Bacteria? Something Else?

[Adalius]

I was on vacation for a bit over a week while my tank is still going through the uglies (so I don't have much in it except some snails and copepods). When I left I was getting the slightest bit of hair algae on the snails shells and just a small bit here or there on the rock. Nothing bad at all. When I came back, there was almost no hair algae to be seen but there are these suuuuuper long stringy (and even tangled into knots in places) filaments. They are almost completely translucent, way too long to be hair algae, and do not have any bubbles in them so I don't think they are dinos. I've had bacterial blooms but usually that's short and 'fuzzy' not super long and stringy. It's not worms since they are on the glass too and have no base to them at all (plus I used all dry rock to build my scape).

Any ideas?

 

[James M]

Looks like a bacteria bloom

 

[Hemmdog]

I was on vacation for a bit over a week while my tank is still going through the uglies (so I don't have much in it except some snails and copepods). When I left I was getting the slightest bit of hair algae on the snails shells and just a small bit here or there on the rock. Nothing bad at all. When I came back, there was almost no hair algae to be seen but there are these suuuuuper long stringy (and even tangled into knots in places) filaments. They are almost completely translucent, way too long to be hair algae, and do not have any bubbles in them so I don't think they are dinos. I've had bacterial blooms but usually that's short and 'fuzzy' not super long and stringy. It's not worms since they are on the glass too and have no base to them at all (plus I used all dry rock to build my scape).

Any ideas?

Snails breeding

 

[Adalius]

Snails breeding

I find that highly unlikely. The species I have tend to leave small white circles or, alternately, squiggles on the glass. To my knowledge none lay eggs in 5" long translucent hair like strands free floating and only anchored on one end.

 

[Hemmdog]

I find that highly unlikely. The species I have tend to leave small white circles or, alternately, squiggles on the glass. To my knowledge none lay eggs in 5" long translucent hair like strands free floating and only anchored on one end.

Oh I see now. The picture looked cloudy at first glance. Not sure. Sorry.

 

[Adalius]

Looks like a bacteria bloom

That is/was my best guess, I've just *never* seen it make anything that long before. If it isn't all balled up on itself it can stretch 5-6" long.

 

[Neoalchemist]

Almost looks like hair algea that is dying. Mostly when using some type of algea treatment the individual algea strands turn a wispy and white just before they start to disintegrate. If this is the case make sure your nutrients didn't bottom out while you were on vacation. 0 nutrients is not a good thing especially with a very young tank.

 

[Adalius]

Almost looks like hair algea that is dying. Mostly when using some type of algea treatment the individual algea strands turn a wispy and white just before they start to disintegrate. If this is the case make sure your nutrients didn't bottom out while you were on vacation. 0 nutrients is not a good thing especially with a very young tank.

It's possible. I've just never seen hair algae get that long in any of my other tanks. Nutrients may have bottomed but I'm not super concerned with that since the only livestock are snails and pods. Easy enough to rectify before stocking.

 

[Neoalchemist]

It's possible. I've just never seen hair algae get that long in any of my other tanks. Nutrients may have bottomed but I'm not super concerned with that since the only livestock are snails and pods. Easy enough to rectify before stocking.

Not quite, your entire healthy bacteria and microbe population rely on those nitrates and phosphates. If nutrients are too low, instead of bacteria processing your nutrients it will be either bryopsis, dinoflagellates, or chrisophytes. None of which you want. They are much harder to deal with than your normal high nutrient algea.

 

[Adalius]

Not quite, your entire healthy bacteria and microbe population rely on those nitrates and phosphates. If nutrients are too low, instead of bacteria processing your nutrients it will be either bryopsis, dinoflagellates, or chrisophytes. None of which you want. They are much harder to deal with than your normal high nutrient algea.

I guess I should have been more specific. It wouldn't wipe them out fully since I left the auto feeder on to dump a little bit of food in every other day while I was gone. So it's possible that it got down low enough that the algae died but it would seem unlikely that the entire bacteria would die since there was some nutrients being imported the entire time to continue the cycle. I'll run some tests today.

 

[Neoalchemist]

I guess I should have been more specific. It wouldn't wipe them out fully since I left the auto feeder on to dump a little bit of food in every other day while I was gone. So it's possible that it got down low enough that the algae died but it would seem unlikely that the entire bacteria would die since there was some nutrients being imported the entire time to continue the cycle. I'll run some tests today.

Check out the texture of the strands if They are bacteria they should be nothing more than slime. Dying hair algea should still have texture.

 

[Neoalchemist]

I guess I should have been more specific. It wouldn't wipe them out fully since I left the auto feeder on to dump a little bit of food in every other day while I was gone. So it's possible that it got down low enough that the algae died but it would seem unlikely that the entire bacteria would die since there was some nutrients being imported the entire time to continue the cycle. I'll run some tests today.

