Cheto isn't growing?

[powertodareefle]

My tank is only about 10 weeks old. After reading on R2R that my tank is probably to new and clean, Zoa's are losing color, I'm slowly removing the Seachem matrix from the sump.
I'm looking for other suggestions or pointers to get cheto to grow and params where they need to be.
Tests run on 9/24 11 a.m.
Alk 7.6 This is low
Ph 7.7 Both air lines for skimmer are outside
Trite .02
Trate 4
Amon 0
Sal .024
Phos .23 This is high
Temp 78.4
Cal 420
Mag 1020 This is low
I know several of these are a little off.
My main concern is getting my sump set up right.
Set up is as follows
200 Sock
Skimmer
Refugium Bottom flow in, top flow out
W/Cheto, marine pure block, carib-sea sand, two snails and heater
Bubble trap w/Seachem Matrix and a bag of charcoal
return pump.
I'm on my second package of Cheto, it's slowly turning grayish brown and soft, which is when I pick those discolored clumps out and toss them. I am using a decent grow light at night.
Also wondering if I should add some copapods to Refug to possibly kick start it?

 

[Ashish Patel]

How many fish do you have and how much do you feed? I had no problem growing Chaeto after 1 month of setting the tank up with all dry rock. The chaeto will use up nutrients from fish food and fish waste. My Phosphates and Nitrates where close to 0 so I dosed amino acids and fed heavy and this will provide sufficient nutrients. You can also increase your photoperiod to 18-24 hrs see if that helps.

whatever you do don't dose nitrates. Your tank is still young and ever day it will mature and create new natural foods for your tank. Trick is to feed with a autofeeder 2-3 times per day and 1 time frozen food. Constant food = constant waste = constant nutrients for chaeto to grow and your tank to mature.

Also, if your using chemipure elite or blue or GFO, remove it, or reduce your skimmer usage or better yet shut it down for few months. This is advice I wish I had when I started but I used chemi pure blue, overskimmered, and overfed to compensate.

 

[mtraylor]

Before you get worried over the Chaeto. I think your first step is to get your water parameters under control. Everything will work from there.

 

[mcarroll]

Alk 7.6 This is low

Do you know why? What's your target?

Ph 7.7 Both air lines for skimmer are outside

Seems like the airlines being outside is not working. What pH do you get without the lines to the outside? Remember that "Low pH" is somewhat of a made up issue. Under the right circumstances anything can be a negative....but low pH actually indicates very favorable conditions for growth. Unless you have multiple indications of a problem, you should freely ignore pH. It can be useful in some circumstances....so log it....but don't watch it. Your issues are not related to pH.

Trite .02

If true, this is a big problem – double check the result if there's any doubt. Presence of nitrites indicates that you're moving too fast.

10 weeks is a pretty long time.....so it may also indicate that you've done something to stall the cycle overall.

Trate 4

This is about even with your PO4 level (considering the redfield ratio).....I would take no action against this.

Phos .23 This is high

Ditto above. I'd take no action.

Mag 1020 This is low

Same reason as low alk?

Are you targeting 1350 ppm?

I know several of these are a little off.
My main concern is getting my sump set up right.

The sump looks fine – definitely not part of the problem.

W/Cheto, marine pure block, carib-sea sand, two snails and heater
Bubble trap w/Seachem Matrix and a bag of charcoal

• Too early for chaeto....so stop trying after this one until you have a significant bio-load installed.
• No need for marine pure if you have live rock. Might be complicating things at this point. I'd remove it.
• Matrix is the same deal...if you have live rock, it's "extra". I'd remove it.
• Even activated carbon should be unnecessary this early into the tank, so I'd also remove that.
• How are the snails getting along?
• The idea until things are 100% normal is for you to do as little as possible and to let the tank finish "running in" naturally.
• While that's happening, you'll also have plenty of time to get your water changes and/or dosing going to straighten out the numbers and keep them that way. No big deal!!

 

[powertodareefle]

Do you know why? What's your target?



Seems like the airlines being outside is not working. What pH do you get without the lines to the outside? Remember that "Low pH" is somewhat of a made up issue. Under the right circumstances anything can be a negative....but low pH actually indicates very favorable conditions for growth. Unless you have multiple indications of a problem, you should freely ignore pH. It can be useful in some circumstances....so log it....but don't watch it. Your issues are not related to pH.



If true, this is a big problem – double check the result if there's any doubt. Presence of nitrites indicates that you're moving too fast.

10 weeks is a pretty long time.....so it may also indicate that you've done something to stall the cycle overall.



