Causes of slow growth?

Chrisss · Dec 28, 2015

Hi!

Just wanted some opinions on how to get better growth out of my SPS corals. Tank:

55g 4ft long tank
20g Sump
T5-Ho 4x54w individual reflections (Retrofit kit with Fans)
Bulbs- 2 Blue Plus 1 Actinic 1 Coral Plus
I do have a Par Meter so I can get readings but most SPS receiving from 180- 300 PAR

Parameters
Calcium 530
Alk 12.2
Magnesium 1380
Phosphates read 0 might not be
Nitrates 0
Ammonia 0
PH 8.1 to 8.3

Filtration:
70-90 pounds of live rock
NO refug
A Reef Octopus 160 INT (rated for 200g)
BioPellet Reactor
GFO + Carbon
RODI water

Just wondering on why my SPS are not growing so fast. I have Pulsating Xenia in my tank that took off. Its covers these 2 huge pieces of live rock and its continuing to grow. My LPS are also not doing so well. The grew a little bit at first but now have slowed down. They are happy though never closed and always open. (Torch, Hammers, Frogspawn). My Zoas are slowing melting away no clue why. No idea why they are melting away (probably not suited for my tank). But the LPS and SPS should be growing faster I think.

Its been about 2 months since I bought around 5 new pieces of SPS and they are pretty good size frags and probably only grew about 1 inch all combined. (I know they might still be acclimation but still that's like nothing?) Just wondering on any input that might be slowing my corals down.

Was thinking that my skimmer is too big. I dose Reef Energy A + B, and I did before I had a big skimmer which showed awesome growth in these 2 sps that I bought. I had a 75-INT EShopps skimmer rated for 75g. Which was probably the primary cause of this huge green turf algae outbreak, after I got a biopellet reactor and bigger skimmer the algae went away. But now I'm focus on corals because my water chemistry seems to be good. This tank has been up for about 3 years now.

Any input is helpful!

Thanks,
Chris

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M3ace9 · Dec 28, 2015

From the way your rockwork is set up I would suggest looking into providing more light for your sps. From personal experience I find near impossible for Zoas to grow near my sps because of the amount of par they are receiving. You may want to stack your rockwork higher towards the light and mount your sps this way. This is allow more light for them and keep your Lps happy also

Chrisss · Dec 28, 2015

The Zoa that is under the Montipora is in the shade. Its directly under to arches it was glued down before I moved the rock. So It receives very very low light.

The PAR for the Monti is 230. The Zoa under it is 70 PAR. That rock is around 3/4 to the top of my tank.

I can lower the lights more. I go new bulbs and raised them to acclimate too and decided to see if they might have been getting too much light since they were getting around 300 before.

M3ace9 · Dec 28, 2015

Other than deep water acros, your sps should like par from 350-750 depending on your nutrient level in your tank. I have had success running a higher nutrient tank with sps getting 700 during my photo period. There are many variables involved but for the most part I would so your acros would enjoy more light at this point.

Chrisss · Dec 28, 2015

Hmmm I'll lower the lights. I have a very low nutrient system so thats why I was running them lower. I can lower them and see if that makes a difference. Thanks!

Chrisss · Dec 28, 2015

Alright I lowered them and now im getting around 260 par. There's still one more notch I can lower them so I can probably get them to around 300+ PAR (Going to wait a week so I dont shock them). I was going to try and fit another 2x54w to make it a 6x54w but It cannot fit over my tank a little small >.> which is why its only a 4x54w. There would be a lot of wasted light

How long should I run my lights? I'm running them about 8 hours.

happyhourhero · Dec 28, 2015

If you have 0 nitrates and 0 phosphates and your dKH is really over 12, I would say that is something you may want to lower. Really now nutrients and very high alk dont mix well IME.

Chrisss · Dec 28, 2015

I have 2 red Sea ALK test kits. One reads 12 the other around 12.6 so im guessing its pretty high. I was thinking about lowering the dosage. I dose Kalk in my top off waters which is the only source of calcium and alk in my tank so I was thinking about cutting it. I just started using RedSea Coral PRO salt so It might be a little over kill.

