Chrysophytes battle

[reeferfoxx]

I bought some stump remover tonight to add nitrates. I understand that the corals need nitrates for photosynthesis and coloration, but why does low nutrients promote the chrysophytes? Not doubting it at all, just want to understand it.

Depends on the tank. Typically newer tanks run across this more so than established tanks.
Can you post a picture of your tank and your chrysos?

 

[MasonReef]

I would recommend that, yes. However with a 240.... It's hard to say do water changes on it because it's so much water lol.

Lets try something different. Sort of like two sessions. I think a canister filter would be best for your tank just so we can save as much water.

DAY 1

1. Manual removal via toothbrush and canister filter. Let it clear before GFO.
2. Then add recommended GFO per tank volume for 24 hours.
3. Monitor Alk and nutrients.(no3/po4)

DAY 2

1. Remove GFO.
2. Focus on Alk, NO3, PO4
   
3. Take a break.

DAY 3

1. Manual removal via toothbrush and canister filter. Let it clear before GFO.
2. Then add recommended GFO per tank volume for 24 hours.
3. Monitor Alk and nutrients.(no3/po4).

DAY 4

1. Remove GFO.
2. Water change.
   
3. Monitor parameters.

Wow! Thank you writing out a plan of action. I'm going to get to work on this first thing in the morning. I'm glad I found this thread, its perfect timing.

 

[MasonReef]

Depends on the tank. Typically newer tanks run across this more so than established tanks.
Can you post a picture of your tank and your chrysos?

I'm new to reef2reef and am having problems posting a picture. Here is my build thread on my local reef club forums. The linked post is from March and I just got done moving my tank to a new house. The same stuff is what is present today. Oddly when I moved the tank the chryos went away for about a week, but is back with a vengeance.

http://www.austinreefclub.com/topic...0-gallon-build/?do=findComment&comment=317268

 

[mcarroll]

I bought some stump remover tonight to add nitrates. I understand that the corals need nitrates for photosynthesis and coloration, but why does low nutrients promote the chrysophytes? Not doubting it at all, just want to understand it.

I wish I understood chrysophytes "as well" as I (think) I understand dino's and bryopsis.....but I don't.

The best I can offer is that the lack of nutrients hampers their competition which leaves room for "something else" to bloom....at least in some of our cases, there's an associated spike in salinity that seems to bring out the chrysophytes.

Any chance you had a salinity spike along the way that lead to the initial bloom of chrysophytes?

 

[reeferfoxx]

I'm new to reef2reef and am having problems posting a picture. Here is my build thread on my local reef club forums. The linked post is from March and I just got done moving my tank to a new house. The same stuff is what is present today. Oddly when I moved the tank the chryos went away for about a week, but is back with a vengeance.

http://www.austinreefclub.com/topic...0-gallon-build/?do=findComment&comment=317268

Nice tank!

Yours looks just like what I had. Growth became noticeable after the 'forever' diatom bloom. I just associate it with large amounts of silica and po4 leaching from new(or mined) rocks. The addition of astrea or trochus snails would benefit too, with keeping rocks clean.

 

[pboutin]

Day 6 - continued (5/20)
Water change 20% 40 gal finished at 1pm
1pm
Dosed 10 ml KN03 - into Sump
Dosed 20 ml of P2O5- into Sump
7pm
Measured 0.25 ppm NO3
Measured 0.08 ppm PO4
Dosed 10 ml KN03 - into Sump

Changes:
Changed filter pad, cleaned Skimmer cup and neck
Fed corals broadcast feeding of BenePets BeneReef after lights out

Observations:
Algae seems to be getting darker in the refugium
Corals by 6pm were looking good, starting to open up

Day 7 (5/21)
Measured 0 ppm NO3
Measured 0.08 ppm PO4 - remained the same without any dosing
Dosed 20 ml KN03 - into Sump

Observations:
Tank still appears clean, the remaining chrysophytes hanging out on the rocks are changing color to a brown and seems to be receding.
Corals look awesome this AM fully open and beginning to recover. The Algae in the refugium is continuing to green up and my Cheato seems to have increased in size.

