Can you help identify this?

SaltlifeHokie · Sep 14, 2020

Long story short- I’ve got 4 fish in QT for the 5 weeks. I ran Prazi for a week. Cupramine for 5 days. I decided to go with Copper Power so I ran Carbon and did a major water change to get the Cupramine out. I’ve ran Copper Power since 8/24 and been at therapeutic levels since 8/27. All fish have been eating well and looked really healthy. But Today I noticed my Royal gramma has something on its back fin. I can’t get a good picture because it’s so small. Here is a picture I found on the internet that looks similar. I really don’t think it’s ich because it’s almost like it’s a clear rubbed spot and not salt like. I’ve got a Hanna Checker and ive been keeping it anywhere from 2.10-2.25 just depending on when I’ve topped off water or siphoned the bottom. Not sure how ICH would survive all that. Thoughts?

SaltlifeHokie · Sep 15, 2020

SaltlifeHokie · Sep 15, 2020

Here are two actual pictures. His front fin is missing a little chunk but I thought it was from the Fox Face possibly?

His back tail is the spots I was wanting to get thoughts on. Any help with this would be great.

vetteguy53081 · Sep 15, 2020

Looks like a. Viral issue. What are your parameters (ammonia, nitrate, salinity, ph) and maintenance schedule?

Jay Hemdal · Sep 15, 2020

Broken fin rays can look like that. If they grow in number, or if the location changes day to day, it could be a disease.
I’m actually more concerned about the damaged pectoral fin- that is pretty severe. Whatever fish did it, could do it again on a different fin, even one bite like this each week will eventually build into a major issue, since there won’t be enough healing time. As vetteguy said, can you post your water quality info?
Jay

SaltlifeHokie · Sep 15, 2020

I’ve got a Seachem ammonia alert badge and it’s green (alert .005ppm). I honestly haven’t been testing nitrates or nitrites and have been doing 25% water changes roughly every 3-4 days. I could stand to do one today as it’s been 5 days.

It’s a 20 gallon long QT so I usually will fill up a 5 gallon bucket and do a water change.

Cbones1979 · Sep 15, 2020

SaltlifeHokie said:
Here are two actual pictures. His front fin is missing a little chunk but I thought it was from the Fox Face possibly?

His back tail is the spots I was wanting to get thoughts on. Any help with this would be great.

I just posted the same thing

SaltlifeHokie · Sep 15, 2020

Did you get any answers? Treatment?

Cbones1979 · Sep 15, 2020

SaltlifeHokie said:
Did you get any answers? Treatment?

I did not other than what I found on the site with similar pictures and descriptions. Going to treat it as bacterial for now and see if it changes.

Jay Hemdal · Sep 15, 2020

SaltlifeHokie said:
I’ve got a Seachem ammonia alert badge and it’s green (alert .005ppm). I honestly haven’t been testing nitrates or nitrites and have been doing 25% water changes roughly every 3-4 days. I could stand to do one today as it’s been 5 days.

It’s a 20 gallon long QT so I usually will fill up a 5 gallon bucket and do a water change.

The pectoral fin damage pretty much has to be from being bitten, could be the foxface, but unlikely, what else is in the tank? If the clownfish gets territorial, that would be my suspect.
Jay

SaltlifeHokie · Sep 15, 2020

Just a pair of Clowns and the foxface. Non have really shown much aggression. The bigger female clown sometimes will chase them but I’ve never seen it be real bite or bite. They’ve been in there 5 weeks and nothing until now.

How should I treat these backfin? Metroplex? Quality water parameters and it’ll go away?

Cbones1979 · Sep 16, 2020

Used metroplex and focus in food today. He didn’t eat anything but other fish did haha

SaltlifeHokie · Sep 16, 2020

I’ve got metroxplex in the food and also in the water. I didn’t think the metroxplex in the food would do anything since it’s not an internal infection and on the outside of the tail. Didn’t figure it would hurt tho so I also added a scoop to the water.

Cbones1979 · Sep 16, 2020

SaltlifeHokie said:
I’ve got metroxplex in the food and also in the water. I didn’t think the metroxplex in the food would do anything since it’s not an internal infection and on the outside of the tail. Didn’t figure it would hurt tho so I also added a scoop to the water.

The other medicine I received is for external. If it’s not viral I’ll try that

SaltlifeHokie · Sep 16, 2020

I was planning on getting some Melafix. Hope that works?

Jay Hemdal · Sep 16, 2020

SaltlifeHokie said:
I was planning on getting some Melafix. Hope that works?

I wouldn't rely on melafix, it has no substantiated studies behind it in marine aquariums, and the activity it has been shown to have should be considered more of a tonic than an actual antibiotic.

So - I'm having difficulty in that there are two threads rolled into one here. While I agree the spots on the two fish look similar, that can be deceiving, especially since the first fish also has bite damage on its pectoral fin that needs to be dealt with and the second picture isn't very clear.

I doubt this is a viral issue in either case. The first fish looks like it could be broken fin rays on the tail fin, these often result in white spots at the break. Since this fish also has the bitten pectoral fin, I'd say that's it. I suspect the female clown. You already saw it make at least a furtive pass at other fish. Remember, clowns are smart - while you are watching them for fighting, they are watching you and being on their best behavior! You can try watching from a darkened room, but be aware that just a couple of bites could have caused this and they took just a split second. You have very little chance of seeing overt aggression that happens once or twice a day.

The spot on cbones fish seems a bit larger, and more diffuse. I would say bacterial infection. Treating with a broad spectrum, gram negative antibiotic in a QT would be the action I would take.

Jay

Cbones1979 · Sep 16, 2020

Jay Hemdal said:
I wouldn't rely on melafix, it has no substantiated studies behind it in marine aquariums, and the activity it has been shown to have should be considered more of a tonic than an actual antibiotic.

So - I'm having difficulty in that there are two threads rolled into one here. While I agree the spots on the two fish look similar, that can be deceiving, especially since the first fish also has bite damage on its pectoral fin that needs to be dealt with and the second picture isn't very clear.

I doubt this is a viral issue in either case. The first fish looks like it could be broken fin rays on the tail fin, these often result in white spots at the break. Since this fish also has the bitten pectoral fin, I'd say that's it. I suspect the female clown. You already saw it make at least a furtive pass at other fish. Remember, clowns are smart - while you are watching them for fighting, they are watching you and being on their best behavior! You can try watching from a darkened room, but be aware that just a couple of bites could have caused this and they took just a split second. You have very little chance of seeing overt aggression that happens once or twice a day.

The spot on cbones fish seems a bit larger, and more diffuse. I would say bacterial infection. Treating with a broad spectrum, gram negative antibiotic in a QT would be the action I would take.

Jay

Will do