Carbondoser vs. 2-Stage Regulator System: Supply Pressure effect on CO2 flow

[Acuario]

You are correct. Any system that relies on the accuracy of a pH probe in your calcium reactor to turn on and off is ultimately at the mercy of the pH probe. The explanation I shared earlier is an attempt to offer my opinion on why I think a two-stage regulator is superior to a Carbondoser. I have used both. The two-stage regulator gives you a remarkably consistent flow rate independent of a pH probe. I use my Apex with a pH probe in the calcium reactor for an emergency shut-off only if things get out of control (never happened yet). I hope that helps clarify what I was trying to say.

 

[AlexG]

I use a carbondoser regulator on my Geo reactor which also utilizes a parasitic pump to pull water through the reactor. The setup has more or less been set it and forget it other than adjusting the reactor to keep up with the tank consumption. While I have a pH probe in the reactor it is only used as a safe guard in the event that the pH in the reactor gets below 6.45 then it will cut power to the carbondoser and it will also close a secondary solenoid valve on the CO2 supply line between the regulator and the reactor. I have had this setup in operation for almost 2 years now but I have not had to swap out a CO2 tank yet. It will be interesting to see how this system functions when the tank nears empty. I am thinking when I swap cylinders that I might put the new cylinder on a scale so I can have a better idea of when the cylinder is running low.

 

[Guttersnipe]

I have both a 2 stage regulator and a carbon doser regulator, the 2 stage runs my CaRx, the solenoid is always on, I don’t even care what my bubble count actually is. It’s on a 20lb cyclinder and I haven’t had to make an adjustment in over 8 months now. The carbon doser is still brand new and in the box in my shed. I can’t speak to the carbon doser’s effectiveness because I‘ve never used it.

Hi. I love your tank. Can you tell me how you run your calcium reactor? My carbon doser stopped working so I’m looking for a new way to run my carx. What regulator are you using?
Thanks Rick.45cal

 

[Rick.45cal]

Hi. I love your tank. Can you tell me how you run your calcium reactor? My carbon doser stopped working so I’m looking for a new way to run my carx. What regulator are you using?
Thanks Rick.45cal

I’ve got a Green Leaf Aquariums 2 stage regulator, I operate my CaRx by injecting enough CO2 that the effluent of the reactor is 20+ dKh. I use a peristaltic pump (an old analog Cole Palmer from ebay) and the effluent rate is about 60 ml/min (my tank is very high demand). I then wait to see what the tank dKh settles at. (usually about a week later). IF it’s lower than it was I’ll inject a tiny bit more CO2 into the reactor. (The solenoid is always on, it never clicks off). Then I’ll wait a week and test my dKh again. If it’s too high, I’ll adjust the needle valve on the regulator the tiniest bit down. This has been a very reliable and stable way for me to operate the reactor, I rarely if ever need to make an adjustment. The trick is to make singular adjustments when you can, try not to adjust multiple variables (flow rate and CO2) unless you are really far off the mark.

Getting it dialed in initially is the tricky part, once you are close tiny little adjustments are all you need. Go slow in the beginning and try not to make more than a single adjustment every 24 hours or so. I also think it’s more important to have a higher dKH in the effluent than it is to have a high flow rate through the reactor. My 60ml/min is probably pretty high for most tanks and I run a large reactor (a GEO 8”x18”).

If your using a pH probe I wouldn’t let it control the solenoid, at most I would use it as an arbitrary visual idea of the changes you are making with your tiny adjustments (realizing it’s readings are going to drift over time). I don’t count bubbles from the regulator, because the whole system is stable enough that I don’t need to.

Over the first year the only time I had to adjust the reactor was after changing the CO2 bottle It’s been a very stable carefree way to operate it. I hope this helps

 

[Guttersnipe]

I’ve got a Green Leaf Aquariums 2 stage regulator, I operate my CaRx by injecting enough CO2 that the effluent of the reactor is 20+ dKh. I use a peristaltic pump (an old analog Cole Palmer from ebay) and the effluent rate is about 60 ml/min (my tank is very high demand). I then wait to see what the tank dKh settles at. (usually about a week later). IF it’s lower than it was I’ll inject a tiny bit more CO2 into the reactor. (The solenoid is always on, it never clicks off). Then I’ll wait a week and test my dKh again. If it’s too high, I’ll adjust the needle valve on the regulator the tiniest bit down. This has been a very reliable and stable way for me to operate the reactor, I rarely if ever need to make an adjustment. The trick is to make singular adjustments when you can, try not to adjust multiple variables (flow rate and CO2) unless you are really far off the mark.

Getting it dialed in initially is the tricky part, once you are close tiny little adjustments are all you need. Go slow in the beginning and try not to make more than a single adjustment every 24 hours or so. I also think it’s more important to have a higher dKH in the effluent than it is to have a high flow rate through the reactor. My 60ml/min is probably pretty high for most tanks and I run a large reactor (a GEO 8”x18”).