Vaughn17 · Dec 28, 2015

IME, xenia outcompetes nuisance macroalgae for nutrients. I have some dinos in my 38 gallon sps tank that have nearly been eradicated since I added some pulsing xenia. Unfortunately, xenia seems to outcompete other coral, as well. I only have three (small) fish in the tank, so I've had to start feeding more to keep the corals happy (and alive).

I think maybe your corals are hungry (and your lighting sounds like it is on the low side for acros).

Chrisss · Dec 28, 2015

I was also thinking this. I mean for a total volume of 75g I have a yellow tang, 2 wrasses, 3 clownfish, hawkfish and w watchman/pistol pair. I think the bioload is pretty good, I feed once a day (and nori once a day) so I might not be feeding enough. I am trying to turn of the protien skimmer off for the majority of the day the fish are active to try and see if the increase of waste from the fish helps rather then being skimmed out instantly. (Just started yesterday)

Chrisss · Dec 28, 2015

I look a little more into my lighting and found out that I might be cooling it wrong. Might have had too powerful fans blowing on the lights to cool them down. So going to wait for them to heat up tomorrow and see if that improved the PAR output.

Russ265 · Dec 29, 2015

Pretty simple.

Symbiodinium aka zooxanthellae need nitrogen and phosphate. They provide energy to your coral. If they are 0... you have 0 growth.

A TON of great info here.

your alk is way high. I'd toss a birdsnest in there and see if he kicks the bucket in a week. If he doesnt, carry on. You have magic water.

add more fish, dose nitrate, or FEED a ton. like cyclopeeze every other day. I'll leave it up for you to decide. More light will be needed with more nutrients. Less for less nutrients.

230 par is pretty fine for a monti in low nutrient system.

hth and good luck

Chrisss · Dec 29, 2015

Russ265 said:
Pretty simple.

Symbiodinium aka zooxanthellae need nitrogen and phosphate. They provide energy to your coral. If they are 0... you have 0 growth.

A TON of great info here.

your alk is way high. I'd toss a birdsnest in there and see if he kicks the bucket in a week. If he doesnt, carry on. You have magic water.

add more fish, dose nitrate, or FEED a ton. like cyclopeeze every other day. I'll leave it up for you to decide. More light will be needed with more nutrients. Less for less nutrients.

230 par is pretty fine for a monti in low nutrient system.

hth and good luck

Thanks for all the info. I was always thinking this but I never went through with an actually solution.

Some things I did yesterday-
Stopped adding Kalk to top off water
Lowered lighted (And cooled them properly)
Par Value right now is 300. But I will bring it up to around 350 in a week then maybe even more in 2 weeks. (Can keep lowering lights)
Turned off skimmer for the day hours because skimmer oversized

Things I wanna do-
I was thinking about adding / feeding more fish but I don't know if my tank would keep up. I do have a huge skimmer but right now I am trying to keep it off for 8 hours. I don't have a refug so the only thing I don't want is an algae breakout. I have a yellow tang so that's the only reason I'm hesitant in doing so.
Maybe stop with Biopellets?

Never heard of cyclopeeze. Did some looking into it, seems like just a coral/fish powder food? Seems very expensive a small can is $220.
Is it similar to Reef Chili , Elos Plankton Supplement? Because I can probably buy those since Elos is my LFS/ BRS is easy.

Russ265 · Dec 29, 2015

Chrisss said:
Thanks for all the info. I was always thinking this but I never went through with an actually solution.

Some things I did yesterday-
Stopped adding Kalk to top off water
Lowered lighted (And cooled them properly)
Par Value right now is 300. But I will bring it up to around 350 in a week then maybe even more in 2 weeks. (Can keep lowering lights)
Turned off skimmer for the day hours because skimmer oversized

Things I wanna do-
I was thinking about adding / feeding more fish but I don't know if my tank would keep up. I do have a huge skimmer but right now I am trying to keep it off for 8 hours. I don't have a refug so the only thing I don't want is an algae breakout. I have a yellow tang so that's the only reason I'm hesitant in doing so.
Maybe stop with Biopellets?

