Can brooklynella lie dormant?

Atarius · Nov 3, 2018

I stupidly added a juvenile clownfish to my nano tank with an existing clownfish, corals and inverts, without doing a quarantine period (because the possible livestock loss is very small). In hindsight it's a lesson learned because after 7-10 days the new clownfish developed brooklynella and died pretty soon after.

My question is, my existing clown has shown no signs of developing the disease after close to a month. Can the disease lie dormant on the remaining fish, only for another outbreak if I were to add another?

It's no problem if so as I'm prepared to QT and treat with formalin, but don't want to put it through the treatment if it's not necessary. I can't seem to find anything concrete into but might not be looking in the right places!

Greatful of any advice!

Crabs McJones · Nov 3, 2018

Welcome to R2R!

#WelcometoR2R
So sorry that happened to you. Yes, as long as there is a fish host for the parasite to continue feeding off of it can remain in the tank. Only way to eradicate it is to run your remaining fish through treatment in a quarantine tank, and let the display tank go fishless for a minimum of 6 weeks.

Gareth elliott · Nov 3, 2018

It is possible to develop immunity or resistance to any pathogen. But with parasites that means some may still be feeding and reproducing in the tank off those individuals. When new live stock without this resistance is added they fall ill. Best course of action would be to treat the remaining fish and run an appropriate fallow period.

Gablami · Nov 3, 2018

How sure are you that the fish died of brook? If you’re pretty sure, than treat. If you’re not as sure, you can try the black mollie trick. Convert it to saltwater and it should expose dormant infections.

Atarius · Nov 3, 2018

Gablami said:
How sure are you that the fish died of brook? If you’re pretty sure, than treat. If you’re not as sure, you can try the black mollie trick. Convert it to saltwater and it should expose dormant infections.

I'm pretty sure, the symptoms were exactly as described with brook. I've not heard of that trick, any good links?

Atarius · Nov 3, 2018

Gareth elliott said:
It is possible to develop immunity or resistance to any pathogen. But with parasites that means some may still be feeding and reproducing in the tank off those individuals. When new live stock without this resistance is added they fall ill. Best course of action would be to treat the remaining fish and run an appropriate fallow period.

Sounds like treating is the right thing to do!

Atarius · Nov 3, 2018

Crabs Mcjones said:
Welcome to R2R!

#WelcometoR2R
So sorry that happened to you. Yes, as long as there is a fish host for the parasite to continue feeding off of it can remain in the tank. Only way to eradicate it is to run your remaining fish through treatment in a quarantine tank, and let the display tank go fishless for a minimum of 6 weeks.

Thanks! Sounds to me like I need to treat!

HotRocks · Nov 3, 2018

I agree you will want to remove any remaining fish and treat them in QT.

DT will need to be fallow for 6 weeks to erradicate Brook. 76 days to be sure you have erradicated all strains of ich.

4FordFamily · Nov 3, 2018

Crabs Mcjones said:
Welcome to R2R!

#WelcometoR2R
So sorry that happened to you. Yes, as long as there is a fish host for the parasite to continue feeding off of it can remain in the tank. Only way to eradicate it is to run your remaining fish through treatment in a quarantine tank, and let the display tank go fishless for a minimum of 6 weeks.

Gareth elliott said:
It is possible to develop immunity or resistance to any pathogen. But with parasites that means some may still be feeding and reproducing in the tank off those individuals. When new live stock without this resistance is added they fall ill. Best course of action would be to treat the remaining fish and run an appropriate fallow period.

HotRocks said:
I agree you will want to remove any remaining fish and treat them in QT.

DT will need to be fallow for 6 weeks to erradicate Brook. 76 days to be sure you have erradicated all strains of ich.

Agree entirely. Except for Pikachu.

Seriously though welcome home, you will love it here on R2R!

don_chuwish · Nov 3, 2018

Is the suggestion to treat in QT with Metroplex? From my reading I get the feeling that anything Formalin based is out of favor these days. So what would be the protocol for known, but not emergency level Brooklynella?

Gareth elliott · Nov 3, 2018

don_chuwish said:
Is the suggestion to treat in QT with Metroplex? From my reading I get the feeling that anything Formalin based is out of favor these days. So what would be the protocol for known, but not emergency level Brooklynella?

