Brightwell’s Phosphat-E

[mrpontiac80]

It can be very hard to reduce phosphate because a lot may be bound to rock and sand. t may take a lot more for a lot longer than Brightwell understands.

I figured the reason that it would drop and then level off was probably because of whatever was in the rock and sand. Would you recommend continuing the recommended dose only and daily? I assume as the levels drop in the tank the rock and sand would release some and therefore not really showing a drop on my test, but eventually I would see it begin to lower. Does this sound correct or should I increase the dose?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I figured the reason that it would drop and then level off was probably because of whatever was in the rock and sand. Would you recommend continuing the recommended dose only and daily? I assume as the levels drop in the tank the rock and sand would release some and therefore not really showing a drop on my test, but eventually I would see it begin to lower. Does this sound correct or should I increase the dose?

Yes, that’s what would happen. Different folks have different ideas how important it is to keep it at levels below 0.1 ppm. My target recommendation is 0.03 to 0.1 ppm, but if there’s no obvious issue, higher may be fine.

 

[mrpontiac80]

Well after dosing the same for several days and testing at .24-.22 daily I finally see .18 ppm.
Gonna decrease the dose to the recommended amount to go from that number to .15 and see if it happens. I definitely do not want any surprise bottoming out.

 

[mrpontiac80]

So an update…. After the last post above, I used the calculator to go from .18 down to .15
I dosed the recommended .05 ml and tested the next day. Phosphate climbed back up to .26 ppm in 24 hrs. So I went back to .15 ml doses and I have been decreasing slowly. Test showed .22 ppm yesterday. I assume the substrate was still releasing what it was saturated with.

 

[Steve2020]

So an update…. After the last post above, I used the calculator to go from .18 down to .15
I dosed the recommended .05 ml and tested the next day. Phosphate climbed back up to .26 ppm in 24 hrs. So I went back to .15 ml doses and I have been decreasing slowly. Test showed .22 ppm yesterday. I assume the substrate was still releasing what it was saturated with.

Part of my Dino eradication process was increasing my nutrients. My rock and substrate became PO4 saturated. My PO4 got up to .28ppm. Once my Dino's where gone I started the lanthanum drip treatment and it took 3.5mo to become stable at .08 which is within my desired PO4 range. I was seeing the exact same thing you are seeing with PO4 coming down and then going back up. What I saw was after the first month of doing the drip my PO4 started coming down slowly. Every time I dosed it would go down and then go back up to .28 for the first month. Then the next 2.5mo I saw the following: .28 to .24, .26 to .24, .24 to .21 then .23 to .18, .20 to .16, .18 to .15 and so on until I hit my goal of .07-.1ppm. There where many PO4 test between the ones I gave but just wanted to give you an idea on what I saw. IMO just keep up with the dosing and you should eventually get to your goal.

 

[mrpontiac80]

Part of my Dino eradication process was increasing my nutrients. My rock and substrate became PO4 saturated. My PO4 got up to .28ppm. Once my Dino's where gone I started the lanthanum drip treatment and it took 3.5mo to become stable at .08 which is within my desired PO4 range. I was seeing the exact same thing you are seeing with PO4 coming down and then going back up. What I saw was after the first month of doing the drip my PO4 started coming down slowly. Every time I dosed it would go down and then go back up to .28 for the first month. Then the next 2.5mo I saw the following: .28 to .24, .26 to .24, .24 to .21 then .23 to .18, .20 to .16, .18 to .15 and so on until I hit my goal of .07-.1ppm. There where many PO4 test between the ones I gave but just wanted to give you an idea on what I saw. IMO just keep up with the dosing and you should eventually get to your goal.

Thanks for sharing your experience

 

[Steve2020]

Thanks for sharing your experience

3.5mo was a typo. It actually took a total of 2.5mo.

 

[mrpontiac80]

Another update…. Last week as seen above, I saw phosphate drop to .18 ppm so I decreased the dose. Next day I was back up into .22 ppm or so. Since then I have been dosing 1.5 ml again as I previously had been doing. But all week the phosphate has been steadily climbing. I just tested today and I hit .30 ppm.
I don’t know if I should hold the course or increase the dose slightly. No changes had been made to the tank other than cleaning the skimmer mid week.

 

[Coolcasino]

I would increase it until you see the PO4 start to drop and then keep dosing that amount until you hit your target. It will take some time until your tank reaches equilibrium. Just go slow and test.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Another update…. Last week as seen above, I saw phosphate drop to .18 ppm so I decreased the dose. Next day I was back up into .22 ppm or so. Since then I have been dosing 1.5 ml again as I previously had been doing. But all week the phosphate has been steadily climbing. I just tested today and I hit .30 ppm.
I don’t know if I should hold the course or increase the dose slightly. No changes had been made to the tank other than cleaning the skimmer mid week.

