Automatic Water Change

[Heavymman]

Just wanted to here all of your feedback on this:

So I have a 32 gallon brute garbage pail for my saltwater mixing station. My thoughts were adding a Neptune PMUP into that pail and run the tubing to my sump. I will also have another PMUP in my sump and a line with a check valve to go into the drain.

When my return pump is off, I have roughly 6 gallons of water in the sump that I can pump out, approximately 10% of my total volume (68 gallons).

Through some programming, you think I can get away doing water changes for the most part like this? Weekly or bi-weekly?
Of course I will still have to do manual ones every so often to keep up with maintenance but figured this would help.

 

[Flippers4pups]

@jsker what's your thoughts?

 

[Dr. Reef Verified Sponsor]

i have a similar setup on my dual qt tank system with sump.
In the sump i have a low and high float valve. When the return pump is off and water falls back into the sump completely is where the high float is.
low is about an inch above the bottom. I have a submersible pump in sump and one in mixing bin. programming is very easy.

For water out of sump

Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If qtwclw CLOSED Then OFF

For water into sump

Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If qtwchi OPEN Then OFF

basically what it does is it starts to pull water out of sump till it hits low float then it stops then fresh saltwater starts to fill till it reaches high float.
doing about 10-15 gal change in my system.

Problems:

I have manually shut return pump off on apex fusion.
i have to manually turn water out pump to auto (normally off)
once its hits low its stops due to programming but thats it then you have to manually set it back to off and turn water in to auto till it fills up to high float and then turn is off again and turn return to auto again.
another issue is ATO you have to disable it or else it will start to fill fresh rodi water during water change.
My setup is such that mixing bin is higher than sump for once pump activates it starts to flow and never stops even when pump is turned off due to gravity.
I have tried check valves, i have tried anti-siphon nothing works. Finally i drilled a hole in the line just above the water line in mixing bin so when the pump is on it leaks water into the bin and when stopped air get sucked in and stops the siphon.

its doable, i do it but i wouldnt call is fully automatic set and forget type like i have on my main tank made by genesis reef system.
i have to be present at the setup and monitor it all the way for it to be done right. Now that i have gotten comfortable with the setup (except for saltewater pump anti siphon) which fails everynow and then ue to salt buildup i can remotely do WC looking via web cam but i try not to do that too much due to anti-siphon problem.

 

[jsker]

Just wanted to here all of your feedback on this:

So I have a 32 gallon brute garbage pail for my saltwater mixing station. My thoughts were adding a Neptune PMUP into that pail and run the tubing to my sump. I will also have another PMUP in my sump and a line with a check valve to go into the drain.

When my return pump is off, I have roughly 6 gallons of water in the sump that I can pump out, approximately 10% of my total volume (68 gallons).

Through some programming, you think I can get away doing water changes for the most part like this? Weekly or bi-weekly?
Of course I will still have to do manual ones every so often to keep up with maintenance but figured this would help.

I looked at several options when I was researching auto water changes. I went with the Neptune DOS for many reasons. One just the sheer ease for setup and control of the amount I want to change. Another is you can have your mixing station up to 30' away for you sump and you can have you waist water line drain some where else.

 

[Dr. Reef Verified Sponsor]

AutoAqua AWC is a cheap option for $199. i am looking into it seriously for set and forget setup.

 

[jsker]

Here is what the set up looks like

 

[Dr. Reef Verified Sponsor]

You have to operate these switches manually at each step completion.

 

[Burrito]

I just setup my awc, I used a dos and have it change 2g a night, water in and out at the same time. Using 1 simple brute can for the whole process.

I have my rodi on a float valve (in case I forget to shut off water). I fill the Trash can up (pull a 5-10 gallons of the fresh water into 5 gallon buckets for ato), fill again and add salt. I have an old return pump and heater in the can and have it on a basic timer to turn on ever few hours for 20 minutes to keep the water moving (on during the initial mixing).

Dos take from the bottom of the can (white tubing) and goes up through the floor (tank is directly above bar area) and the red goes down the sink drain (as does rodi waste water).

I just set this up but I figure I will need to do the water making process every 2 weeks.

This should hold me over until I make a proper mixing station.

The bar goes un-used most of the year so putting it to use.

 

[Heavymman]

i have a similar setup on my dual qt tank system with sump.
In the sump i have a low and high float valve. When the return pump is off and water falls back into the sump completely is where the high float is.
low is about an inch above the bottom. I have a submersible pump in sump and one in mixing bin. programming is very easy.

