Bio pellets stripping tank??

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The SRO reactor is not a re-circulating reactor so managing how much flow goes through the reactor is a challenge since you still need a minimum flow to keep them tumbling. The only thing you can do is to manage the quantity of pellets in the reactor, and keep the flow low. As you lower the qty of pellets the total volume of water the bacteria they host is able to strip completely goes down.

Normally you want to drive the output from your pellet reactor to your skimmer so it can remove the byproducts of the bacteria, which are very nutrient rich (carbs in the form of suggers). If the output from your reactor is in the same chamber as the skimmer perhaps you should consider putting the output in to he next chamber down the flow in the sump. This would allow the nutrients to flow through your display and give your corals a chance to use some of it before the skimmer removes it from the system. I personally would be careful with this as it has the potential to be a really big change to the nutrient flow in your system.

Regardless you need good nitrate and Phosphate test kits, you should test once or twice a week for at least two weeks before making any changes. Then monitor the changes over several weeks until you see the change stabilize. The last thing you want to do is keep making changes and not know what effects it is having or if it has even stabilized. I would only make fast changes if you suddenly saw a large dangerous change. For example if you move the reactor output as I suggested you could try and find that after a week your nitrates go up 10 ppm, and the 2nd week they go up another 10 or more PPM. Then I would definitely changes things back the way they had been, watch until they stabilize, and then try to make a smaller change (only direct a tiny portion of the reactor effluent past the skimmer chamber). Then start monitoring again.

Personally I like the Reef Dynamics concept for the use of bio-pellets. Use them in a re-circulating reactor where you have separate fine control over the volume of water that flows through the reactor, while still being able to manage your tumble. Then plumb the effluent directly in front of the intake to the skimmer pump so the effluent is sucked in, the nutrients in the effluent are removed by the skimmer and super clean water is returned to the tank. That is a 99% removal of the nutrients you are trying to control, while still allowing you to control how much of you system's water is stripped.

I am not doing this yet but I have plans and some equipment to go in that direction. When I do I have been toying with the idea of letting some of the effluent dose the tank after every regular feeding of the fish. I plan on having a controller by then and shutting off the skimmer, and return pumps in my sump during feeding times. If I leave the reactor on it will build up effluent in the skimmer section of the sump, and when the return pump is turned back on, there will be more effluent in the skimmer chamber than the skimmer can process out before it flows in to the next section of the sump. That should give the DT a nice dose over the next hour or so while the skimmer works to remove it.
 
Personally, I find it much easier than trying to line up a color on a color wheel for the alk test. The phosphate one is a pain with the powder reagent but gives me the best accuracy of all the kits I have tried. I've heard a lot of people like the Elos phosphate kit as well.

Even when I was hand dosing for Ca and alk, my colors showed well on my tank. Getting alk to be stable would definitely benefit but I got my hunch on the phosphate being the issue. With 25 dishes, even with biopellets, I'd be surprised if it was nitrates... but this hobby has surprised me plenty already.

Lights should be fine.
 
I use Hanna for alkalinity and phosphate.

I run ecoBAK pellets on my tank but I run much less than recommended and control remaining nitrates and phosphate through GFO and water changes. The colors of my acros are improving with that regimen and stability through dosing.
 
Hey Matt, what changes, if any, did you make and how have they affected your tank?
 
[...]Personally I like the Reef Dynamics concept for the use of bio-pellets. Use them in a re-circulating reactor where you have separate fine control over the volume of water that flows through the reactor, while still being able to manage your tumble. Then plumb the effluent directly in front of the intake to the skimmer pump so the effluent is sucked in, the nutrients in the effluent are removed by the skimmer and super clean water is returned to the tank. That is a 99% removal of the nutrients you are trying to control, while still allowing you to control how much of you system's water is stripped.[...]

The RD design does seem to be one of the smartest.

One important thing to hold in mind when talking about "99% removal" which sound nice...miraculous, in fact... :angel:

...what you really mean (if I may) is that that skimmer is processing 99% of the pellet reactor's effluent. Hardly miraculous, but a big improvement to the average deployment! :thumb:

The basic physical limits of skimmer performance tap out between 20%-30% removal.

Probably higher on that scale if you're willing to skim wet...lower if you skim dry...but that's a small difference in the grand scheme. The skimmer, by its nature, will leave A LOT behind even under optimum circumstances.

-Matt
 
Hi guys I brought nutrient levels up a bit by feeding an insane amount finally getting a sm bit of algae on my glass some acros looking a tad better but lost birds nest and stylo frags I'm also getting a cal reactor and home to have it hooked up by July once the cal reactor is dialed in I will know weather it's really the pellets etc.... Will keep posted
 
To me it seems too good to be true...given how little we know about how carbon dosing actually works (vs what we all presume is happening but that the research shows is not), it probably is.

Can you elaborate on how we know very little about how carbon dosing works? I have an sps-dominated tank with pellets and a heavy fish load, so if we don't understand it properly I'd sure like to know.
 
Oh, I see you just don't like carbon dosing :) I'll join that thread so we can keep this one on track.

I wouldn't say that's accurate.....I've dosed vinegar in my own tank at various times. As a tool, it has a purpose. In my case to ameliorate kalk for safer and more potent dosing. I think the business about using carbon dosing to feed corals is interesting, but pure conjecture.

I just think in general (with some exceptions as above) carbon dosing is used blindly as a panacea for over-crowded tanks. If you wanna know, this is my main beef. (If your tank is not over crowded and does not accumulate nutrients, then this doesn't apply to you....and unless you are deliberately experimenting, I would question why you are using carbon dosing.) And as noted/linked earlier, every bit of research we have (we need more) indicates that bio pellets (for example) do not work the way we think they do....we have a faint understanding of carbon dosing - at best.

