Changing from Leds to MH for 36x36x20 cube, need help

[Ardeus]

It's a mixed reef with around 30 anemones, 1 of them being a magnifica.


It is currently lit by a Maxspect Razor 180 watt 15000K. I don't like the purple tone, the electric shimmer and it obviously leaves the tank corners very dark.

I am thinking about a double arc 14000K/22000K. I found a 2nd hand unit (400 watts) for 50 euros:

250 or 400 watt? I work from home so I would prefer less intensity and longer period. 250 watts would be enough?

 

[jda]

250 should be fine. Keep that 400w ballast, just in case... for the pennies that you can get for it, it is worth having in case you want more output.

What color are you looking for? Whiter, bluer, in the middle?

 

[Ardeus]

Letting go of the controlability of the leds is a difficult decision. To be able to look at the tank under changing light is something I really appreciate.

That's the reason I wanted a double arc bulb. 14000k for the main photoperiod and 22000k for the evening to allow me to appreciate the fluorescence.

I don't particularly like the blue tone for the main lighting period and I really hate the Maxspect's 15000K purple look that makes the tank look like "Barbie's reef", I prefer a closer look to what you see in the ocean in shallow water.

I ramp up only the whites on the maxspect and then the blues join in until both channels are on 100%. At evening the white channel ramps down allowing me to watch the fluorescence of the corals.

I have a friend coming over tomorrow to help me rescape the tank and he's going to bring a couple of these "fill" lights to see if they can complement the maxspect during the main photoperiod.

 

[Ardeus]

Will that icecap ballast be adequate for this bulb?

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/290726988341

 

[Elegance Coral]

Yes, the icecap ballast will run that light. Most people report good results from those cheap Chinese bulbs, but they didn't work out for me. All of my corals started turning a weird shade of gray and dying. I switched back to Radiums and everything healed. I'll never try that again.

 

[Ardeus]

Thanks for the warning. I will decide tomorrow after testing the maxspect with the other 2 led fixtures.

 

[jda]

You do not get to pick which one of the colors fires... they both fire at the same time. I cannot tell if you want to run one arc during part of the day and the other other later one.

 

[Ardeus]

I saw them connected to timers that turn the light off for 5 minutes or so and that seemed to assure that the arcs work in alternation. Thanks for the warning, I will try to get more information on how to control these bulbs.

 

[jda]

Cool. Make sure that the ballast that you choose can handle that. Electronics can cycle quickly, but some of the more powerful magnetics might take 15-30 minutes to cycle.

 

[jda]

I would look for crisp white true 14k look. Most of those nems are going to be fairly easy to care for, but the H Mag might really like some warmer light.

If you keep the electronic 400W, then I might suggest a 14k Hamilton. If you go 250w, then 20K Radium on m80 is great... but if you use electronic, then I would also suggest the 14k Hamilton. Ballasts matter a lot and you have to match the bulb with the ballast that it was built for. Radium 20k is not as blue as most 20k bulbs if you use it on the m80 ballast... it gets bluer on electronic and is too blue for me.

FWIW - the output of the 250w Radium on the correct m80 ballast is the same almost any 400w 14-20k bulb on electronic. This is why they are so popular... great looks, growth and can save a bit of money on electricity. It is only a dime a day for a single bulb here where I live, but people who run many of them them really appreciate it.

 

[reefwiser]

I would get a Reefbrite light. As their units are made to work with dual arch lights. Also a Mh with a led blue strip gives you the best of both worlds and low current draw. My 150 mh/ led unit draws less than when I had a radion 30 Pro on my Aquarium.

 

[Ardeus]

The US still has a market for metal halides, but here it's almost impossible to find them.

Importing them, it's almost double the cost, if you account for shipping, import taxes and VAT.

 

[ocboat]

My tank has almost the same dimensions (22" high) and a 250w m80 ballast with a Radium bulb is one of the many lights that I have used on the tank. It provided good coverage and things seemed to do well under it but I could not figure out a good way to add supplemental lights to the reflector. I know the corals don't need it but I also like the ramping up and down of leds especially in the late evening so I switched to a couple of Radions. I have an 11 year old magnifica that has done well under all the lights that I have used.

 

[Ardeus]

Thanks.

I can get that 1st with the pendant and icecap balast for 50 euros, but it's 400Watt, it's going to cost me more in the long run. It seems 400 watts is an overkill for this tank.

I am not willing to stop being able to watch the fluorescence in the evening, so a single metal halide is not going to do it, that's the reason I was thinking about the twin arc bulbs with 14000K/22000K options

Tomorrow I will try to suplement the razor with the 2 led fixtures (just 45 euros each) and see how it looks. It will be like an overpowered and less controllable maxspect recurve.

I already have a skimmer, an uv and a refugium hanging on the back glass, so putting 2 more fixtures on top of the tank may look too messy.

 

[Ardeus]

It did look messy and I didn't like the look of the corals and fish with the 2 extra fixtures on.

I will give this lighting problem some thought for a few days.

 

[Ardeus]

After looking into all sorts of options I made a decision.

I want a fully controllable MH T5. It doesn't exist and I am not convinced to drop a serious amount of money for something that will not convince me.

I looked into the Giesemann Aurora hybrid, with led pads and dimmable T5. It's not quite there yet. The led pads give an electric epileptic inducing shimmer. On top of that, the T5 overpower the leds.

I looked into the Maxspect Recurve. Again the epileptic led pads. On top of that, it has underpowered led strips with an odd led selection.

I looked in Kessil AP700 and its recent clones. They need T5 to soften that mad intense shimmering. I have seen combos of AP700 with T5 and it seems to work, but the T5 are not dimmable without some serious DIY work and it will make a mess on top of the tank. The AP700 still has some problems that make it somewhat of a beta product.

I guess I will have to wait a couple more years for the right fixture.

In the meantime I got another Razor 180watts (2nd hand).

My Razor is now 5 years old and if it fails I will have a backup.

I plan on using both with slightly different schedules so that the front of the tank will have a slightly warmer tone and the back will be more blue.

I hope this will enhance the perception of depth in the tank.

 

[jda]

Good call getting a backup.

Some of us have been waiting almost a decade for LEDs to be an actual viable solution without losing performance that I have today.

Did you look at the dimmable ATI Sunpower units? ...not sure what kind of control you are wanting, but all of the bulbs dim.

 

[Ardeus]

I did look at them, but I couldn't fit 1 unit on each side of an Aqua Medic Angel 200 (that's the kessil AP700 knockoff I selected). It would be an expensive mess on top of the tank.

When I see a balanced dense led matrix fixture with diffused led strips on each side, I will get one. The current options on the market would cost some serious cash for something that is not what I want.

Everybody knows that the MH T5 combo with full controllability is the standard to get and the technology to achieve this is here. So why there's no one doing it? Especially Kessil?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

I belive that, like crt television, it’s not about performance. It’s about manufacturer convince and price.

A crt will take any number of pixels.
But it’s heavy to ship and plastic is less expensive than glass.

I’d add , folks like to mix their own colors. Even though they don’t actually know what they are doing.
It makes them feel sciencey.
In HD. Lol.

 

[Jeepguy242]

metal halide is going to be more "shimmer" than a led fixture....

that is unless you are talking about the "disco ball" effect that some of the cheap led's put out because the colors dont mix well...

Disco ball



Halide shimmer from my tank