BRS Info Overload For Newbies

[T-J]

First of all, I'd like to credit @CrunchyBananas for coining the term "BRS Info Overload" in another thread I'm a part of.

Having seen what they said, it suddenly struck me that all of the information out there (Like the BRS videos/commercials) might actually be HURTING new reefers.

I'm curious, what newbie mistakes are you seeing on the regular, and think it might be attributed to too much information?

I'll start: dosing/feeding
You'll see someone with a 1 month old tank put an acro or other SPS in there. It starts to go south, so they research it and find out "OMG, corals eat! I need ReefRoids and ReefChili ASAP!!!" Their next step is to feed the tank every two days for their 1 coral. Meanwhile, the 1 month old tank has all the other instability/immature issues going on.

 

[BrianAnthony]

Most newbies have smaller more practical setups. BRS and the like have all top end gear. Newbies just got back from Petco with their 40gallon with under gravel filter.

Then you turn on BRS and you hear about kalk reactors, Ca reactors, ATO, GFO, Sump, refugium, PAR, alk, Apex, etc.

The newbies don't understand all that. Ones with money will prolly buy that stuff without understanding fundamentals.

BRS would do well to have a full beginner guide with stepped transitions.

 

[Sleeping Giant]

Yes I believe that they can be overwhelming with information/commercials. But like anything else on the internet, you must be diligent about looking at all the possible information out there and try to find things that work best for you.

 

[ZoWhat]

Most newbies have smaller more practical setups. BRS and the like have all top end gear. Newbies just got back from Petco with their 40gallon with under gravel filter.

Then you turn on BRS and you hear about kalk reactors, Ca reactors, ATO, GFO, Sump, refugium, PAR, alk, Apex, etc.

The newbies don't understand all that. Ones with money will prolly buy that stuff without understanding fundamentals.

BRS would do well to have a full beginner guide with stepped transitions.

My vote for Reply Of The Month.

 

[rtparty]

BRS already has multiple series directed at new hobbyists. The 5 minute guide being one of them. They also have Matthew and his entire channel is dedicated to helping new reefers.

The truth is, there isn't all that much more info today than there was 10 years ago. RHF has hundreds of articles that predate BRS. The forums have been littered with information for over two decades.

We aren't seeing more mistakes because there is more information. We are "seeing" more mistakes because social media is more prevalent and the hobby has grown exponentially the last 2 years. Same mistakes were made 20 years ago. We just didn't post it for everyone to see

 

[BrianAnthony]

Don't get me wrong... BRS is awesome!!! I trust their information... Even more so than in these forums. These forums are opinions from newbies to masters and it's hard to tell them apart sometimes.

 

[ying yang]

I guess it's like anything that is complicated when we try to learn to much to fast and can often get things mixed up but think there right or just presume wrong etc.

But to be fair about your statement about a noob putting in an acro in a 1 month tank and then thinking need dose and feed.
I've personally watched brs videos where Ryan says a good indicator if your tank is ready for sps is good coraline growth and stability of the correct range of parameters so never watched/ heard them say its good idea to put an acro in a 1 month tank .
Personally I found the brs videos plus other YouTube videos very helpful but my journey into saltwater was a little slower than others im guessing as bought tank and 90% of what I needed and researched for 6 months or so then had health complications so took me 5 years to actually buy that last 10% of what I needed and set up the tank ( I say I bought last 10% ,it's never ending and always wanting something more lol )
But that 5 years I had an empty tank I still researched a little bit and then few months before say it up ,then I researched hard re-capping all the Information and little more to boot lol.
But all in all I think brs make good videos and very informative and all the answers are in them if we choose to listen and learn and if they try something then find out doesnt work they say it didn't work how they thought and won't try that method again.

So we have the power to learn and take on board what we choose and like everything a second opinion or verify it yourself is always a good option ^_^

 

[fish farmer]

First of all, I'd like to credit @CrunchyBananas for coining the term "BRS Info Overload" in another thread I'm a part of.

Having seen what they said, it suddenly struck me that all of the information out there (Like the BRS videos/commercials) might actually be HURTING new reefers.

I'm curious, what newbie mistakes are you seeing on the regular, and think it might be attributed to too much information?

I'll start: dosing/feeding
You'll see someone with a 1 month old tank put an acro or other SPS in there. It starts to go south, so they research it and find out "OMG, corals eat! I need ReefRoids and ReefChili ASAP!!!" Their next step is to feed the tank every two days for their 1 coral. Meanwhile, the 1 month old tank has all the other instability/immature issues going on.

I started reefing before BRS was an idea.

Sure.....back in 2000 , things were different...but were they really? I think one main thing I see is starting with dry rock AND newbies starting with harder coral. I know I've deterred many from starting with weed corals, when maybe the newbie should be starting with weed corals.

