Bridgelux leds

[jedimasterben]

I know that I'm comparing apples to oranges here but I work at Firestone industrial products, the worlds number one air springs manufacturer, we make air springs for the trucking industry, we have a line of products that does not have the Firestone name on them, even though they are manufactured the same exact way and with the same materials as we use with the Firestone line, and function and look just as good, the difference is that the metal components used to assemble the off named product do not have the same anti corrosive inhibitors as the Firestone line and therefore do not carry the same warranty

who's to say that the BridgeLux factories in China don't produce a less expensive LED just for EverGrow and some of the other lights coming from China, Firestone does not advertise their less expensive line as a Firestone product, I doubt that BridgeLux would advertise that they made a less expensive product that performed just as good either...just thinking out loud here

Considering how long Bridgelux has been around, and the amount of capital they have had for their expansions, that is doubtful.

 

[Reef Pets]

On their site it gives 6 locations for China along with several other countries. I also spoke with a sales rep stating that China is their largest market and further proof of that would be 6 locations in China compared to one location in the USA. I would assume their is a different market in LEDs just as most products when comparing the USA and China. Press releases that you find in the USA is probably for the USA market and would have little or nothing to do with the demand or use of their product in other countries. This is the reason that is seems logical that Bridgelux might be used in China products. Without knowing the China market and what's produced or distributed in China there in no way to know the facts of what's being used in Chinese lights. China has a MUCh higher level of manufacturing than the USA or any other country for that matter. I personally have no reason to believe that Chinese lights do not contain Bridgelux because no matter what the press releases state here in the USA have no bearing on what's being released in China. Even car manufactures release cars per demand in certain countries. So to believe that a product as small as LEDs not being different from country to country is not logical.
In all there is no proof that Bridgelux is not being used in Chinese lights.

 

[jedimasterben]

You sure we're looking at the same website? Or are you talking about distributors? (which are not production facilities, btw)

 

[Reef Pets]

Bridgelux uses contract manufactures in China. About halfway through the artical you will see update in bold. Therefore, they use other companies to make their product and its obvious there is a huge demand in China. Without knowing what Bridgelux is having other companies make and stamping their name on it there is no way possible to say that Bridgelux is not being used in Chinese lights.


For Bridgelux, LED opportunities lie in China ? Tech News and Analysis

 

[Reef Pets]

Considering how long Bridgelux has been around, and the amount of capital they have had for their expansions, that is doubtful.

They have not been around that long. I believe the name has but they opened their manufacturing company in California about 3 years ago, from what I've found. I believe the acticlel confirms that as well. Again, I'm not trying to argue... But the information that you are referring to is being published about the USA market and has no bearing on what they are having manufacture sold by contract in China.

 

[jedimasterben]

Bridgelux uses contract manufactures in China. About halfway through the artical you will see update in bold. Therefore, they use other companies to make their product and its obvious there is a huge demand in China. Without knowing what Bridgelux is having other companies make and stamping their name on it there is no way possible to say that Bridgelux is not being used in Chinese lights.


For Bridgelux, LED opportunities lie in China ? Tech News and Analysis

They have not been around that long. I believe the name has but they opened their manufacturing company in California about 3 years ago, from what I've found. I believe the acticlel confirms that as well. Again, I'm not trying to argue... But the information that you are referring to is being published about the USA market and has no bearing on what they are having manufacture sold by contract in China.

That's what I was getting at, that they have not been around in their current form but for a few years now and have simply not had the capital to construct new fabs (which cost ludicrous amounts of money and require very strict temperature and humidity regulation, or the silicon will not work the same). They have the lenses, PCB, etc made elsewhere, but their diodes are made in California.

The diodes that power this:

are not the same as the diodes that power this:

 

[Reef Pets]

But hard to say what the lenses look like that are being contracted through other companies in china. Unfortunate it's just unknown and all we can do is assume.

 

[jedimasterben]

But hard to say what the lenses look like that are being contracted through other companies in china. Unfortunate it's just unknown and all we can do is assume.

