BRS High Capacity GFO

[Reeferdood]

How many of you are using it and are you having issues with corals? I am in the middle of an experiment right now but it seems this stuff is leaching copper. I have had a few corals die suddenly that most of us can grow like weeds. If you are experiencing the same strange die offs and are using the hi cap GFO, check your copper levels and post your results..
Cheers!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

How many of you are using it and are you having issues with corals? I am in the middle of an experiment right now but it seems this stuff is leaching copper. I have had a few corals die suddenly that most of us can grow like weeds. If you are experiencing the same strange die offs and are using the hi cap GFO, check your copper levels and post your results..
Cheers!

Lots of people have used it without issue. I never had an issue with it that I detected.

Why do you think it leaches copper? There are lots of ways copper gets into reef tanks. How high is it in your tank?

 

[themcfreak]

How many of you are using it and are you having issues with corals? I am in the middle of an experiment right now but it seems this stuff is leaching copper. I have had a few corals die suddenly that most of us can grow like weeds. If you are experiencing the same strange die offs and are using the hi cap GFO, check your copper levels and post your results..
Cheers!

When I used GFO, I never had any problems with BRS GFO (high capacity or regular)

 

[Reeferdood]

Well, I took 5 gallons of my water and decided to run a reactor to it alone.
The starting reading was 0.04 ppm and after 24 hours it went up to 0.08 ppm. I can't seem to understand how it would go up unless it was leaching.
This is only with a recent jug of BRS High Cap GFO and not the standard GFO.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Well, I took 5 gallons of my water and decided to run a reactor to it alone.
The starting reading was 0.04 ppm and after 24 hours it went up to 0.08 ppm. I can't seem to understand how it would go up unless it was leaching.
This is only with a recent jug of BRS High Cap GFO and not the standard GFO.

How are you measuring copper? Even the starting value is low for a kit to detect but too much for a reef.

 

[Reeferdood]

I am using a Hanna HI 702 checker

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Hanna claims an uncertainty of +/- 0.05 ppm for the 702, so I wouldn’t assume those values are different, and there may not be any significant copper present.

 

[11f150]

following

 

[Reeferdood]

Hanna claims an uncertainty of +/- 0.05 ppm for the 702, so I wouldn’t assume those values are different, and there may not be any significant copper present.

I understand the errors that are covered by the manufacturer, likely to cover their butts in case of errors. I am an aerospace engineer and most, if not all of our test equipment has errors that have allowable swings. I am doing averages and documenting them so that I can find the source of the copper, regardless how much might be there. MSDS for this Hi Cap GFO does state copper as being one of the top items in it, can't help but think it is leaching...

 

[Bunnee911]

Have you got a poly filter handy?

 

[Reeferdood]

Have you got a poly filter handy?

Yeppers,
always have a few laying around for just this type of issue.
FYI, it has brought my levels down a lot in 24 hrs but I am still not in my happy place.

 

[Reeferdood]

Just to add,
I know others that are dealing with this issue too right now. This is the only reason I wanted to bring it up to the forums.
Something is not right, been reefing too long to kill mummy eyes and montiporas... Only change was HC GFO.....

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I’m not convinced you have copper anywhere close to the levels you report. I’d get an icp test from a reliable company rather than try to use a kit below its reliable limit.

Many people use many brands of GFO, and I have very rarely seen copper at the levels you report. Myself included.

 

[Reeferdood]

Was going to submit a triton soon...

 

[Reeferdood]

Hanna claims an uncertainty of +/- 0.05 ppm for the 702, so I wouldn’t assume those values are different, and there may not be any significant copper present.

If this is the case would any value outside the +/- 0.05 range mean that there was in fact copper present?

Well, I took 5 gallons of my water and decided to run a reactor to it alone.
The starting reading was 0.04 ppm and after 24 hours it went up to 0.08 ppm. I can't seem to understand how it would go up unless it was leaching.
This is only with a recent jug of BRS High Cap GFO and not the standard GFO.

Just to be clear here, this is 5 gallons of my freshly mixed saltwater not water from my system.
The reading on my system that got my attention at first and alerted me was 0.23 ppm!!!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

If this is the case would any value outside the +/- 0.05 range mean that there was in fact copper present?

I would not assume that for two reasons:

1. I've seen no reports of elevated copper that could be traced to GFO use, and, at least at high copper levels (0.1 ppm and above), GFO binds copper:

https://www.advancedaquarist.com/2012/2/chemistry

2. Based on reported experiences with other Hanna checkers where folks are constantly having issues with reproducibility when they are right down at the bottom end of the range. Phosphate checkers, for example.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/hana-ulr-phosphate-checker.397360/

"I therefore purchased a reference solution to test the kits and this has 0.08 phosphate in it.

The Red Sea kit gave me exactly 0.08. The Hana kit gave me 0.27. I retested multiple times and got consistent readings from both kits."

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

MSDS for this Hi Cap GFO does state copper as being one of the top items in it, can't help but think it is leaching...

Can I ask where you found that MSDS? I can't locate it.

 

[Reeferdood]

Can I ask where you found that MSDS? I can't locate it.

Tried to IM you... Would rather keep this information off the forums.

 

[Reeferdood]

Can I ask where you found that MSDS? I can't locate it.

Did you look at the COA that accompanies the MSDS you located?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I think this is a red herring, IMO. Bayoxide E33HC is claimed by the manufacturer to bind copper from drinking water, not release extra copper:

http://lpt.lanxess.com/uploads/tx_lxsmatrix/product_flyer_bayoxide_e33hc_en_02.pdf

"Heavy metal removal from drinking water, e.g., copper, lead, nickel, and zinc"


Iron oxide s never 100% pure. It will always have other metals in it. A few ppm of copper is normal in such materials, even when of a grade approved for food use (see below). Since the material is not dissolving into the tank water, there's little reason to think substantial copper is released. It is just part of the solid structure.

https://efsa.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.2903/j.efsa.2016.4482

"Five batches of iron oxide black were analysed for the specified contents.12 They all complied with the specifications (iron oxide black expressed as iron: 68.5–70.9%; water‐soluble salts: 0.09–0.13%; arsenic: < 1 mg/kg; cadmium: < 1 mg/kg; chromium: 25–58 mg/kg; copper: 6–31 mg/kg; lead: ≤ 4 mg/kg; mercury: < 0.2 mg/kg; nickel: 57–117 mg/kg; and zinc: 32–65 mg/kg)."