I felt my first tank thrived during the first two years, growing softies and LPS which I was sending off to the LFS or local hobbyists. Water changes every couple of weeks, testing basic params every week, good lighting, kalk additions soon after startup, good LIVE rock cycled in tank, light fish load, feeding the tank. I don't remember every worrying about nitrates and phosphate (both were low).

It's like the saying we see all to often "there are many ways to skin a cat" I feel there are a LOT more ways to skin that cat in current times and more information to cook that cat once skinned.

 

[T-J]

Great comments so far, and I understand where everyone is coming from.

One of the issues I think plays a role has to do with what someone said earlier. I don't think it's an access to information and social media issue, I think it's the EASE of access to SPECIFIC information. Here's what I mean:

When I started 25 years ago, I had to read books. And by reading books, you were dragged through a timeline of how/when to do things. Today, you can simply type into a SEARCH BAR the very specific issue you're having, and then you miss all the other details that lead up to it. For example, RTN. Someone searches RTN on YouTube, and suddenly they find out it might have to do with parameters, or lighting, or some other thing. But, by doing that search, they miss all the other information that might have pointed to the true cause: You don't throw an acro into a 2 week old tank that's still cycling.

I also think that in today's age of "instant gratification", some people don't understand the patience it takes in this hobby.

 

[vtecintegra]

If you fail from too much BRS info, you're in the wrong hobby and should find a simpler one like getting a hamster. It's like blaming the grocery store for getting fat. I told my kid, keeping a reef tank requires you to be a biologist, electrician, plumber, chemist, and veterinarian sometimes. BRS has done more to advance success and knowledge in the hobby than maybe almost all other sources combined, or at least any other single source.

 

[dedragon]

their 5 minute guides are pretty good but they really should have a big warning video first about the importance of testing and how each of these processes will take months or years, not just start tank and immediately dose everything which is what some of the videos do look like

 

[tharbin]

I think the BRS videos do far more good than harm. The real issue is social media overload. The one thing I see often in new reefer setups on here is lots of sophisticated equipment on a brand new tank and lots of expensive corals--or the opposite a newbie with a setup that hasn't even added a snail after four months. I think that all of the YouTube/Instagram/Facebook channels are setting newbies up for failure in many cases. There are so many people in the hobby comparatively (I set up my first SW tank in 1976) that there are lots of 90 day experts out there. Even on here, which is far better than most, I read 'suggestions' that make me cringe.

The BRS beginner series are pretty good stuff. The problem with BRS for me is that lately Ryan and Randy wax poetic in areas that are a little beyond their expertise, or maybe over-hype a product. This wouldn't actually be a problem if it was some other channel but BRS Investigates is considered almost gospel by some. They have promoted some less-than-ideal directions for hobbyists and then many months or years later change course but people still follow the old idea that even BRS has abandoned, and worse, watch the old video but not the new one or don't tie the two together.

 

[WestonNanos]

I watched every last hour of 52 weeks of reefing before starting my tank. Yes it can be overwhelming, but thats what happens when you try to cram information because you are excited to set up a tank as fast as possible. But idk... I think BRS comes out with great information, especially with their experiments on their "tested" series. I think BRS is a better information source than places like this forum... Sure there are a ton of extremely experienced people on this forum, but 9/10 times, you have no idea who the person is that you are getting advice from, they may have a tank full of mortalities/algae and other problems. Not to mention, they may not even have a tank at all!

The people I seek advice from on this forum, have successes with their own tank(s), have experience with the exact product that I am attempting to use, etc.

Overall, Its better to listen to a select few people rather than anyone willing to give you advice. For me, BRS is one of those select few

 

[Lyss]

I'm going to add from the perspective of a "newbie." I did come from freshwater, but I also knew that saltwater is not exactly equal. I did tons of research and watched lots of videos, including those from BRS and also other sources before I purchased anything. When I finally felt I was ready to pull the trigger, I think all that research definitely helped me to make the right choices b/c I'm very happy with my equipment and livestock. I also think I can attribute a lot of my success a year later to information from BRS (and others, too).

It's not black and white/one-size-fits all, so I'm not sure commenting about how dumb folks new to the hobby are is exactly helpful. I personally think BRS has done a lot to mitigate that TBH.

Edit: That said, they are a retailer. These videos drive sales in addition to being helpful information.

 

[REEFTIDE]

Lots of new people IMO start watching the videos too far down the rabbit hole vs starting earlier in the series or they take on projects too big to start off with. Building a super intricate complicated system as your first one makes it more challenging than it has to be.
The playlists are awesome now but it would be nice if BRS used color codes for the levels of reefing a video contains. Lots of people are apprehensive about reef keeping and getting tossed into an apex coding video might get scary. That being said, I also feel like brand new hobbyists aren't the majority of BRS customers. Generally they're probably like 6 months in

 

[fish farmer]

I watched every last hour of 52 weeks of reefing before starting my tank. Yes it can be overwhelming, but thats what happens when you try to cram information because you are excited to set up a tank as fast as possible. But idk... I think BRS comes out with great information, especially with their experiments on their "tested" series. I think BRS is a better information source than places like this forum... Sure there are a ton of extremely experienced people on this forum, but 9/10 times, you have no idea who the person is that you are getting advice from, they may have a tank full of mortalities/algae and other problems. Not to mention, they may not even have a tank at all!