Overcrowding a tank seems to be a natural human tendency...maximizing one's investment I suppose. Stress level of animals is usually impossible to detect unless the situation has gotten severe, so nutrient accumulation "was" the one thing that would make for an early warning and prevent or at least limit overstocking, at least in some people's cases.

Carbon dosing is being used to eliminate this nutrient accumulation, so now more people than ever over stock their tanks and many are over stocked to a greater degree. An over stocked tank is like a house of cards anyway....carbon dosing just lets you build it even higher.

-Matt

P.S. In spite of my tangent/explanation, this isn't a thread about overcrowding, BTW. :) But it is a thread about using one of a pellet rector's theoretical features - feeding corals. So this line of discussion is still relevant here. There's no research to show that pellet reactors work in this manner. There is research that shows they do not work in this manner. (This isn't to say that nothing is happening, or that pellets can't work somehow.....just that we have little or no idea what's going on or how it's happening.)
 
Appreciate the different views thank you !
I'm not giving up on them just yet
2 days ago I removed a little less then half the pellets acro looking a bit better I think
 
I dont think its the bio pellets causing you problems. Ive been running Ecobak for 3 years straight on a non recirculating skimmer and have pretty good success with my SPS.

I think you are on the right track with gaining stability through a calRx and by continuing to feed heavy. The balance is found with the right amount of fish and feeding. Not letting your N03 and p04 get too low. I have had high readings at certain times for months and never lost any color or growth. As long as the skimmer is capable of removing what you are putting in you shouldnt have any issues with slimes/algaes. You fish will be fat and your corals will have good color and growth.

Definitely get a hanna checker for ALK and Phos.
 
Something is up because my parameters r well within range and I'm getting little to no PE of encrusting
I'm gonna change my mh bulbs
When I switched to 2 250 w mh pendants I just used bulbs that came with the used pendants I doubt that could be the issue but who knows
 
I don't think you mentioned the lighting switch before.....that alone could be enough to cause your problems.

How long ago was the switch and what was your previous lighting?

-Matt

P.S. You should have good light levels down to 24" or so. To check, use a lux meter (hand-helds are cheap, or free app for your smartphone) and measure your levels at the water surface. Anywhere between 10,000 lux (full daylight) and around 60,000 or 80,000 lux (direct sunlight) and you're giving them all the light they'd see in nature and keep them happy. I have one tank around 14,000 lux and the other around 60,000 lux and don't notice a ton of difference, FWIW.
 
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Mcarroll u have been very help full thank you for ur responses and taking ur time to help!
I switched to mh and had good results for a few weeks then things started to crap out
I'm now thinking that temp swig is my major issue going from 77 -82 5 degree over the day wasn't aware it was swinging that much but I have a friend who's tank is amazing and says his tank is about same swing!

I have a plan gonna buy 2 new 14k phoniex bulbs hook up cal reactor also was gonna run a tube from my skimmer to outside to bring ph up I plugged in the ph controller and ph 7.8 or so !

So the plan is get a Hanna po4 checker
Change mh lights
Hook up and dial in cal reactor

Then get a few new frags see how they do
 
Mcarroll u have been very help full thank you for ur responses and taking ur time to help!
I switched to mh and had good results for a few weeks then things started to crap out
I'm now thinking that temp swig is my major issue going from 77 -82 5 degree over the day wasn't aware it was swinging that much but I have a friend who's tank is amazing and says his tank is about same swing!

I have a plan gonna buy 2 new 14k phoniex bulbs hook up cal reactor also was gonna run a tube from my skimmer to outside to bring ph up I plugged in the ph controller and ph 7.8 or so !

So the plan is get a Hanna po4 checker
Change mh lights
Hook up and dial in cal reactor

Then get a few new frags see how they do

No problem!

Definitely work to improve overall water quality and stability, but I suspect your corals may be leaning toward bleaching due to the new lights. Of course the other stressors in play also figure into this too.

Anytime you change lighting, especially to something stronger (which isn't always apparent to the naked eye), you should give the corals a few weeks at reduced lighting levels, slowly increasing to the new light's desired level. Unless you got a fancy, dimmable fixture, this will probably mean that you reduce the hours the lights are on and possibly raise the lights or put a partial block between the lights and tank like window screen. Any one should work, but a combination might be more convenient. Do what's easiest. Maybe just cut lights back to 2-3 hours a day, maybe 4, and add an hour or two every week for a while until you're back to normal schedule?

The temp swings aren't too bad on their own, but they'll add up with other stressors on the coral, so best to fix it. My solution was to run no heaters after the lights come on, the a timer brings the heaters back on when the lights go out. My tank stayed at 82.9 for about four years straight this way. Corals grew like weeds. :) Tune the heaters so you have around .5°F swing from day to night. (less is ok)

-Matt
 
I have the heaters on a controller set at 77
During day tank is 80 goes up too 82 with halide then at night 77-78 would setting the heat for 80 keep temp between 80-82
 
I have the heaters on a controller set at 77
During day tank is 80 goes up too 82 with halide then at night 77-78 would setting the heat for 80 keep temp between 80-82

Try what I did and use no heaters after the lights come on....see what temperature the lights will hold on their own.

Assuming they are warming the water like we think, it will be a good temperature. Set your controller so the heaters come on at lights out and maintain that same daytime temperature...or as close as you can get it.

-Matt
 
So I pulled the bio pellets about 2 weeks ago !
Already seeing improvement in the few sps I have
 

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