Bicolor Dwarf angel breathing fast

[mehaffydr]

I have a Bicolor Angel in Quarantine along with a small Clown Tang and a small Orange shoulder tang and 1 small Pajama Cardinal. I have had them for 1 week. They have been in Quarantine with Copper between 2.25 and 2.5 for 6 days. The tangs are eating well and seam to be doing good. The Bicolor angel seams healthy but not eating much if any and now today seams to be breathing very fast.
Should I consider a freshwater dip in case of something like flukes?
Water params
1.22 Salinity
77 Deg. temp
2.24 Copper
PH 8.2
I have not measured Phosphate or Nitrate because it is a clean QT tank with freshly mixed saltwater.
I have a HOB filter and have been doing about 50% water change every 3 days.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I have a Bicolor Angel in Quarantine along with a small Clown Tang and a small Orange shoulder tang and 1 small Pajama Cardinal. I have had them for 1 week. They have been in Quarantine with Copper between 2.25 and 2.5 for 6 days. The tangs are eating well and seam to be doing good. The Bicolor angel seams healthy but not eating much if any and now today seams to be breathing very fast.
Should I consider a freshwater dip in case of something like flukes?
Water params
1.22 Salinity
77 Deg. temp
2.24 Copper
PH 8.2
I have not measured Phosphate or Nitrate because it is a clean QT tank with freshly mixed saltwater.
I have a HOB filter and have been doing about 50% water change every 3 days.

What copper product are you using?
What are you measuring the copper with?
Have you measured the ammonia? What test kit for that?
Can you post a short video?

I'm trying to rule out other issues, but pygmy angel can sometimes react poorly to copper.

Jay

 

[mehaffydr]

What copper product are you using?
What are you measuring the copper with?
Have you measured the ammonia? What test kit for that?
Can you post a short video?

I'm trying to rule out other issues, but pygmy angel can sometimes react poorly to copper.

Jay

Copper is Copper Power
Testing with Hanna Checker
Testing ammonia with salifert.

I will try to get a video.

I do have another tank I could put the Angel in without copper if needed.

 

[mehaffydr]

Jay thank you for responding. Unfortunately the Angel Fish did not make the night. I have a Orange shoulder tang that was in the same QT tank and seams to not be doing well.
He has been in copper for the last 6 days using Copper Power at between 2.00 and 2.50 mostly right around 2.28 - 2.3, He is very thin and not eating mush if any. Today I took him out of the QT with copper and did a 5 min. Freshwater dip. He seams to have handled that no problem and now he is in fresh clean QT without copper. I think that I really need to get him eating and monitor for Ick or Velvet and administer copper if required but so far I have not seen anything that makes me think these are present. His breathing does seam to be kinda of fast.
I have the follow medications and just curiuos if you think I should be administering anything or just try and get him eating?Below is pick from top down to shown how thin and also a video.

Video


Prazi Power
General Cure
Metroplex
Focus
Ruby Red
kick Ick

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Jay thank you for responding. Unfortunately the Angel Fish did not make the night. I have a Orange shoulder tang that was in the same QT tank and seams to not be doing well.
He has been in copper for the last 6 days using Copper Power at between 2.00 and 2.50 mostly right around 2.28 - 2.3, He is very thin and not eating mush if any. Today I took him out of the QT with copper and did a 5 min. Freshwater dip. He seams to have handled that no problem and now he is in fresh clean QT without copper. I think that I really need to get him eating and monitor for Ick or Velvet and administer copper if required but so far I have not seen anything that makes me think these are present. His breathing does seam to be kinda of fast.
I have the follow medications and just curiuos if you think I should be administering anything or just try and get him eating?Below is pick from top down to shown how thin and also a video.