The people I seek advice from on this forum, have successes with their own tank(s), have experience with the exact product that I am attempting to use, etc.

Overall, Its better to listen to a select few people rather than anyone willing to give you advice. For me, BRS is one of those select few

I haven't watched many of their vids, but I really did like the one they did comparing different lights with growing chaeto.

Stronger lights grew the chaeto better, BUT all the lights grew chaeto.

A newbie would take this as "I'm going to get the biggest light for chaeto." when the smaller light my be perfect in their application which was my experience when I used a cheap grow light successfully.

 

[Midrats]

Who? I'll take my info from experts, not a couple of guys that started out bagging up baking soda and driveway salt.

 

[Jekyl]

First of all, I'd like to credit @CrunchyBananas for coining the term "BRS Info Overload" in another thread I'm a part of.

Having seen what they said, it suddenly struck me that all of the information out there (Like the BRS videos/commercials) might actually be HURTING new reefers.

I'm curious, what newbie mistakes are you seeing on the regular, and think it might be attributed to too much information?

I'll start: dosing/feeding
You'll see someone with a 1 month old tank put an acro or other SPS in there. It starts to go south, so they research it and find out "OMG, corals eat! I need ReefRoids and ReefChili ASAP!!!" Their next step is to feed the tank every two days for their 1 coral. Meanwhile, the 1 month old tank has all the other instability/immature issues going on.

Everyone needs to keep it in the front of their minds that BRS is a retailer. Everything they're doing is designed to bring in revenue.

 

[CrunchyBananas]

So I used this term in a thread that had a young tank attempting SPS while dosing cal/alk and reef ab+, but its a phenomenon I stand by. Its a trend I've noticed as a reef store employee and full time aquarium installation/maintenance guy. I likely interact with more totally new people in the hobby than most, where as most users on this forum are likelier to interact with more seasoned reefers, or at least more determined ones that would not call upon me for advice or service. The common thread amongst many of the perpetual problem tanks was almost always looking over the value of good maintenance, and choosing to buy products instead.

The ones I'd see the most are: dosing alkalinity/calcium into a tank with just a couple frags at most, dumping in coral foods of any type to "avoid low nutrients," and then dumping in vibrant when the tank hits nasty algae at the 6-12 month mark, which half the time plunges the tank into chaos.

I do not necessarily think that BRS is intentionally misleading people for the sake of profits, and I think their intentions are for the betterment of the hobby (and to obviously make money, but it is a business, not a charity, and that is something I do not hold against them in the least). That said, they make reefing SEEM so easy and straight forward from their videos, and it is often times the only resource people getting into the hobby use, because it is presented in a way that it is the only resource needed.

So newer reefers (often impatiently) start up a new tank and start rushing things and start hitting (at least what they may perceive as) issues, well luckily, their only resource has a forum to tell them that 0 nitrate reading needs to be fixed! and look at that, a professional video by them to at least somewhat support that! Oh no, my alkalinity was 10.5 3 days ago, now its 10.0, nevermind I tested at different times in the day and that is within my test kits margin of error, BRS Pharma needs to be added ASAP since there is so much consumption I have swings! This is the sort of stuff I see constantly on their forums, and would run into daily working the LFS. It leads so many new hobbyists to spending a ton in their first year to have a bare bottom tank full of dinos and a wake of dead corals.

BRS themselves have even made video series on some fool proof reefing methods which ended up being failures in their own admission, but dozens of frustrated new reefers chimed in and lamented all the money and time they spent pursuing those methods, only to ultimately fail.

I know this is a touchy subject, some will agree, some will disagree, but this is my opinion from my experiences with hobbyists online, in stores, and at reef shows. Again, I don't think BRS is necessarily at fault, it is a byproduct of what they created, its just something that I so frequently see with new reefers frustrated at their set ups that just wont balance and mature. I love going through everyone elses and opinions and seeing others' perspectives as well.

TL;DR Keep your hands out of your tank, do your water changes.

 

[WestonNanos]

I haven't watched many of their vids, but I really did like the one they did comparing different lights with growing chaeto.

Stronger lights grew the chaeto better, BUT all the lights grew chaeto.

A newbie would take this as "I'm going to get the biggest light for chaeto." when the smaller light my be perfect in their application which was my experience when I used a cheap grow light successfully.

Thats one thing about BRS videos... As a viewer, it is your responsibility to understand the fact that they are salesmen. A perfect example is black box LED's. There are people that have success with them and BRS says to stay away from them for the most part. They do have some bias as far as which products they need to move/profit the most on. But, I believe their experiments/informational videos to be factual and un bias.