BRS two part

NickC · May 15, 2020

Quick question about BRS two part. I started dosing with the sodium bicarbonate and calcium chloride in the pharma pouches. I raised my alk to my target level with equal parts of the two. After doing a little bit of reading it seems that with the bicarbonate, the does is half as strong as the soda ash.

Does this mean that instead of dosing equal parts of each, my calcium dose should be half the volume of the bicarbonate? I:E; 10ml/dose of bicarb, 5ml/dose calcium?

I have used kalk, and cal reactors in the past but never two part. I'm pretty sure I have it right, but couldn't find an answer. Thanks for any help!

Bryknicks · May 15, 2020

I think you should be able to use the calculator on their website. I've only used their soda ash so can't comment on the bicarbonate.

redfishbluefish · May 15, 2020

I am not directly familiar with BRS, but I will tell you what I know. Sodium bicarbonate is not as soluble as sodium carbonate.....roughly by one half. So the typical sodium bicarbonate solution was one cup (or 1 1/8 cups) bicarbonate to one gallon of water, while the carbonate solution was two cups to a gallon. The accompanying calcium part was either one cup (or so) per gallon (for bicarbonate), or two cups (or so) per gallon (for the carbonate. The "or so" was for how much water was bound to the calcium carbonate.

So to directly answer your question, if you are using bicarbonate solution, and calcium at around two cups per gallon, you only use approximate half the amount of calcium as bicarbonate.

Bottom line, let your testing of alk and calc define how much you're adding.

NickC · May 15, 2020

I used the calculator, howeve,r my calcium levels are right where they need to be at the moment. The daily drop in calcium being so small as compared to alk it makes it nearly impossible to quantify. I feel that my salifert kit isn't even accurate enough to detect the few ppm drop, and I'd like to dose the correct amount and mainly test alk (testing calcium less frequently) as i would with other methods.

Saltyreef · May 15, 2020

You need to do a 5 day consumption trend and get an average.
If your tank is only consuming 1 or 2ppm of calcium per day, you might be better suited with water changes vs dosing.

And fwiw, salifert is as accurate as it gets for hobby grade titrating test kits

NickC · May 15, 2020

redfishbluefish said:
I am not directly familiar with BRS, but I will tell you what I know. Sodium bicarbonate is not as soluble as sodium carbonate.....roughly by one half. So the typical sodium bicarbonate solution was one cup (or 1 1/8 cups) bicarbonate to one gallon of water, while the carbonate solution was two cups to a gallon. The accompanying calcium part was either one cup (or so) per gallon (for bicarbonate), or two cups (or so) per gallon (for the carbonate. The "or so" was for how much water was bound to the calcium carbonate.

So to directly answer your question, if you are using bicarbonate solution, and calcium at around two cups per gallon, you only use approximate half the amount of calcium as bicarbonate.

Bottom line, let your testing of alk and calc define how much you're adding.

Thanks. This is basically where my head was at, I just couldnt find a definitive answer here or on BRS. I'm fine with testing, but starting with the correct ratio seems practical, then going from there.

Rick Krejci · May 15, 2020

Yes, bicarb to calcium should be 2:1 rather than 1:1.

You can use bicarb to get your Alk where it needs to be independent of Ca and once you're there, you should be maintenance dosing 2:1 Bicarb to Ca approx.

Soda Ash shouldn't really be used for large Alk adjustments since it jumps the PH.

I'm sticking with Bicarb from now on, since I was having issues with Carb.

Switched from Sodium Carbonate to Bicarbonate...wow

My tank has been up 3 years, and lately, my SPS has really been talking off and growing. I have a Trident, so I can see my Alk and Ca levels change and have a good pulse on my uptake. I had been using traditional BRS 2 part (Calcium Chloride and Sodium Carbonate), PH has been in the range...

www.reef2reef.com

NickC · May 15, 2020

The tanks is consuming more than what water changes can accommodate for. I'm maintaining alk with 20ml/day of BRS bicarbonate, auto water change twice/week.

Sooooo, that being said. 10 or 20ml/ day of BRS calcium as a starting dose?

NickC · May 15, 2020

Rick Krejci said:
Yes, bicarb to calcium should be 2:1 rather than 1:1.

You can use bicarb to get your Alk where it needs to be independent of Ca and once you're there, you should be maintenance dosing 2:1 Bicarb to Ca approx.

Soda Ash shouldn't really be used for large Alk adjustments since it jumps the PH.

I'm sticking with Bicarb from now on, since I was having issues with Carb.

Switched from Sodium Carbonate to Bicarbonate...wow

My tank has been up 3 years, and lately, my SPS has really been talking off and growing. I have a Trident, so I can see my Alk and Ca levels change and have a good pulse on my uptake. I had been using traditional BRS 2 part (Calcium Chloride and Sodium Carbonate), PH has been in the range...

www.reef2reef.com

Thank you! I had assumed that was the case, was just looking for clarification.

Saltyreef · May 15, 2020

NickC said:
The tanks is consuming more than what water changes can accommodate for. I'm maintaining alk with 20ml/day of BRS bicarbonate, auto water change twice/week.

Sooooo, that being said. 10 or 20ml/ day of BRS calcium as a starting dose?

Maybe i misunderstood when you said salifert kits arent accurate enough to detect your few ppm drop.

Sounded like your tank wasnt consuming hardly anything...

NickC · May 15, 2020

Saltyreef said:
Maybe i misunderstood when you said salifert kits arent accurate enough to detect your few ppm drop.

Sounded like your tank wasnt consuming hardly anything...

Simple misunderstanding, no worries. Salifert tests are great, I've used them for 20 years. They are, however, hobby grade and there is a human error factor. Calcium doesn't get consumed nearly at the rate that alkalinity does so its hard to get an accurate daily drop; and I'd rather not stop dosing for a week to find out.

That being said, I don't want to dose double the correct amount either! Hence my question.

Saltyreef · May 15, 2020

NickC said:
Simple misunderstanding, no worries. Salifert tests are great, I've used them for 20 years. They are, however, hobby grade and there is a human error factor. Calcium doesn't get consumed nearly at the rate that alkalinity does so its hard to get an accurate daily drop; and I'd rather not stop dosing for a week to find out.

That being said, I don't want to dose double the correct amount either! Hence my question.

Gotcha

You can see the difference between the two recipies easily in this link.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

One recipie calls for soda ash, the other baking soda. Same calcium part just cut in half for baking soda as alk.

I use the baking soda recipie. More room for error

NickC · May 15, 2020

Saltyreef said:
Gotcha

You can see the difference between the two recipies easily in this link.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

One recipie calls for soda ash, the other baking soda. Same calcium part just cut in half for baking soda as alk.

I use the baking soda recipie. More room for error

Good deal, thanks a bunch!

Randy Holmes-Farley · May 15, 2020

NickC said:
I used the calculator, howeve,r my calcium levels are right where they need to be at the moment. The daily drop in calcium being so small as compared to alk it makes it nearly impossible to quantify. I feel that my salifert kit isn't even accurate enough to detect the few ppm drop, and I'd like to dose the correct amount and mainly test alk (testing calcium less frequently) as i would with other methods.

Which is perfectly normal and still indicates that equal parts dosing is appropriate. You just need to make the parts by the correct recipes. If BRS did not supply them to you, they are in my article above.