If have the ability to get it, i would pick CP. there is always the chance its misidentified or is also infected with ich or velvet. All of which will be treated by CP.

Atarius · Nov 4, 2018

don_chuwish said:
Is the suggestion to treat in QT with Metroplex? From my reading I get the feeling that anything Formalin based is out of favor these days. So what would be the protocol for known, but not emergency level Brooklynella?

This is my thought process really. I'm going to QT and treat with formalin or Acriflavine, but my next issue is I don't know what I can get a hold of in the UK! Why has formalin fallen out of favour do you know?

I should also say that I'm planning to run a clean QT and then dip treat every few days, rather than run low level formalin in the QT.

don_chuwish · Nov 4, 2018

Atarius said:
Why has formalin fallen out of favour do you know?

See the conversation here: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/formalin.290925/

EBAquarist · Nov 4, 2018

Atarius said:
I can't seem to find anything concrete into but might not be looking in the right places!

Unfortunately there is very little scholarly literature on Brooklynella hostilis, much less its life cycle. Examples: Noga (2010) allocates one paragraph to its description in Fish Disease Diagnosis and Treatment; Basson and Van As (2006) allocate only 3 paragraphs to B. hostilis in their 29 page systematic review of ciliophoran research in Fish Diseases and Disorders, Volume 1: Protozoan and Metazoan Infections (edited by Woo).

There hasn't been much research on the parasite since it was first identified by Lom and Corliss (1971). I presume this is because it has been isolated mostly (but not exclusively) from aquarium fish and so there is little commercial incentive for research. For example, Woo and Buchmann's (2012) Fish Parasites: Pathobiology and Protection is a systematic review of the more significant parasites of commercially important fish and B. hostilis is not mentioned at all in its 396 pages.

I find that most of the information about B. hostilis is informal, indirect and/or anecdotal, based on what is known about other ciliophorans (e.g. Cryptocaryon irritans, Ichthyophthirius multifiliis, Chilodonella spp., etc.) as well as hobbyist observations.

Atarius said:
Why has formalin fallen out of favour do you know?

It's used quite heavily in both freshwater and marine food fish aquaculture. Partially this is because alternate chemotherapeutic agents (e.g. chloroquine) do not, at this stage, have a sufficiently rigorous evidence basis that allows regulatory approval where treated fish are intended for human consumption.

I also find that it's used often in freshwater aquaria. As an example, it's one of the few widely available and cost effective treatments for freshwater ich which, unlike marine ich, is resistant to chloroquine (Noga 2010; Tojo et al. 1994).

Atarius · Nov 5, 2018

Gareth elliott said:
If have the ability to get it, i would pick CP. there is always the chance its misidentified or is also infected with ich or velvet. All of which will be treated by CP.

I should have responded to this. By CP do you mean Cupramine?

Eagle_Steve · Nov 5, 2018

Atarius said:
I should have responded to this. By CP do you mean Cupramine?

Chloroquine phosphate

Humblefish's Thread Outlines it here:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/chloroquine-phosphate.192309/

Atarius · Nov 6, 2018

Eagle_Steve said:
Chloroquine phosphate

Humblefish's Thread Outlines it here:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/chloroquine-phosphate.192309/

As far as I can tell it might be a non-starter in the UK unfortunately! I think I might see if I can get hold of some metroplex.

racso415 · Apr 20, 2023

Homelander said:
Welcome to R2R!

#WelcometoR2R
So sorry that happened to you. Yes, as long as there is a fish host for the parasite to continue feeding off of it can remain in the tank. Only way to eradicate it is to run your remaining fish through treatment in a quarantine tank, and let the display tank go fishless for a minimum of 6 weeks.

So I had recent outbreak, but not sure if it was brooklynella involved ich. It all went south when i added a tang without qt. Yea i know big mistake. The tang died a couple of weeks later of being introduced, a few days later a clown and a damsel. But a yellow watchman and line wrasse are still around and no sign of illness. Its almost impossible to take them out to qt due to the scape. Any advice on how to proceed to add fish in the future now without risking a dormant parasite?