Clam died after 3ish years, why though?

[m0jjen]

Okay so basically its a goner and im aware of that. I just cant pinpoint why it would die after 3 years in my care.

I noticed yesterday that it had taken a turn for the worse and started testing.

No3:4 (red sea pro)
Po4: 0.04 (red sea pro)
Kh: 7.7 (alkatronic and salifert)
Ca: 420 (red sea pro)
Mg 1360 (red sea pro)
Salinity 1.025 (refractometer + milwaukee digital refractometer)

Changes and happnings are:

Stopped dosing trace (red sea color a-d) only dosed 1 mil every other day. ~2 weeks ago to see if it would have any impact on cyano

Changed the flow abit (not intensity just patterns) from reef creft only to some pulse / tidal swell / reef crest rotation

I accidentally dipped my arm into the tank while doing a WC ~4 hours after applying sunscreen. I did however wash my arm in tap water multiple times after applying sunscreen due to having a messy toddler before dipping my arm in so most of it should have been washed of.

Removed activated carbon ~1 week before sign of dying or stress.

Any of them could have contributed I guess. Mostly so if any sunscreen actually got into the water but that should impact more than the clam?

No picking on the clam until yesterday when the cuc probably noticed some decay or whatever from the clam, CBB in the picture have been in the tank 1.5 years with the clam and never touched it.

 

[dedragon]

It would be hard to say without an icp test that showed elevated levels directly related to sunscreen (i think zinc and stuff). Could be a combination as the carbon might have been absorbing some excess metals in the water.
Dw, stuff like this happens, lost a clam i had for 3 years as well, mine died about 1 year ago and havent tried a new one yet.

 

[MartinM]

Any idea what the par is/was? There doesn’t appear to be a lot of growth, it may have been slowly starving these last 3 years

 

[LIreefguy]

Any idea what the par is/was? There doesn’t appear to be a lot of growth, it may have been slowly starving these last 3 yeara

don’t think so

3 years is a long time to starve to death

why a coral die or a fish after several years in the tank is really hard for anyone to say

living things die , it could be infection , could be something in the water , could be the sun screen , could be a pest , could be the cooper band. (Just because he was a good boy for a year doesn’t mean he will be forever )

get a icl test to rule out water

and in future try not to change 3 things in a short period of time.
Sorry you lost your clam

 

[m0jjen]

Any idea what the par is/was? There doesn’t appear to be a lot of growth, it may have been slowly starving these last 3 years

A little above 200ish. T5/led. Using the wwc radion schedule pretty much. 4 t5 2 coral+ 2 blue+ thats on for 7h/day during peak

12 hour photo period with 6 hour peak and 1 hour rampa on bothsides

 

[m0jjen]

My lps has been quite cranky lately aswell so i guess somethings up. Last icp test was flawless apart from slightly elevated po4 at 0.11

Attached the ICP. Clam and LPS has declined since then. Reason for the test was my golden torch (2ish years?) closing up and also winded up dead.

 

[m0jjen]

don’t think so

3 years is a long time to starve to death

why a coral die or a fish after several years in the tank is really hard for anyone to say

living things die , it could be infection , could be something in the water , could be the sun screen , could be a pest , could be the cooper band. (Just because he was a good boy for a year doesn’t mean he will be forever )

get a icl test to rule out water

and in future try not to change 3 things in a short period of time.
Sorry you lost your clam

Changes was made 1 month apart since january. Should have specified that in the OP. ICP from feb when things went south above.

 

[Scorpius]

That sucks man. I always gets bummed out when I lose something especially when you've had it so many years. I see no new growth on that clam so it wasn't doing well for quite some time.

 

[m0jjen]

That sucks man. I always gets bummed out when I lose something especially when you've had it so many years. I see no new growth on that clam so it wasn't doing well for quite some time.

Figured as much aswell. Cant find a reason for it tho :|

 

[Paul B]

I can't keep them any more because some of my bristleworms are huge and they crawl into the back of the shell and eat them. I also can't keep any crustaceans though a molt or they get eaten.