Video


Prazi Power
General Cure
Metroplex
Focus
Ruby Red
kick Ick

Here is the trouble: copper power is very mild and slow to work. People see rapid breathing in fish being dosed with it and so they think copper toxicity, when the actual problem is velvet that hasn’t been controlled. If that’s the case, then pulling the copper is the wrong thing to do.
Does it look better this morning? A FW dip and move should buy you some more time if it is velvet.
Jay

 

[mehaffydr]

Jay again thank you for the continued support. Today the Tang looks OK a couple of observations from this evening as I don't get to see them in the morning because I go to work at 6:00am.
Overall he is looking decent I did feed some LRS frozen and he seams to eat but I can't say for sure hes actually swallowing the food. Some pieces he takes in but spits out. It did look like he ate some but can't be sure.
He does seam to be breathing hard trying to count I would say at least 100 gill beats per minimum or more.
He is now isolated in his own 20 gallon tank with HOB filter and power head pointed at surface.
I am concerned about the fast breathing as I have lost fish to Velvet in the past which is what made me a believer in Quarantine.
He has not shown the classic sign of swimming at power head like my other fish I lost to Velvet did.

I do have Copper Safe and Copper Power so at this time would you recommend the Copper safe or do you think some observation time is better? I'm just concerned to wait too long as I know from past experience how fast Velvet will kill.

The Pajama Cardinal and the Clown tang are in a separate tank with Copper Power since 12/03 and are eating great and seam to be fine. At first these fish were all together.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Jay again thank you for the continued support. Today the Tang looks OK a couple of observations from this evening as I don't get to see them in the morning because I go to work at 6:00am.
Overall he is looking decent I did feed some LRS frozen and he seams to eat but I can't say for sure hes actually swallowing the food. Some pieces he takes in but spits out. It did look like he ate some but can't be sure.
He does seam to be breathing hard trying to count I would say at least 100 gill beats per minimum or more.
He is now isolated in his own 20 gallon tank with HOB filter and power head pointed at surface.
I am concerned about the fast breathing as I have lost fish to Velvet in the past which is what made me a believer in Quarantine.
He has not shown the classic sign of swimming at power head like my other fish I lost to Velvet did.

I do have Copper Safe and Copper Power so at this time would you recommend the Copper safe or do you think some observation time is better? I'm just concerned to wait too long as I know from past experience how fast Velvet will kill.

The Pajama Cardinal and the Clown tang are in a separate tank with Copper Power since 12/03 and are eating great and seam to be fine. At first these fish were all together.

First thing on the feeding - can you try mysid shrimp diced into smaller pieces, or maybe even some brine shrimp?

I prefer coppersafe, make sure that the powerhead is actually breaking the surface tension of the water - an air stone is better.

Jay

 

[mehaffydr]

First thing on the feeding - can you try mysid shrimp diced into smaller pieces, or maybe even some brine shrimp?

I prefer coppersafe, make sure that the powerhead is actually breaking the surface tension of the water - an air stone is better.

Jay

Jay Again I can't thank you enough for your valuable input. So tonight when I got home the Tang is looking much better. No fast breathing and just swimming and looking better.

I slowly brought up copper level with Copper safe to 2.2 which is what is at now and has been for about 24 hours.
I feed PE Mysis tonight and he ate them right up and aggressively.

So with the coppersafe at a good level, fish looking good and now eating I am much more optimistic about the potential outcome.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Jay Again I can't thank you enough for your valuable input. So tonight when I got home the Tang is looking much better. No fast breathing and just swimming and looking better.

I slowly brought up copper level with Copper safe to 2.2 which is what is at now and has been for about 24 hours.
I feed PE Mysis tonight and he ate them right up and aggressively.

So with the coppersafe at a good level, fish looking good and now eating I am much more optimistic about the potential outcome.

Well, that is pretty fast for copper to have worked. I guess we’ll take it, but keep a close eye on it for a relapse.
Jay

 

[mehaffydr]

It may have been the freshwater dip that helped on the short term ?
I will be constantly monitoring and feeding Mysis while trying to introduce some variety of foods

 

[mehaffydr]

Tonight the Tang is still looking good and eating Mysis. Tonight fairly aggressive eating so I am more encouraged than ever. I was really concerned this guy was a goner.

 

[mehaffydr]

Just thought I would give an update on my Orange Shoulder Tang.
So far doing good. Eating great and starting to noticeably put on some weight. Still a little thin but looking much better. Now any time I get near the tank he is swimming straight the the corner where I always put in the food. Mostly feeding Mysis but some LRS fish frenzy.
Still in Cooper Safe at about 2.2-2.3