thinking about this and realized it is actually pretty simple
To do using only pumps and timers (less to go wrong)

It is basically two covered pails that would use 2 pumps on a timer timers to fill to
the point of overflowing (they would overflow into the sump and SW mixing barrel)

And then another two pumps to Drain the pails one into the sump and the other
down the drain


So here is what I have come up with:


Requires


Two pails (approx 1 gallon each)
Four Maxi-Jet 600 Power Heads
X feet Tubing/hose to fit output of Maxi-Jets
Four Hose clamps to secure tubing to Maxi-Jet


Two timers (or a controller)


-

Basically you would put 1 pail over the top of the sump
and the other over the top of the SW mixing barrel

Each pail would have a Maxi-Jet with a hose attached to it to drain the bucket

The other two Maxi-Jet s would go one into the sump
and the other in the SW mixing barrel to fill the pails


The two Maxi-Jets in the pails would plug into 1 timer (or controller)

And the two in the sump and the SW mixing barrel would plug
into the other timer or controller.

-

Operation

Step 1: The timer for the Maxi-Jets the sump and the SW mixing barrel
starts and runs for a few minutes to fill the pails to overflowing

Step 2: A few minutes later the timer for the Maxi-Jets the sump
and the SW mixing barrel stops.

Step 3: The timer for the Maxi-Jets in the pails start draining the old waste
saltwater down the drain and the new saltwater into the sump.

Step 4: A few minutes later the timer for the Maxi-Jets in the pails stops.

-



Notes:

Use a stop watch to figure out how long it takes to Fill and empty the pails
so you can set the timers, This is not critical and better to run longer than
needed to ensure the containers are fully filled and drained.

Setup the timers to run as needed to get the required changes in 1 gallon increments
(I’d space these throughout the 24hr day)


Maxi-Jet seem pretty forgiving on being ran almost dry
(I have had the one in my top off bucket run almost dry will no ill effects).

I would probably use covered pails and drill and pipe in a drain line instead
of just letting it over flow (less splashing and mess).

The Maxi-Jet 600s seem to be a good fit for this project.
I use a Maxi-Jet now on my top off but don’t recall if it is the 1200 of the 600
in there now I have used both and either should work the 600’ should cost less.








Hope this helps

 

[phi delt reefer]

here is something i designed for someone on nano reef....

Ok so this is an ugly PAINT job but its the best i can do for now.

1. So you you get a container (lets say 10 gallon) - this is the blue box on the left. Drill a whole on the bottom and on the side (near the top). You want to create a closed loop with a MJ1200 (red box, #2) so use whatever diameter pvc that fits the pump. The pump will always run to constantly keep your salt mixed or help mix a new batch for you .
2. The closed loop has a T that goes off to the tank. Inbetween the tank are two solenoids (normally closed) [/url] (green squares) and then a one way check valve (brown circle). You may not need the check valve - I put it there just in case your tubing dips into your display tank - dont want to back siphon that dirty display water .
3. Your display tank - blue outlined box. There are two float switches in there (grey circles) - one is low water, the other is high water.
4. The water exit strategy - another MJ1200 (red box, #1). You dont need to drill into your tank. Just run a piece of air line tube from your DT to the pump then into your waste water container.

How it works.
So PUMP1 is plugged into your controller. Set it to run while your home so you can keep an eye on it. Have it run for however many minutes to dump out 0.5 gallons of water. As an added safety feature, you can wire a float switch (in your waste water container) to PUMP1 to cut off the pump in case it fills the container before it turns off via the timer. MAKE SURE YOU HAVE YOUR CONTROLLER DISABLE ATO DURING THIS TIME! Three safety mechanisms are in place to prevent your display from fully emptying.
After this completes, it will set off the low water float switch in the main display. This completes the circuit the two solenoids are on, causing them to open. Water from the fresh s/w tank start to flow in until the high water float switch trips causing the two solenoids to close. The reason i have two solenoids is in case one fails. The solenoids are also on a timer on your controller so they two can only be powered during the water change. Four safety mechanisms will have to fail before the entire fresh s/w supply dumps into your display tank.

I threw this together in about an hour so there is always room for improvement.
Total cost;
2 solenoids = $20 + shipping
1 check valve (optional) = $15
2 containers for freshwater and waste = $20ish?
2 mj1200 - $40 new (try to get them used - check your local reef club)
3 float switches - $10 on ebay shipped
various plumbing and wire = $20
so just over a $100. You may have some of this stuff lying around/buy it used so you could save some money.
If you reorganize your stand and maybe build the containers out of acrylic on your own (doesnt need to be pretty) you could probably shove it all in there and make it look pretty sweet. Depending on your container sizes, this could run for potentially a month before you need to mix some new salt/empty the dirty water.

Maintenance;
You can simply the process by wiring LEDs in with all the float switches to make monitoring them easier. MJ1200s are pretty bullet proof so just make sure they are cleaned once every few months.
-cheers;
Vince

 

[Oiseau Reefer]

Here ya go:

Wouldn't your sump water overflow if power went out?? Maybe I'm missing somthin????

 

[Oiseau Reefer]

Now I'm starting to really like these ideas!!! I like yours phi delt reefer! Cam you pm me where you got the parts
Also like the simplicity of your idea Harry_y

 

[phi delt reefer]

I haven't actually implemented that design - it was created for someone else. In all honesty it takes about ten minutes to a do a 10% water change on smaller tanks (less than 50 gallons). I am already going to have a bunch of float switches and what not in my sump for the ato and sump dry run protect - last thing i need is three more for the water change system.

the solenoids can be purchased off ebay (search "ro solenoid").
float valves are on ebay as well - i would buy a bunch extra if you do implement the system just in case one goes bad on you
containers - walmart, or other cheapo place
mj1200 - i bought them off of BRS - though you could get some cheap chinese ones off ebay (usually the shipping makes them just as expensive as the mj's so i just got them). Everyone sells Mj's...its the crack of the aquarium trade...
plumbing - go to your local plumbing specialty store - my homedepot, lowes and rona (Canadian) - have the worst plumbing parts available.
check valve - get the true union serviceable ones from BRS. Service them once every 3 months so they work correctly. People always complain that they NEVER work. This is just a lie - if they didnt work, they wouldnt sell them - its basic economics. Understand that in our tanks, algae and salt deposits wear out parts much quicker than just tap water. Take the check valve apart and dip it in vinegar and let it soak over night. Better yet - get two of em them and just keep one clean at all times, that way you can swap it out and just let the other one sit in a vinegar or that new "hydor cleaning solution".

as with any automation the key to success - keep an eye on things. its certainly adds a level of complexity to your tank but at the same time it may help with your water quality for your controller will change your water regularly for you.


I havent read this entire thread but some people do water changes with peristilic pumps. I personally dont belive this is a good idea. My understanding of the pumps is that they are for dosing and are meant to run for short cycles every once in awhile (ex. 30 minutes twice a day). They are super low flow usually as well which means they have to run for hours to just change out a gallon. They are also EXPENSIVE and have too many moving parts to service. MJ1200 and similar pumps are twenty bucks and easily replaced.

happy reefing

vince