This is about even with your PO4 level (considering the redfield ratio).....I would take no action against this.


Ditto above. I'd take no action.



Same reason as low alk?

Are you targeting 1350 ppm?



The sump looks fine – definitely not part of the problem.

• Too early for chaeto....so stop trying after this one until you have a significant bio-load installed.
• No need for marine pure if you have live rock. Might be complicating things at this point. I'd remove it.
• Matrix is the same deal...if you have live rock, it's "extra". I'd remove it.
• Even activated carbon should be unnecessary this early into the tank, so I'd also remove that.
• How are the snails getting along?
• The idea until things are 100% normal is for you to do as little as possible and to let the tank finish "running in" naturally.
• While that's happening, you'll also have plenty of time to get your water changes and/or dosing going to straighten out the numbers and keep them that way. No big deal!!

Thanks for the info, I thought I was doing to much to soon. without the airlines outside Ph is 7.4 instead of 7.7, Snails are occasionally dying.I have now taken all of the carbon out of the tank (About 2 hours before this post). I'll keep removing the Matrix slowly over the next few days.
Nitrite at 0.02 is to high?
I'm feeding wet food twice a day. Blood worms and mysis shrimp. Occasionally flakes. (I thought I was feeding to much)
I have six fish in the tank.
2 clowns
1 Diamond gobi
1 Rainford gobi
2 Firefish
1 emerald crab
1 Pom Pom crab
5 Blue leg crabs
8 trochus(sic) snails
11 Frag plugs
70g tank with 20g sump
50 lbs Caribsea rock 60 lbs Caribsea sand
I started with Instant Ocean reef crystals but the last three Water changes I've been switching to HW wiegandt reefer mix, for the Cal and Mag.
Again thanks for the pointers!

 

[K. Steven]

Thanks for the info, I thought I was doing to much to soon. without the airlines outside Ph is 7.4 instead of 7.7, Snails are occasionally dying.I have now taken all of the carbon out of the tank (About 2 hours before this post). I'll keep removing the Matrix slowly over the next few days.
Nitrite at 0.02 is to high?
I'm feeding wet food twice a day. Blood worms and mysis shrimp. Occasionally flakes. (I thought I was feeding to much)
I have six fish in the tank.
2 clowns
1 Diamond gobi
1 Rainford gobi
2 Firefish
1 emerald crab
1 Pom Pom crab
5 Blue leg crabs
8 trochus(sic) snails
11 Frag plugs
70g tank with 20g sump
50 lbs Caribsea rock 60 lbs Caribsea sand
I started with Instant Ocean reef crystals but the last three Water changes I've been switching to HW wiegandt reefer mix, for the Cal and Mag.
Again thanks for the pointers!

Any detectable nitrite is not good. Once cycled, no ammonia or nitrite should be present, only nitrate. You may be removing too much of your biological filtration by taking out the Matrix, depending on the amount of surface area you have in the tank for nitrifying bacteria.

 

[powertodareefle]

 

[powertodareefle]

Just two pics close up and overall.

 

[powertodareefle]

How many fish do you have and how much do you feed? I had no problem growing Chaeto after 1 month of setting the tank up with all dry rock. The chaeto will use up nutrients from fish food and fish waste. My Phosphates and Nitrates where close to 0 so I dosed amino acids and fed heavy and this will provide sufficient nutrients. You can also increase your photoperiod to 18-24 hrs see if that helps.

whatever you do don't dose nitrates. Your tank is still young and ever day it will mature and create new natural foods for your tank. Trick is to feed with a autofeeder 2-3 times per day and 1 time frozen food. Constant food = constant waste = constant nutrients for chaeto to grow and your tank to mature.

Also, if your using chemipure elite or blue or GFO, remove it, or reduce your skimmer usage or better yet shut it down for few months. This is advice I wish I had when I started but I used chemi pure blue, overskimmered, and overfed to compensate.

I don't dose anything, Just used Kalkwasser the other day (just once)
I have six small fish. I feed twice a day, wet food.
I don't use Chemipure, blue or GFO
Thanks for info.

 

[Ashish Patel]

Don't see anything wrong.. Just give it sometimes - don't try anything drastic

 

[OREGONIC]

I don't dose anything, Just used Kalkwasser the other day (just once)
I have six small fish. I feed twice a day, wet food.
I don't use Chemipure, blue or GFO
Thanks for info.

Dosing 2 part or using kalk in ato will help keep parameters stable and boost ph at same time. If i were you i would choose a salt and try to keep your parameters same as a freshly mixed batch.