I sleep far off the floor or they would eat me.

 

[MartinM]

If it’s a maxima (looks like) or crocea, 2xx par is definitely too low - that explains the lack of growth & demise,

Marine inverts can definitely spend months or years starving. If the clam was receiving, say, 99.x% of the energy requirements to stay alive (not grow, but survive) it could take years to die. This is why ”if it’s not growing, it’s dying” is repeated so often in this hobby.

Healthy maximas should put on a layer of scutes every 1-3 months until reaching ~20-25cm and then they start to slow down. I have some ~20cm ones still putting on another row every ~2-3 months.

Minimum PAR I’ve seen maximas have healthy growth under is 350+. I keep mine at significantly higher. I notice big slowdowns even at 350 as compared to 450.

 

[m0jjen]

If it’s a maxima (looks like) or crocea, 2xx par is definitely too low - that explains the lack of growth & demise,

Marine inverts can definitely spend months or years starving. If the clam was receiving, say, 99.x% of the energy requirements to stay alive (not grow, but survive) it could take years to die. This is why ”if it’s not growing, it’s dying” is repeated so often in this hobby.

Healthy maximas should put on a layer of scutes every 1-3 months until reaching ~20-25cm and then they start to slow down. I have some ~20cm ones still putting on another row every ~2-3 months.

Minimum PAR I’ve seen maximas have healthy growth under is 350+. I keep mine at significantly higher. I notice big slowdowns even at 350 as compared to 450.

That might very well be the culpit then since i aim for 300-350 par for my SPS and that gives me about 200 at the bottom.

 

[MartinM]

It’s so common to see tanks set up that way, with SPS at the top and clams at the bottom, when it should be reversed. There are very few coral species exposed to the light intensity that Croceas and maximas are exposed to in their natural habitat. It probably also explains 1) all the ’mysterious’ clam deaths (usually around the ~1 year mark) and 2) clams not being that popular anymore. They really do need a LOT of light. I’m sorry about the clam, it really sucks to lose livestock, I know. And when it’s so common to do SPS up top and clams at the bottom, it’s easy to think that’ll work, but in the long run, often not.

 

[m0jjen]

It’s so common to see tanks set up that way, with SPS at the top and clams at the bottom, when it should be reversed. There are very few coral species exposed to the light intensity that Croceas and maximas are exposed to in their natural habitat. It probably also explains 1) all the ’mysterious’ clam deaths (usually around the ~1 year mark) and 2) clams not being that popular anymore. They really do need a LOT of light. I’m sorry about the clam, it really sucks to lose livestock, I know. And when it’s so common to do SPS up top and clams at the bottom, it’s easy to think that’ll work, but in the long run, often not.

First clam and it seemed happy for the longest time. If its not brokem dont fix it? :/ did some quick research after your post and seems like 250 is sufficient as minimum with ample feeding (which i dont) and optimal would ve 400+

 

[MartinM]

See James Fatheree’s latest book. Feeding won‘t compensate for low lighting. And ‘bare minimum’ lighting is like saying bare minimum food to survive on for a human. You’ll always be at the edge of starvation and then any tiny reduction would kill you.

I’ve had maximas (they’re my fav) for nearly 20 years, and currently have 9. At less than 300 PAR, they stop growing (which means they’re starting to die) and at less than 400-450, they grow slowly, which puts them too close to the danger zone for me. Sure, there might be some outliers that can survive (but probably not thrive) at 2xx, and then that one outlier will get broadcasted all over the forum for the next 10 years, but that doesn’t make it the norm.

It really is easy with clams - if they’re not growing, they’re not getting enough light. ‘Looking good’ =/= healthy with invertebrates (think: panning for light, etc). As I said, a layer of scutes every 1-3 months is what they should be putting on. Dr. Mac has a new ’ask me anything’ thread, you can go get a second opinion there if you want.