I've only scratched the surface of LEDs and knowledge about them - the two people that I've followed closely, and have helped steer reef LED lighting to where it is today, evilc66 (Clive Bentley) and blasterman, will tell you all day that Bridgelux and the stuff you find on eBay are not the same thing. blasterman works behind the scenes in the LED industry, so I trust that he knows what he's talking about.

 

[Reef Pets]

Maybe so but again I'm sure they work in the USA market and have no idea what's being contracted through Bridgelux in China. Maybe I'm completely wrong but with China having the largest market and Bridgelux being in China it does seem unrealistic. I think ill have to agree to disagree at this point because only Bridgelux knows what's being released in China through contracted companies.

I work behind the scenes in the coral industry here on the USA but could not tell you squat about what's going on in the coral industry in the UK.

 

[Reef Pets]

I have asked for this thread to be moved. We have robbed reef breeders forum

 

[Reef Breeders Verified Sponsor]

I have asked for this thread to be moved. We have robbed reef breeders forum

lol

 

[jedimasterben]

I have asked for this thread to be moved. We have robbed reef breeders forum

We may not agree on all points, but this is one thing we can all stand behind

 

[Ron Reefman]

I just find it very interesting that EverGrow and a number of other led fixture manufacturers all say they use Bridgelux leds and for nearly 8 months that I've been paying attention, nobody has said boo about it. It kind of seems like false advertising to say Bridgelux leds are being used if they really aren't. Why haven't more people brought this up before? I'm not taking sides, I just want a simple straight answer. I wonder what EverGrow would say? Or what Bridgelux would say?

 

[jedimasterben]

The reason nobody has said anything about it is, well, nobody really cares. They light up, they're powerful in higher numbers, and have good output for the price. The people that do want to know don't know where to look, as there isn't a lot of press about the 'back end' of the LED industry.

Chinese OEMs will sell you just about anything you want in an LED fixture - Bridgelux, Cree, Luxeon, Nichia, but they're all going to be the same diodes under the hood, and you'd be hard pressed to find an average user that could notice the difference. The odds of you getting a legitimate Cree LED fixture out of China is almost zero - China poses massive taxes on imported LEDs, and to import back to the US would add yet more taxes, and considering most Chinese fixtures you can 'upgrade to Cree' for $30-50, that extra cost isn't there, meaning the LEDs are counterfeit. And again, the end user almost never has any idea they are counterfeit and goes on about their business.

 

[Apollo Reef LED]

Some of the LEDs are bridgelux, the majority of the LEDs are from different factories, but with similar, or better performance. Bridgelux does not make blues, reds, violets, greens, etc., but it is easier to say they are Bridgelux LEDs, then to say they are Hong Kong Semiconductor Manufacturing CO LEDs, plus the other factories that make them. They are not cheap knock offs, like I said, the quality is the same, if not better, than bridgelux.

Hello not wanting to start a war of course but since our company engaged Bridgelux engineering directly when we first started we do know that there are some discrepancies in this thread and want to at least point to some documentation.

In regards to Bridgelux 3W LED, they absolutely do make them and that is a false statement by the prior poster. Certain Bridgelux diodes are not available directly and are made to be PACKAGED by other companies who may use high quality phosphor or not as well as having high standard manufacturing facilities.

In regards to not making blue LED, again they do. Here is an example data sheet PDF I happened to have on hand from when we first developed the SolarBlast with these specific diodes.

http://bridgelux.com/assets/products_portfolio/BXCB4545Datasheet82709.pdf

The problem in China is that there are many LED companies that are making diodes that others are selling as Bridgelux. There is a HUGE difference in the quality and lumens per watt. Dealing with reputable distributors is key. Theres a Billion so called LED experts in China and more popping up everyday. Not saying that Chinese do not produce quality and certainly the folks posting from their iPhones etc can agree? Most times you get what you pay for.

Good luck with your endeavors.