That's what I would expect to see from released phosphate and foods. I'd up the dose a bit.

 

[mrpontiac80]

Ok, so I’ve been dosing for days now a 1.7 ml dose and testing Everyday at .21-.18 ppm.
Today im at .09 ppm.
so now what? Do I skip a dose, cut the dose in half, or what. In a perfect world .09 would be perfectly fine for me right now.

 

[Steve2020]

Ok, so I’ve been dosing for days now a 1.7 ml dose and testing Everyday at .21-.18 ppm.
Today im at .09 ppm.
so now what? Do I skip a dose, cut the dose in half, or what. In a perfect world .09 would be perfectly fine for me right now.

Myself I never dosed it daily. I dosed every 2-3 days until it got down to 0.15ppm then I dosed a half dose once a week until I got to my desired setpoint which I obtained about a month ago. I have not dosed in a month and I test weekly and levels are still in my setpoint range. I would stop dosing and check your PO4 in a couple of days and if the level is within your setpoint range I would just do a PO4 check once a week. If it goes up in a few days lets say by .05ppm I would only dose the equivalent amount that would lower PO4 by .05ppm then check it again in a few days.
My routine was I did a 12hr drip into a 1 micron sock to catch all the precipitate. I have read that if not using a 1-5 micron sock to catch the precipitate that the Hanna Checker for PO4 could give a false high reading. So if this is true and you are not dripping/dosing slowly into a 1-5 micron sock I would test a day or two after your Lanthanum dose so you don't overdose and bring your PO4 down to ULN levels unless that is your goal.
Myself I like the better safe than sorry approach.

 

[mrpontiac80]

Myself I never dosed it daily. I dosed every 2-3 days until it got down to 0.15ppm then I dosed a half dose once a week until I got to my desired setpoint which I obtained about a month ago. I have not dosed in a month and I test weekly and levels are still in my setpoint range. I would stop dosing and check your PO4 in a couple of days and if the level is within your setpoint range I would just do a PO4 check once a week. If it goes up in a few days lets say by .05ppm I would only dose the equivalent amount that would lower PO4 by .05ppm then check it again in a few days.
My routine was I did a 12hr drip into a 1 micron sock to catch all the precipitate. I have read that if not using a 1-5 micron sock to catch the precipitate that the Hanna Checker for PO4 could give a false high reading. So if this is true and you are not dripping/dosing slowly into a 1-5 micron sock I would test a day or two after your Lanthanum dose so you don't overdose and bring your PO4 down to ULN levels unless that is your goal.
Myself I like the better safe than sorry approach.

So I have been testing with hanna at the same time daily. After work, I test phosphate, then I shut the skimmer down and dose my AFR and acropower, then feed the fish. After 30 min i turn the skimmer back on and dose the phosphate-e down into the skimmer neck. So my test is 24 hours after dose.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Ok, so I’ve been dosing for days now a 1.7 ml dose and testing Everyday at .21-.18 ppm.
Today im at .09 ppm.
so now what? Do I skip a dose, cut the dose in half, or what. In a perfect world .09 would be perfectly fine for me right now.

I'd stick to the current dose for a bit more, but slowing or stopping and seeing what happens is also a fine plan.

 

[BetterJake]

Any update?

 

[mrpontiac80]

Any update?

So it did what it was intended to do for sure. I was maintaining around .16 ppm. Around the end of march I transferred everything in the tank to a new tank upgrade and since then I’ve been trying to increase phosphate or at least maintain it at .05-.1
If I needed to reduce it again I’d definitely use phosphate-e over gfo at this point in time.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

So it did what it was intended to do for sure. I was maintaining around .16 ppm. Around the end of march I transferred everything in the tank to a new tank upgrade and since then I’ve been trying to increase phosphate or at least maintain it at .05-.1
If I needed to reduce it again I’d definitely use phosphate-e over gfo at this point in time.

FYI, if you like using lanthanum, there are many brands or DIY available:

DIY Lanthanum Dosing

Someone asked for a DIY lanthanum dosing recipe. Be sure you understand that some folks have issues with fish (especially tangs) before embarking on lanthanum dosing. it is also preferable to catch as many of the solids that precipitate out as you can, so dosing before some sort of...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[mrpontiac80]

FYI, if you like using lanthanum, there are many brands or DIY available:

DIY Lanthanum Dosing

Someone asked for a DIY lanthanum dosing recipe. Be sure you understand that some folks have issues with fish (especially tangs) before embarking on lanthanum dosing. it is also preferable to catch as many of the solids that precipitate out as you can, so dosing before some sort of...

www.reef2reef.com

Thanks!