Never heard of cyclopeeze. Did some looking into it, seems like just a coral/fish powder food? Seems very expensive a small can is $220.
Is it similar to Reef Chili , Elos Plankton Supplement? Because I can probably buy those since Elos is my LFS/ BRS is easy.

lot of things you can do.
if you keep nitrate variably above phosphate in an approximate 16 no3 to 1 part po4 you will not have algae issues. (my experience only)

turn off the pellets.
turn off the skimmer.

let nitrates rise to 10ppm and then roll with it. or stop anywhere between.

point is. a sterile tank will never grow coral. every LFS has fish pooping in their frag tank for a reason.

...most of all enjoy and dont chase the numbers

Chrisss · Dec 29, 2015

Russ265 said:
lot of things you can do.
if you keep nitrate variably above phosphate in an approximate 16 no3 to 1 part po4 you will not have algae issues. (my experience only)

turn off the pellets.
turn off the skimmer.

let nitrates rise to 10ppm and then roll with it. or stop anywhere between.

point is. a sterile tank will never grow coral. every LFS has fish pooping in their frag tank for a reason.

...most of all enjoy and dont chase the numbers

I did read that before the phosphate to nitrate ratio. But i feel like test kits are way to inaccurate to actually do it.

Should I keep skimmer off for a few hours like I am now or just completely off? (How long should I run after I turn it back on because then nitrates might decrease again)

The dirty water is true though haha just went to Petco to buy some Nori and there frag tank looks gross like algae (no offence) but had like 3 tangs and like 4 scooter blennys but there corals looked like crazy healthy and were growing on the frag stand. (They did have a 6x54w though) So also better lighting.

I don't really chase number I usually just go by eye and test about every few weeks to make sure everything in order. Just been recently that I have been trying to get my corals to grow since I'm off school and can spend some time with the tank.

One question, Anything else you would recommend for dosing the tank? Like cyclop-eeze would that be frozen or dried? Or anything other cheaper alternative

?

Thanks for the reply's though really helpful!

Russ265 · Dec 29, 2015

Chrisss said:
I did read that before the phosphate to nitrate ratio. But i feel like test kits are way to inaccurate to actually do it.

Should I keep skimmer off for a few hours like I am now or just completely off? (How long should I run after I turn it back on because then nitrates might decrease again)

The dirty water is true though haha just went to Petco to buy some Nori and there frag tank looks gross like algae (no offence) but had like 3 tangs and like 4 scooter blennys but there corals looked like crazy healthy and were growing on the frag stand. (They did have a 6x54w though) So also better lighting.

I don't really chase number I usually just go by eye and test about every few weeks to make sure everything in order. Just been recently that I have been trying to get my corals to grow since I'm off school and can spend some time with the tank.

One question, Anything else you would recommend for dosing the tank? Like cyclop-eeze would that be frozen or dried? Or anything other cheaper alternative?

Thanks for the reply's though really helpful!

well ugly tanks have algae eating up phosphate and nitrate to keep the water clean.

sure it isnt sightly. but dont underestimate it.

just get nitrates and phosphate detectable. you should see an improvement in terms of growth.

Tangchaser · Dec 29, 2015

Lol I love the part about pooping in the frag tank! I agree with him on the nitrates and phosphates are good in moderation. Other than that it's stability, flow, and light. My own personal opinion is that to many people focus on light and don't focus on all the other important factors. I myself notice more growth when I first added a wave maker that pulsed and drastically uped the flow in my tank. Some more advice is what ever changes you decide to make, do them slowly. Stability!

Chrisss · Dec 29, 2015

Yes I know very slowly. That's why im lowering the lights as slow as I can. And for the skimmer I think cut in half of up time is pretty slow. The no kalk in top off water I don't think needs to be slow so I juts stopped completely.

I might get another fish for more poop, maybe a fairy wrasse or something I love the red on them. I did get a new wave maker the gyre XF150 its really strong, still playing around with it, I have it pulsing at 40% to 20% during the day and constant 20 to 30% at night. It might not be enough, but Its hard to tell because if I go above 40% a sand storm happens haha and fish start flying outta the tank.

Chrisss · Dec 30, 2015

I added a Jebao WP-10 pointed directly at my SPS rocks hopefully that helps with the randomness of flow. The Gyre is a little bit too powerful to have on random flow so lets see if this helps.