Biopellets and Prodibio

[acolotto]

Hey Guys,

I have seen a lot of questions asked about using these two in conjunction and also a lot of questions about prodibio. I have been using prodibio for over 2 years with great results and just ordered a TLF 150 to give biopellets a shot. Figured I start a thread to show progress, coral growth, algae control, and parameter changes with starting and long term use of biopellets while using prodibio (Also first time using biopellets in general).

For you that do not know Prodibio is a french based company that provides different products in vials that in essence is a simplified version of carbon dosing and also has amino acids and a coral super food to help keep some nutrients in your system. If prodibio is used correctly you will obtain a ULNS. You start with a 6 week period of dosing Biodigest (Bacteria) and Bioptim (Food Source for bacteria) every 2 weeks to bring Nitrates and Phosphates down, also during this time you will notice less time required cleaning glass and an overall decrease in nuisance algae. After the 6 weeks you continue dosing biodigest and bioptim, but add in to the 2 week rotation CoralVits and ReefBooster (amino acids and other foods and vitamins for corals, fish, and invertebrates), these make it so your corals will not starve to death because of no nutrients.

Biopellets are used in a reactor to build/feed bacteria strains that consume nitrates and some phosphates, that then get removed via skimming. As stated above this will be my first time using biopellets. From some research online I have determined I'm going to treat my tank as a 75 gallon (even though total water volume is closer to 100) and use TLF NPX Bioplastics in a TLF Phosban 150 reactor with a mag 3 pump. They recommend using 100mL of Biopellets for every 25 gallons of water. The reason I'm planning for 75g instead of 100 gallons, is because biopellets really strip your tank of its nutrients and I rather be safe then sorry, also i will still continue to use prodibio which will also help in keeping nutrients low.

OK enough of that, now on to what im doing and what I am trying to accomplish. First thing is my tank is a 90 gallon sps tank with a 15-20 gallon sump/refugium. I do not 2 part dose instead get by doing 10 gallon weekly water changes and running Kalkwasser in my ato. I do water changes every weekend on Sunday and this Sunday will be when I start up the Biopellets. This tank is almost a year old (in January) but everything is from my old 55 reef that was running for 4 to 5 years before the upgrade. I will put the reactor near my skimmer, and have the output of the reactor run right at the input of the skimmer. I use a TUNZE DOC 9016 skimmer and hopefully should be plenty to remove the excess bacteria output from the reactor. My reasoning for starting Biopellets is that i have this brown furry algae that I cannot get to stop growing on my back and side glass. My tank parameters are usually 0 Nitrates 0.03 Phosphates 420 Calc 9 Alk 1400 Mag and 7.9 -8.3 pH. I know my nitrates are not really 0 as i still have this algae growing on my glass in the tank, pretty quickly too! So in short I plan on using biopellets to keep nitrates as low as possible and prodibio Biodigest to keep phosphates down and to help build bacteria in the reactor. As stated above I am treating my tank as a 75 gallon and with the biopellet directions at max i would use 300 mL of biopellets. As reading from others, you want to start slow with pellet and use 1/2 the recommended amount when you first start. I am going to start using 1/3rd the recommended value and only use 100 mL. Also a big thing with the pellets is they take 4 to 8 weeks to really kick in, so in learning this I will run the 100 mL of pellets for 3 to 4 weeks before I up it to 2/3rds (200 mL) and then again wait 3 to 4 weeks until using the full recommended ammount of 300 mL. My reasoning for starting with lower amounts then recommended is because I do not want to strip the tank of nutrients to quickly, you want a slow period where nitrates drop to 0 and phosphates maintain around 0.02 to 0.05. Once they are fully broke in and running my goal is that i can use these guys to maintain a ULNS, get rid of glass algae, and increase coral growth/color. Also possibly as a way to cut back on WC to possibly once a month and start 2 part to maintain Calc, Alk, and Mag (but haven't decided this yet as I've been doing weekly WC for over 4 years now its basically muscle memory at this point lol)

I will try and document my experience and all the steps as best i can, at least once a week. I will start this sunday by taking all parameters as a starting point, getting the reactor set up in dialed in (with video to show proper tumbling of pellets), breaking and using prodibio vials, and pictures of overall reef and corals to track growth. Also I know sometimes I am not the best at explaining things, if you see anything I am doing wrong or know a better way please provide your input! Also any questions about anything feel free to ask and ill answer to the best of my ability. I am no scientist but figure a detailed thread with my starting process, weekly param and photo updates, and overall experience might help another reefer in the future!

 

[143MPCo]

Following, I've used it but, with mixed results.

 

[SunnyX]

Good luck with the biopellets. They should really kick into gear around the 6-8 week mark. DO NOT dose Bioptim while running pellets as they accomplish the same thing and could lead to a carbon overdose, crashing the system.