Notes:
My nitrates are back down to 0 after being at 0.5 ppm after last nights dose. I dosed again this morning 20 ml to bring the NO3 back up to 0.5 ppm. I'll continue to monitor both phosphates and Nitrates and dose accordingly until they either maintain levels on their own or rise on their own. Removing the bioreactor was indeed what ultimately helped me get the tank parameters back in line. I can assume now that my refugium algae is what is keeping the Nitrates down with its continued growth of algae.

 

[pboutin]

I bought some stump remover tonight to add nitrates. I understand that the corals need nitrates for photosynthesis and coloration, but why does low nutrients promote the chrysophytes? Not doubting it at all, just want to understand it.

I believe now that my nutrient deficient system has been the cause of all my issues for over 4 years now. Had I known then what I know today... It would deff be a different tank! Between battling these chrysophytes (what I thought was Dinos) 3 or so years ago, loosing all of my coral to bleaching (again thought the cause was Dinos but was low nutrients) losing most of my fish during the fight (low oxygen levels). I truly believe getting your NO3 and PO4 in check and above 0 will fix most of the problems. Follow what you see here for eradication method and hopefully we will be free of this mess once and for all.

 

[mcarroll]

Now that you're seeing difinitive changes, consider throttling back to "normal" on the KNO3 doses soon....the system may aklready have all it needs.

 

[pboutin]

Now that you're seeing definitive changes, consider throttling back to "normal" on the KNO3 doses soon....the system may already have all it needs.

I need to see a positive reading on my test kit before I throttle back. I'll keep the system at 0.5 ppm of KNO3 and 0.8 ppm of PO4. Once they begin to rise on their own I'll back off the dosing. Believe me, I do NOT want to be dosing and testing every day!

 

[mcarroll]

I need to see a positive reading on my test kit before I throttle back.

Actaully you really don't – that's what I was saying. Now that your'e seeing the changes in the algae, the system may already have what it needs.

Targeting a specific number really just gives you someplace to start dosing....there's nothing magical about any number on a test kit.

 

[pboutin]

Actually you really don't – that's what I was saying. Now that you're seeing the changes in the algae, the system may already have what it needs.

Targeting a specific number really just gives you someplace to start dosing....there's nothing magical about any number on a test kit.

OK maybe I didn't say that correctly. I'm NOT going to increase the dosages my goal is to stabilize my system until it is doing it on its own. I'll attempt to let it do it on its own but will try to help it along as naturally as I can. I'll feed more than needed both fish and coral to get my Nitrates up. If ever the test reading is at zero i'll do a small dosage to ensure the system has what it needs. As of now it's still quite low, too low in my opinion to just let it go unchecked.

 

[mcarroll]

You're totally on the right path!

 

[pboutin]

Day 7 - continued (5/21)
Dosed 10 ml KN03 - into Sump at 7pm

Changes:
Fed a whole cube of frozen Mysis shrimp
Fed corals broadcast feeding of BenePets BeneReef after lights out

Observations:
Corals are fully open and look great

Day 8 (5/22)
Measured 0 ppm NO3
Measured 0.08 ppm PO4 - might be slightly lower but chose the closest point on the test chart.
Dosed 20 ml KN03 - into Sump

Changes:
Turned off UV
Turned off Skimmer to attempt to get the nitrates to rise naturally

Observations:
The remaining chrysophytes hanging out on the rocks are changing to a darker brown color now and seem to be going away.
I noticed some chrysophytes floating around the tank seemingly dead.
Corals continue to look great, fully open. There seems to be more cyanobacteria in the refugium growing over the macroalgae and spread across the back glass. (As long as it's not in my display I'm OK with that)

Notes:
My nitrates are back down to 0 after being at 0.5 ppm yesterday. I dosed again this morning 20 ml to bring the NO3 back up to 0.5 ppm. I'll test again tonight to see what I may have gained from turning off the UV and skimmer before dosing anything.