If your using a pH probe I wouldn’t let it control the solenoid, at most I would use it as an arbitrary visual idea of the changes you are making with your tiny adjustments (realizing it’s readings are going to drift over time). I don’t count bubbles from the regulator, because the whole system is stable enough that I don’t need to.

Over the first year the only time I had to adjust the reactor was after changing the CO2 bottle It’s been a very stable carefree way to operate it. I hope this helps

Thank you so much for your input. I really appreciate it. That’s the route I will be taking.

 

[Bpb]

They both work fine. I think the tolerances you’re talking about are well below any concern levels for running a calcium reactor. I would be just as comfortable using either to be honest. I haven’t had to adjust the gas on my reactor in months anyway. Now....a full saturation type system to me is ideal because it renders the co2 delivery stabilization a completely moot point as alk delivery is driven purely on effluent speed

 

[X-37B]

I have a carx on my 120, Tunze 3171.
Its small vs others. I run Tunze manmade media.
ADA 2 stage regulator.
No controller or ph meter.
Set bubbles and effluent rate for a 20+dkh out of reactor and it has held steady at 8-8.2 since I set it up.
Has not impacted ph of the tank at all.
Super simple to setup and run.

 

[Guttersnipe]

I have a question for you guys running calcium reactors.
What is the pressure of co2 going into the reactor?

 

[X-37B]

I run 20psi on mine.
On my regulator, which is not a low pressure one, with a gauge for say 0-20psi I need to run it at 20 to achieve a steady flow. Many run lower though.

 

[Acuario]

Alex, to get an idea of your empty tank weight, you might look at the writing imprinted on your CO2 tank. My 10 ga. tank says "TW14.7" for Tare Weight 14.7 pounds. My tank weighed 24.6 lbs on my bathroom scale when I had it filled it last time.

 

[ReefGeezer]

I adjust CO2 rate (bubble count) so that not only the pH inside the reactor, but also the alkalinity of the effluent, remains at a predetermined level. The rate is a function of bubble size and bubble count. I have a pH controller that serves only as a safety in case the CO2 rate goes awry. The operation of such a system requires that the CO2 flow be constant. The solenoid never closes when operating as designed. I like my custom Airgas 2 Stage with a Swageloc industrial needle valve though. I have a much finer control of pressure (bubble size) and flow (bubble count). I think the size/count is also a little more stable than that produced by single stage systems that have less precise needle valves or those operated by a solenoid.

EOTD was a only a tiny consideration when I was buying a regulator. Had I not found a dual stage regulator for sale at a crazy low price, I probably would have bought a decent single stage and a high end needle valve instead.

 

[Guttersnipe]

What pumps are you guys using for the effluent? Do you use the pumps to push or pull water?

 

[Bpb]

What pumps are you guys using for the effluent? Do you use the pumps to push or pull water?

I use a Kamoer Fx-STP to pull through the reactor. I’ve got an old brush motor masterflex as a backup if the Kamoer goes down, and I’ve got a needle valve and maxijet 1200 if both go down

 

[acrocapital]

I’ve got a Green Leaf Aquariums 2 stage regulator, I operate my CaRx by injecting enough CO2 that the effluent of the reactor is 20+ dKh. I use a peristaltic pump (an old analog Cole Palmer from ebay) and the effluent rate is about 60 ml/min (my tank is very high demand). I then wait to see what the tank dKh settles at. (usually about a week later). IF it’s lower than it was I’ll inject a tiny bit more CO2 into the reactor. (The solenoid is always on, it never clicks off). Then I’ll wait a week and test my dKh again. If it’s too high, I’ll adjust the needle valve on the regulator the tiniest bit down. This has been a very reliable and stable way for me to operate the reactor, I rarely if ever need to make an adjustment. The trick is to make singular adjustments when you can, try not to adjust multiple variables (flow rate and CO2) unless you are really far off the mark.

Getting it dialed in initially is the tricky part, once you are close tiny little adjustments are all you need. Go slow in the beginning and try not to make more than a single adjustment every 24 hours or so. I also think it’s more important to have a higher dKH in the effluent than it is to have a high flow rate through the reactor. My 60ml/min is probably pretty high for most tanks and I run a large reactor (a GEO 8”x18”).

If your using a pH probe I wouldn’t let it control the solenoid, at most I would use it as an arbitrary visual idea of the changes you are making with your tiny adjustments (realizing it’s readings are going to drift over time). I don’t count bubbles from the regulator, because the whole system is stable enough that I don’t need to.

Over the first year the only time I had to adjust the reactor was after changing the CO2 bottle It’s been a very stable carefree way to operate it. I hope this helps

Thank you as well for the input! I was originally using a CarbonDoser and recently had it fail on me. The tank had run out of co2 and the check valve had failed to cause water to leak back up the line, ruining the CarbonDoser and Co2 tank .

I just installed the GLA 2 Stage Regulator instead, and now have 2 check valves on the Co2 line for added security lol. excited to see how it all runs!