I used Prodibio about 10 years ago and was very happy with the results. I especially liked the Reefbooster as it essentially replaced much of what had been stripped out of the tank by carbon dosing. The aminos, lipids, and vitamins in the formula contributed to a healthy system and I had incredible growth and color. The only down side was that I had to turn my skimmer off for 24 hours, or else it would overflow from the lipids.

I did use pellets for about a year but in the end I did away with them as I saw no advantage over vodka or Prodibio. The key with carbon dosing is finding the right balance of nutrients. I found it expensive and much harder to tweak my system when running biopellets. When dosing vodka or Bioptim I could scale back dosage based on system nutrients. With biopellets there wasn't much I could do to correct the nutrient load other than pour excess amounts of food or aminos into the tank. While Reefbooster did wonders for my aquariums it gets expensive when I need to pour in twice the recommended amount because I couldn't control the biopellets nutrient reduction.

Biopellets are great but they make an already advanced aquarium keeping technique even tougher.

Good luck and please keep us updated.

 

[acolotto]

Good luck and please keep us updated.

Yea that's what I was thinking about the bioptim, I will not be using that in conjunction with biopellets. I will be dosing the biodigest and using reef booster and coral vits to supply nutrients. I also feed a rotation of lrs, rods, nori, and pellets everyday. Also twice weekly feed reef roids to sps and mysis to scoly and acans.

My livestock is 2 clarkii clowns, 2 yellow watchman goby's and pistol shrimp, six line wrasse, yellow tang, and scooter blenny. Coral 35+ sps frags/colonies and a couple lps scattered around.

I'm hoping with my livestock and heavy feeding I'll be able to maintain nutrients as I have done in past just using prodibio.

Did have a set back for starting sunday though, as my package did not get delivered, should be here Monday and will get up and running then, also will post start pic and params.

 

[NightStar]

When you dose prodibio, do you dose or feed anything else? Acropower, fuel, potassium? What do you feed the tank? Just the fish, or things like coral frenzy?

 

[Downbeach]

Here's a copy/paste, from another thread, about my experience with BP's. To your point specifically since I didn't add it in this message, although I didn't go by their dosing recommendations, since I had both the biodigest and the bioptim, I would add 2 vials each of them about once a month.
When I started adding SPS to my system, they weren't coloring up as I had expected, and found that my N's and P's were a little on the high side(for SPS). After some research/reading, I started to carbon dose using Vodka. This brought the N's and P's down a bit, but I started to get some cyano. I switched to vinegar, the cyano disappeared, and the SPS improved. This required daily dosing, and a lot of trial and error, to say nothing of the fact that I was burning through my NO3/PO4 test kits. As an aside, at this point I found that the PO4 kits were not going to do the job, and went to a Hanna meter(good move). Being somewhat lazy, and getting tired of buying test kits, I decided to try BP's, since they were touted to be a "set it and forget it" solution. As with most claims made of products in the hobby, I was very cynical of this statement, but felt it was worth a try, so I bought a BP insert from BRS for ~ $10.00, along with the smallest amount of pellets I could get. I successfully ran BP's for a number of years following the recommendations I found on line(BRS/Reef Octopus/et al), and a bit of fine tuning with experience. When I started, I went through the typical start up regime until I reached the recommended amount (BRS) for my system. I started with my re-purposed BRS reactor I had been running GFO in, and replaced it with a RO reactor once it appeared the BP's were working. During this time I took the GFO off line, but continued to run the fuge. After a short time, the Chaeto started to fall apart, and it became apparent that I wasn't going to be able to run both the BP's and the fuge at the same time successfully, due to the fact that there weren't going to be enough N's and P's for both systems. After removing the Chaeto and the necessary lighting, the pellets began to do their thing in earnest. So my take away/experience from using them was: Use the amount that will work best with your system. Make sure you have the proper flow(just fluidized) going through the reactor. Too slow, and the pellets will begin to clump and clog the reactor, too fast, and you'll just flush the bacteria off the pellets before they can fully colonize, and do their job. Use a reactor intended for BP's, I started with a re-purposed BRS reactor(my GFO), but found the RO reactor made for BP's provided the right flow throughout the entire reactor, and was noticeably better. Also a reactor of the right size is important; I found that filling the reactor(a RO BR110 in my case) about half way when idle, and running it at about 2/3 when fluidized was the sweet spot. A reactor that is too small will not allow you to provide enough flow, and cause the pellet to clump and clog, using a reactor that is too big will cause too much flow, and slough off the bacteria before they can do their job Use and adjustable flow pump(Eheim +2000 in my case), or a valve that you can adjust the flow as needed(lowering the flow as the pellet are consumed). Although the reactor wasn't in black out condition, there was no light in the cabinet once I removed the Chaeto/fuge. It's also important to keep the reactor clean so it will continue to provide the proper amount of flow. To this end I would remove the reactor from my sump about every six months, thoroughly clean, and add another 500 mL of pellets, which is about what was consumed during that time. After a few month's I noticed that the N's were kept in check, but the P's were still a little high (I fed fairly heavy), so I redeployed the GFO reactor. I never used a UV or an Ozone gen, so I can't speak to their effectiveness while using BP's, but it is also recommended that they not be used together with a BP reactor. Although I'm sure there are a number of brands of pellets that will work fine, I never tried them since the brand I bought(BRS) was working fine, and I'm a firm believer of, "if something works, don't fix it".