 

[jedimasterben]

Hello not wanting to start a war of course but since our company engaged Bridgelux engineering directly when we first started we do know that there are some discrepancies in this thread and want to at least point to some documentation.

In regards to Bridgelux 3W LED, they absolutely do make them and that is a false statement by the prior poster. Certain Bridgelux diodes are not available directly and are made to be PACKAGED by other companies who may use high quality phosphor or not as well as having high standard manufacturing facilities.

In regards to not making blue LED, again they do. Here is an example data sheet PDF I happened to have on hand from when we first developed the SolarBlast with these specific diodes.

http://bridgelux.com/assets/products_portfolio/BXCB4545Datasheet82709.pdf

The problem in China is that there are many LED companies that are making diodes that others are selling as Bridgelux. There is a HUGE difference in the quality and lumens per watt. Dealing with reputable distributors is key. Theres a Billion so called LED experts in China and more popping up everyday. Not saying that Chinese do not produce quality and certainly the folks posting from their iPhones etc can agree? Most times you get what you pay for.

Good luck with your endeavors.

It is my understanding that those LEDs are no longer produced for remote phosphor applications, unless they have resumed their production. They were removed from the website after being 'previous arrays' for a year or so.

The last part I agree with wholeheartedly. I mean, they're knocking off everything over there, even entire Apple stores! Products with big names on them sell better than no-name ones, so you can bet that the shady operations that are already knocking off the LEDs would attach any name they want to them, and they'll keep selling them til someone finds out, then they'll change their name and do it all over again.

At this point it is safe to assume that none of the LEDs in these fixtures are legitimately Bridgelux - and if they are, does adding a remote phosphor and encasing it in a terribly inefficient package make it a different LED, even though the heart of it is Bridgelux? The internals of the iPhone are made by Foxconn and Samsung - yet the end result is an Apple product.

 

[Apollo Reef LED]

Hi,

Sorry for the delay we are extremely busy these days. That first PDF was one I had handy. Here is a more current offering.

http://www.bridgelux.com/assets/products_portfolio/BXCE45Datasheetrev7-14-2011.pdf

The point here is there is more to it than meets the eye, especially to the end users. Our direct engagement with Bridgelux leaves us feeling confident in our primary chips though there are some chips that are not available by them or Cree such as the UV or 420.

And yes, entire Apple phonies as with any good product are inevitable. Even our Apollo name has been used by some Chinese companies wanting to ride the success of Apollo and confuse the end user. We even chatted with some as potential buyers and asked if they were the same as the Apollo Reef LED ( our USPTO trademarked name ) and was told "yes". This is the world we live in!

It is my understanding that those LEDs are no longer produced for remote phosphor applications, unless they have resumed their production. They were removed from the website after being 'previous arrays' for a year or so.

The last part I agree with wholeheartedly. I mean, they're knocking off everything over there, even entire Apple stores! Products with big names on them sell better than no-name ones, so you can bet that the shady operations that are already knocking off the LEDs would attach any name they want to them, and they'll keep selling them til someone finds out, then they'll change their name and do it all over again.

At this point it is safe to assume that none of the LEDs in these fixtures are legitimately Bridgelux - and if they are, does adding a remote phosphor and encasing it in a terribly inefficient package make it a different LED, even though the heart of it is Bridgelux? The internals of the iPhone are made by Foxconn and Samsung - yet the end result is an Apple product.

 

[fyrfytr]

I am glad to see some other vendors chiming in here, allows us end users the ability to possibly be able to get our questions answered.

As I was reading things initially I was tending to think that there was a chance that there were things made outside of the Bridgelux mfg plants but badged with their name as though they were made for them just not at their facility...but now I am wondering if I was even close. I agree with the comment that most of the end users cant tell the difference and so long as the diode lights and corals grow that is what matters. I know that I can trust what I purchase from known retailers (apollo reef led, reef breeders, ect) but for those DIY projects that I love I am now torn as to what to do and what to believe. (NOT that the wife will allow me to be in the market to DIY a LED fixture currently, but I am hoping for later)