 

[reeferfoxx]

Day 7 - continued (5/21)
Dosed 10 ml KN03 - into Sump at 7pm

Changes:
Fed a whole cube of frozen Mysis shrimp
Fed corals broadcast feeding of BenePets BeneReef after lights out

Observations:
Corals are fully open and look great

Day 8 (5/22)
Measured 0 ppm NO3
Measured 0.08 ppm PO4 - might be slightly lower but chose the closest point on the test chart.
Dosed 20 ml KN03 - into Sump

Changes:
Turned off UV
Turned off Skimmer to attempt to get the nitrates to rise naturally

Observations:
The remaining chrysophytes hanging out on the rocks are changing to a darker brown color now and seem to be going away.
I noticed some chrysophytes floating around the tank seemingly dead.
Corals continue to look great, fully open. There seems to be more cyanobacteria in the refugium growing over the macroalgae and spread across the back glass. (As long as it's not in my display I'm OK with that)

Notes:
My nitrates are back down to 0 after being at 0.5 ppm yesterday. I dosed again this morning 20 ml to bring the NO3 back up to 0.5 ppm. I'll test again tonight to see what I may have gained from turning off the UV and skimmer before dosing anything.

Do you remember how much stump remover to rodi you mixed? I am wondering if you aren't dosing a low or diluted mixture?

 

[pboutin]

Do you remember how much stump remover to rodi you mixed? I am wondering if you aren't dosing a low or diluted mixture?

Yeah it's a low dose.. I have it here

Mix 12.34 grams of KNO3 to 500mL RODI. Adding 10mL of this mix to 160 gal aquarium to yield:
Element ppm/degree
NO3 0.25
N 0.06
K 0.16

 

[reeferfoxx]

Yeah it's a low dose.. I have it here

Gotcha. Just making sure lol

Although you are seeing progress with chrysophytes I think any noticeable chrysos left over should be toothbrushed off and canister filtered out. When I was battling this I noticed I would have some left over and then it would bounce back to where I was. Just to be safe, i would just take the extra time and try to get those spots you missed before.

Once I got rid of chrysophytes I too had a cyano outbreak.

 

[mcarroll]

Once I got rid of chrysophytes I too had a cyano outbreak.

Yup yup. It's a healthy step!

@pboutin, I think cyano works to fix N into your tank's nitrogen-cycle at the micro-level while microorganisms in the tank that were previosuly starved-out continue to fill in.

Not all important microbes are equally adept at using dissolved nutrients (which are still apparently in short supply) – in fact, many important microbes have to eat their N. In many cases cyano is on their menu and it may be the only N-rich source in the tank for them at the moment!

(Aside: In my tank, I suspect that if I had more grazers my main cyano patches would be more gone than they already are. As it is, the cerith snails are my main CUC and only occasionally visit the dying cyano....the asterinas, limpets and bristleworms are all I see eating cyano all the time.)

 

[mcarroll]

Yeah it's a low dose.. I have it here

Did you get a chance to look at the KNO3 calculator here:
A Nitrate Dosing Calculator For Better Tank Health (And Better Coral Color!)

Not that you did it wrong, but I'd use that to set up your mix and doses just for good measure.

Using the "standard concentration" makes these conversations a go a little smoother since we'll all then know what "dosed 20ml" means.

 

[pboutin]

Did you get a chance to look at the KNO3 calculator here:
A Nitrate Dosing Calculator For Better Tank Health (And Better Coral Color!)

Not that you did it wrong, but I'd use that to set up your mix and doses just for good measure.

Using the "standard concentration" makes these conversations a go a little smoother since we'll all then know what "dosed 20ml" means.

No I didn't I used this one: https://rotalabutterfly.com/nutrient-calculator.php

 

[pboutin]

As it is, the cerith snails are my main CUC and only occasionally visit the dying cyano....the asterinas, limpets and bristleworms are all I see eating cyano all the time.)

I have a few Nerite Snails that seems to occasionally eat it.