Let me add to this, that if you're already using a liquid carbon source, i.e. Vodka, Vinegar or some combination, and are starting BP's you should start to reduce your dose, as the pellets start to colonize. Once fully colonized you should stop using the liquid form, and let the pellets do their thing. Otherwise, you may begin to get excessive growth on the pellets, and begin to clump and clog the reactor.

 

[acolotto]

When you dose prodibio, do you dose or feed anything else? Acropower, fuel, potassium? What do you feed the tank? Just the fish, or things like coral frenzy?

No i only dose prodibio products biodigest, reef booster, and coral vits. I also feed a rotation of lrs, rods, nori, and pellets everyday for fish/inverts and a twice weekly feeding of reef roids to sps and mysis to scoly and acans.

 

[acolotto]

Ok got the reactor and everything today, am gonna have to soak the pellets in some RO/DI water overnight so will be one more day until i actually get this bad boy running!

 

[acolotto]

Alright so today is the day, will spark up the reactor after work today! I originally planned to use a Danner Mag 3 Pump but my tank being an all in one it ended up being a little to clunky for my liking, gonna end up getting a Sicce 1.5 instead (fits better in the space i got and not as heavy/clunky but gotta wait for marine depot to get them back in stock), but til then since the first month I am only running 100 mL of bio-pellets im gonna see if i can get away using one of my other 150-200 gph pumps I have laying around until I can order the sicce.

I rinsed the bio-pellets in ro/di water last night and let them soak overnight to eliminate any floating pellets. Also held off on my water change, and will do tonight, planned this so i had the extra SW that the reactor was gonna need. Before closing reactor and starting it up, I will dose 1 vial of Prodibio BioDigest into the reactor and this will continue on a bi-weekly basis (only 1st dose will go directly into the reactor, the rest will be dosed directly into display as normal). After 3 to 4 weeks is when I will resume use of reef booster and coral vits, (waiting to make sure bio-pellets are working before adding coral food and amino acids, as these add a high amount of nutrients into the tank want to make sure their is the bacteria their to clean up the excess nutrients) these will also be dosed directly into the display.

So since this is gonna be day 1 of my experience with bio-pellets tonight after i get them running, I will take a nitrate, phosphate, calc, alk, and mag readings as the starting points. I know Calc, Alk, and Mag probably wont change because of the pellets but rather be safe then sorry. I will also post a FTS (soo brown/dino glass algae can be seen) and a couple pics of frags (so over the time i run pellets growth can be seen). I will try and post updated parameters and picutres at least once a week so that the results can been seen visually with pictures and also have hard numbers with parameters while using the bio-pellets. By the way all test kits are Red Sea besids phosphates which is a Hanna checker.

This is my first time running pellets, if anyone thinks of anything else i should be doing, be prepared for, test, etc. please let me know! Also this not my first time running prodibio or a ULNS, i know the requirements of keeping some nutrients in the tank so that corals stay happy. The goal is to rid my tank of the brown algae (seems like dinos) on the back and side glass, keep nitrates 0 and po4 around 0.03 (ultimately an ULNS), and increase coral growth and colors.

 

[acolotto]

Got reactor up and running tonight along with a 10 gallon water change and a dose of prodibio biodigest. Gonna let things settle down for the night will take params tomorrow and some better pics but for here is a quick phone FTS

 

[Downbeach]

Keep in mind that it may take a few weeks or more for the pellets to colonize, and you begin to see substantial results. Considering the standard ramp up of starting with 1/3 the recommended amount of pellets, and adding the other 1/3's at two week intervals, it may take up to 8 weeks before they are fully colonized/operational. I would also suggest that you place the effluent from the BP reactor as close as you can to the intake of your skimmer, or better yet plumb it into the intake if praticable.

 

[acolotto]

Keep in mind that it may take a few weeks or more for the pellets to colonize, and you begin to see substantial results. Considering the standard ramp up of starting with 1/3 the recommended amount of pellets, and adding the other 1/3's at two week intervals, it may take up to 8 weeks before they are fully colonized/operational. I would also suggest that you place the effluent from the BP reactor as close as you can to the intake of your skimmer, or better yet plumb it into the intake if praticable.