Nutrient deficiency can still occur when feeding especially with low stocking. There's too many variables to consider. Food sources can be high or low in either po4 or no3 and a deficiency in either can be bad. No or few fish means wasted food skips or much more slowly feeds the nitrogen cycle making it hard to predict how it influences the nitrogen cycle. Bacteria populations are closely tied to the amount and type of nutrient they consume and if their numbers get too low algea will step in to the void much more quickly than the bacteria population can rebound.
Imo. Po4 management is as important as alk management and even more so in a young tank.

 

[Adalius]

Nutrient deficiency can still occur when feeding especially with low stocking. There's too many variables to consider. Food sources can be high or low in either po4 or no3 and a deficiency in either can be bad. No or few fish means wasted food skips or much more slowly feeds the nitrogen cycle making it hard to predict how it influences the nitrogen cycle. Bacteria populations are closely tied to the amount and type of nutrient they consume and if their numbers get too low algea will step in to the void much more quickly than the bacteria population can rebound.
Imo. Po4 management is as important as alk management and even more so in a young tank.

Welp. Color me surprised. It is algae. Confirmed by feel. I've never seen it get strands that long in a tank, in my outdoor pond sure, but not in a tank, especially so fast. NO3 didnt bottom out, but it's pretty low. Ammonia is still 0 even with the feedings so it didnt wipe out enough of anything to full on crash. Other params look decent. Only test I'm missing is the PO4.

Was going to start a very light stocking today (Memorial Day sales at all the LFS's) so I think I'm going to continue with that plan and just take it slow.

 

[Neoalchemist]

Welp. Color me surprised. It is algae. Confirmed by feel. I've never seen it get strands that long in a tank, in my outdoor pond sure, but not in a tank, especially so fast. NO3 didnt bottom out, but it's pretty low. Ammonia is still 0 even with the feedings so it didnt wipe out enough of anything to full on crash. Other params look decent. Only test I'm missing is the PO4.

Was going to start a very light stocking today (Memorial Day sales at all the LFS's) so I think I'm going to continue with that plan and just take it slow.

Yes, good, ...Mostly.[emoji4] A must in my opinion (even more important than a skimmer) is the Hanna ulr phosphorus checker #HI736, a supply of regeants and the conversion chart. It will be your best friend throughout the life of the tank.
Also when hair algea grow long and wispy it usually means you need to add some flow. But I'm afraid your algea likely consumed either all of your po4 and is now starving out or some other required nutrient like iron is depleted. Get some fish waste in there asap. But be careful not to over load. There's very little to no nutrient stored in dry rock for your microbial community to fall back on so they will need input from you to flourish. When parts of that community shift of crash the really bad stuff can sneak in and once they get going they work hard to to keep good microbes from returning.

 

[Neoalchemist]

It might also be a good idea to add a piece of highly established live rock to the tank to boost your healthy populations. Give this some serious consideration though because of the risk of pests. In a perfect world you would know the history of the rock and it's associated pests.

 

[Adalius]

Also when hair algea grow long and wispy it usually means you need to add some flow.

If I add any more flow I'm going to have water sploshing over the top I've got 2 MP40's and a COR20 pushing some serious water and the long strands are literally right in front of one of the MP40's (maybe 4-5 inches in front of it). Either way, off to the LFS to start small with some of my more basic list. My end goal is a mandarin so I'm going to need to a) focus on my hardy stock that doesn't eat pods b) start rebuilding my pod colony since it was flourishing pretty good before I left c) be patient.

I'll check out the Hanna checker if they have one, otherwise I'll get one ordered. Not sure why I forgot to get a PO4 test, I have every other one under the sun. *shrug*. Thanks for the input.

 

[Neoalchemist]

If I add any more flow I'm going to have water sploshing over the top I've got 2 MP40's and a COR20 pushing some serious water and the long strands are literally right in front of one of the MP40's (maybe 4-5 inches in front of it). Either way, off to the LFS to start small with some of my more basic list. My end goal is a mandarin so I'm going to need to a) focus on my hardy stock that doesn't eat pods b) start rebuilding my pod colony since it was flourishing pretty good before I left c) be patient.

I'll check out the Hanna checker if they have one, otherwise I'll get one ordered. Not sure why I forgot to get a PO4 test, I have every other one under the sun. *shrug*. Thanks for the input.

Good plan, you are positioned well for the tank to start rocking. I would suggest the Mandarin be the future goal for the tank. With that as a goal it will foster a healthy theme for the tank. Mandarins can be tough and need a "messy" tank from a biodiversity standpoint.
Anyone that told me they introduced a Mandarin in the first year or into a tank without a healthy diverse algea population, my answer to them would be that the clock is ticking on when the Mandarin is going to starve.
Oh, and you have some tough hair algea or maybe it's growing long in response to high flow. Or it's reaching into the water column for nutrients because there are none in the rock to feed on.

 

[Neoalchemist]

[emoji15] wish I was going to the lfs.[emoji24]
Pick me up on the way??[emoji14]