For water out of sump

Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If qtwclw CLOSED Then OFF

For water into sump

Fallback OFF
Set OFF
If qtwchi OPEN Then OFF

basically what it does is it starts to pull water out of sump till it hits low float then it stops then fresh saltwater starts to fill till it reaches high float.
doing about 10-15 gal change in my system.

Problems:

I have manually shut return pump off on apex fusion.
i have to manually turn water out pump to auto (normally off)
once its hits low its stops due to programming but thats it then you have to manually set it back to off and turn water in to auto till it fills up to high float and then turn is off again and turn return to auto again.
another issue is ATO you have to disable it or else it will start to fill fresh rodi water during water change.
My setup is such that mixing bin is higher than sump for once pump activates it starts to flow and never stops even when pump is turned off due to gravity.
I have tried check valves, i have tried anti-siphon nothing works. Finally i drilled a hole in the line just above the water line in mixing bin so when the pump is on it leaks water into the bin and when stopped air get sucked in and stops the siphon.

its doable, i do it but i wouldnt call is fully automatic set and forget type like i have on my main tank made by genesis reef system.
i have to be present at the setup and monitor it all the way for it to be done right. Now that i have gotten comfortable with the setup (except for saltewater pump anti siphon) which fails everynow and then ue to salt buildup i can remotely do WC looking via web cam but i try not to do that too much due to anti-siphon problem.

Good to know about the check valves not working as my bin is downstairs, don’t want to be siphoning back to mixing pail.

Here is what the set up looks like

I just feel like you put a lot of wear and tear on the DOS pumps that are designed for dosing elements.

 

[jsker]

Good to know about the check valves not working as my bin is downstairs, don’t want to be siphoning back to mixing pail.



I just feel like you put a lot of wear and tear on the DOS pumps that are designed for dosing elements.

I thought the same but the DOS is designed for AWC. The DOS speeds up for the amount one wants to change. The DOS can change 31 gallons per day, so you can do you bi weekly if you would like to set it up that way. Link to more info. I was going to go another rout with the Kore 5th with the AWC module but I am very happy with my choice. I am Purchasing the Kore 7th but I think I will stick with the DOS

 

[Heavymman]

I thought the same but the DOS is designed for AWC. The DOS speeds up for the amount one wants to change. The DOS can change 31 gallons per day, so you can do you bi weekly if you would like to set it up that way. Link to more info. I was going to go another rout with the Kore 5th with the AWC module but I am very happy with my choice. I am Purchasing the Kore 7th but I think I will stick with the DOS

I think I’m convinced ! Lol

 

[jsker]

I think I’m convinced ! Lol

Two things I have founds

If you mount the DOS against the wall, cut and put a rubber mouse pad between the unit and the wall to stop the vibration from being transferred between the unit and the wall.
There might be a clicking noise with the plastic heads. Get some silicone grease and grease around the head were the meet the unit and this will stop the clicking.

 

[pfoxgrover]

"Tha Bizness Reef Tank" youtuber has a great video about programming an apex to do awc without a DOS. He used the pmup but I think I would use cheap DC pumps instead.

 

[Heavymman]

"Tha Bizness Reef Tank" youtuber has a great video about programming an apex to do awc without a DOS. He used the pmup but I think I would use cheap DC pumps instead.

Thanks! I will watch

 

[radiata]

I thought the same but the DOS is designed for AWC. The DOS speeds up for the amount one wants to change. The DOS can change 31 gallons per day, so you can do you bi weekly if you would like to set it up that way. Link to more info. I was going to go another rout with the Kore 5th with the AWC module but I am very happy with my choice. I am Purchasing the Kore 7th but I think I will stick with the DOS

Where did your 31 gallons per day metric come from?

 

[LoneStarReef]

I have the exact setup you are talking about here. Works perfectly. I will post my programming as soon as I can.

Feel free to bump me if you don’t hear from me by the end of the week. Busy week with work travel.

 

[Belgian Anthias]

If a double dosing pump is used to change water, one pump is used to pump out used water and the other pump for adding the new water? How effective is this method as the removed water will be a mix of used and new water? And how the transfer rate will influence the effectiveness? Or is it possible programming such a double pump to remove first a certain amount of old water by pump 1 and after this is done add exactly the same amount of new water by pump 2 to obtain an effectiveness of 100% ?

 

[jsker]

Where did your 31 gallons per day metric come from?

 

[n2585722]

I use peristaltic pumps also. I have an Archon and use DP1 pumps to do this. If you have an Apex the DOS would be the way to go. If you don't then use peristaltic pumps of some type that can be calibrated to add and remove the same amount of water in a given amount of time. Also I remove water from the refugium which has a slower flow rate and add to the return section of the sump.