That's exactly what the plan is. Goal is to use around 300 mL of BP, so yesterday started with a 100 mL (1/3rd) and then have the reactur return going right into the intake. I use a Tunze DOC 9012 (rated 132 gallons for sps tanks) and can not plumb it in directly but have the output flowing right into the skimmer. Orginal plan was to ramp up to 2/3rd (200 mL) of biopellets in a month, but in doing more research and suggestions from you guys, seem it'll take a month just to really start seeing the effects of the BPs. I am not going to add more until I see the skimmate pick up and notice a nitrate change when measuring params.

I assume as nitrate begins to drops it means the BPs are becoming colonized and a will only drop to a certain level of effiency (how much nitrates and phosphates are removed) based on amount of BPs in reactor. Is there any truth in this?

What I am thinking is I'd wait to a point where the nitrates stop dropping or stay around a number, then add more BPs to keep it dropping until 0, and once I have reached 0 nitrates I have found the amount of BPs i need to use. Then from the rest of the time that I run BPs id maintain that level of BPs.

 

[Downbeach]

I started with a Tunze 9011, and used a zip tie to hold the effluent tube just above the intake. You will probaly need to clean the skimmer more frequently, once a month for me was about right. Ultimately I upgraded to a SSA C180 aka BM HERO 180, more due to the fact that I couldn't attach an external collecting container to the Tunze economically. At that point I plumbed the effluent tube directly into the skimmers intake. You don't want your NO3 at absolute '0', using a Red Sea Pro kit mine was testing between .5 and 1. Due to my feeding habits, it wasn't enough to keep the PO4 down to where I wanted it ~ .03ppm, so I redeployed the GFO.

 

[acolotto]

I started with a Tunze 9011, and used a zip tie to hold the effluent tube just above the intake. You will probaly need to clean the skimmer more frequently, once a month for me was about right. Ultimately I upgraded to a SSA C180 aka BM HERO 180, more due to the fact that I couldn't attach an external collecting container to the Tunze economically. At that point I plumbed the effluent tube directly into the skimmers intake. You don't want your NO3 at absolute '0', using a Red Sea Pro kit mine was testing between .5 and 1. Due to my feeding habits, it wasn't enough to keep the PO4 down to where I wanted it ~ .03ppm, so I redeployed the GFO.

That is the thing i want nitrates to be as close to 0 as possible and then keep phosphates up around 0.02 to 0.03. Nitrates are not beneficial for SPS the lower they are the faster they grow and more colorful my sticks will be. I don't really know much about the role of nitrate in coral building skeleton, but I know phosphorus will inhibit coral growth by binding with carbonate instead of allowing the calcium to bind to the carbonate. The lower your nutrients, the more chances for calcium to find the carbon ions and more coral skeleton to be created. In the past I ran my 55 gallon as a ULNS with 0 Nitrates and 0.03 Phosphates and had great sps growth rate and color. I did have to get rid of my duncans and some other corals as they seem to not like the "clean" water as much. Now my tank is majority SPS with a couple lps scattered around the bottom, which all build calcium carbonate to build skelton. So my thinking is if I am to get the nutrients low again and maintain that, I will begin to see better growth in the corals, the tank should be creating more calcium carbonate bonds (coral skeleton) as their will be not be as many phosphates inhibiting the calcification process. So I assume at least nitrates have to be around the same concept, in that they inhibit something a long the way in calcification process in stony corals. So the lower they are the better coral growth I will have, at least thats my thinking

 

[acolotto]

Alright sorry been real hetic at work and havent kept up on this thread as much as id like, I will be better at it after the holidays.

But so far so good, have started to see the build up of bacteria around the pellets. Havent seen a reduction in dinos yet, but did clean skimmer cup last night and it was the stinkiest I have ever smelt, so makes me believe its starting to kick into action. Still going to wait until 4 weeks is up til I add the extra 100 mL (1/3) of pellets in to the reactor. I have also started dosing Zeo Flatworm Stop and K Balance, as after a 8 week dipping qt process didn't effectively wipe out aefw, I am trying this as a last hope, as aefw are the worst!!!! I am 7 days into the Flatworm Stop and the two corals that were still being affected by the aefw have started to heal (bite marks disappearing and no new bite marks on any other sps) So far, granted its only 10 days into biopellets and 7 days into Flatworm stop and K balance, my SPS PE has been out of this world and colors as always have been great. I will take pics this weekend as itll be my first one off in awhile and will take individual coral frag/colony pics for growth comparisons throughout this "test".

 

[Orly20]

Any updates? I know it's an old thread but still curious