Cleaning an MP40 wetside. How do you do it?

drawman · Feb 11, 2019

redfishbluefish said:
Vinegar penetration of plastic doesn't happen quickly. For me, it was a couple years of cleaning the wetsides by soaking in straight vinegar over night.

If you wish to acid soak your wet sides (or any plastic coated metal equipment, such as pump bodies or impellers), I'd highly recommend other acids that are less likely to penetrate plastic. Two acids I'd recommend that are inexpensive and readily available are citric acid (3/4 - 1 cup made up to one gallon), or diluted muriatic acid (diluted 1 to 10). Muriatic acid is available at HD and a five pound bag of Citric acid (a life time supply) is available from Amazon or eBay for 12 - 15 bucks.

Can't say I've heard this before. So citric acid should not penetrate the plastic?

stacksoner · Feb 11, 2019

Soak in 30% muriatic acid + 70% water for 30 minutes. Neutralize w baking soda, clean with toothbrush.

ihavecrabs · Feb 11, 2019

redfishbluefish said:
Yes, there is a cause.....vinegar penetrates plastic. I'm simply going to paste what I've typed in another post:

Acids undergo dissociation in aqueous solution, which is commonly shown as:

HA(aq)+H2O(l)⇌H3O+(aq)+A−(aq)

where HA is the acid. In the case of acetic acid (vinegar), it very poorly dissociates into acetate and hydrogen, and predominately remains as the "uncharged" acetic acid (HA). (As a comparative, Hydrochloric acid readily dissociated). As a small uncharged compound, it can now penetrate the plastic, and eventual get to the magnet and cause it to rust and swell. It's happened to me, three times over, with the wetsides of MP40's. I can't take credit for "discovering" this....it was Randy Holmes Farley that originally enlightened me to the acetic acid thing. Here's what he said:

I think the effect on plastic may be worse with vinegar than muriatic acid but it may depend on the plastic.

Vinegar can be in the form of acetic acid and that neutral molecule can enter plastic. Diluted muriatic acid won't have any neutral acidic molecules in it to enter plastic, so just exposes the outermost leading edge of plastic. So while the muriatic acid after dilution is a much stronger acid, i would not assume it is worse on plastics.

FWIW, I've used diluted muriatic acid for decades as have others, and I've not heard of cords being damaged, but I've also not inspected them closely.

Ever since I saw this, and my experience with regularly cleaning with vinegar, and the loss of three wetsides, I've stopped using vinegar on any and all magnets.

redfishbluefish said:
Vinegar penetration of plastic doesn't happen quickly. For me, it was a couple years of cleaning the wetsides by soaking in straight vinegar over night.

If you wish to acid soak your wet sides (or any plastic coated metal equipment, such as pump bodies or impellers), I'd highly recommend other acids that are less likely to penetrate plastic. Two acids I'd recommend that are inexpensive and readily available are citric acid (3/4 - 1 cup made up to one gallon), or diluted muriatic acid (diluted 1 to 10). Muriatic acid is available at HD and a five pound bag of Citric acid (a life time supply) is available from Amazon or eBay for 12 - 15 bucks.

Thanks for the detailed and confirming my hypothesis!

ihavecrabs · Feb 11, 2019

MartinWaite said:
I've never used anything other than water and a toothbrush to clean my MP10 and the new wetside that I fitted less than a year ago has rusted I think that ecotech are possibly using cheapest material so they can make even more from the gullible, but I for one will be throwing my MP10 into the bin as they are not getting anymore of my money ever.

That is what mine looked like on the end. Unfortunate since other than that, I love the quality. However I will repurchase cheap power heads that die often if it stops metals from leaching into my tank.

davocean · Feb 11, 2019

redfishbluefish said:
Vinegar penetration of plastic doesn't happen quickly. For me, it was a couple years of cleaning the wetsides by soaking in straight vinegar over night.

If you wish to acid soak your wet sides (or any plastic coated metal equipment, such as pump bodies or impellers), I'd highly recommend other acids that are less likely to penetrate plastic. Two acids I'd recommend that are inexpensive and readily available are citric acid (3/4 - 1 cup made up to one gallon), or diluted muriatic acid (diluted 1 to 10). Muriatic acid is available at HD and a five pound bag of Citric acid (a life time supply) is available from Amazon or eBay for 12 - 15 bucks.

Thanks for the tip, I may switch to citric acid just to be safe myself.

saltyhog · Feb 11, 2019

@ihavecrabs

I have had that happen but only with my MP10's. I was told that also can be related to vinegar soaking. I only soak my cages in vinegar now since they are what gets coated in coralline algae (yes in just a month).

bigjgmac · Mar 5, 2021

Daltrey said:
I just throw it in the dishwasher and run it on sanitize.

Really? That removes built up coralline algae? If that’s true, I'm all over that.

TL1 · Mar 5, 2021

redfishbluefish said:
Yes, there is a cause.....vinegar penetrates plastic. I'm simply going to paste what I've typed in another post:

Acids undergo dissociation in aqueous solution, which is commonly shown as:

HA(aq)+H2O(l)⇌H3O+(aq)+A−(aq)

where HA is the acid. In the case of acetic acid (vinegar), it very poorly dissociates into acetate and hydrogen, and predominately remains as the "uncharged" acetic acid (HA). (As a comparative, Hydrochloric acid readily dissociated). As a small uncharged compound, it can now penetrate the plastic, and eventual get to the magnet and cause it to rust and swell. It's happened to me, three times over, with the wetsides of MP40's. I can't take credit for "discovering" this....it was Randy Holmes Farley that originally enlightened me to the acetic acid thing. Here's what he said:

I think the effect on plastic may be worse with vinegar than muriatic acid but it may depend on the plastic.

Vinegar can be in the form of acetic acid and that neutral molecule can enter plastic. Diluted muriatic acid won't have any neutral acidic molecules in it to enter plastic, so just exposes the outermost leading edge of plastic. So while the muriatic acid after dilution is a much stronger acid, i would not assume it is worse on plastics.

FWIW, I've used diluted muriatic acid for decades as have others, and I've not heard of cords being damaged, but I've also not inspected them closely.

Ever since I saw this, and my experience with regularly cleaning with vinegar, and the loss of three wetsides, I've stopped using vinegar on any and all magnets.

Not sure where I read it, but in a similar post citric acid was recommended as being gentler... my wife had some for making bath bombs and I've been using it ever since. Works like a charm, no issues... to date.

redfishbluefish · Mar 5, 2021

TL1 said:
Not sure where I read it, but in a similar post citric acid was recommended as being gentler... my wife had some for making bath bombs and I've been using it ever since. Works like a charm, no issues... to date.

You might have read about it here

:

Beware of Vinegar - The Pump Killer

I have posted bits and piece of my vinegar story over the past three years, and I thought it would be beneficial if one post contained all that I've learn. You'll be surprised! This story will contain three parts; my history with vinegar, the cause and simplified chemistry what's happening...

www.reef2reef.com

TL1 · Mar 6, 2021

redfishbluefish said:
You might have read about it here :

Beware of Vinegar - The Pump Killer

I have posted bits and piece of my vinegar story over the past three years, and I thought it would be beneficial if one post contained all that I've learn. You'll be surprised! This story will contain three parts; my history with vinegar, the cause and simplified chemistry what's happening...

www.reef2reef.com

That's the one! The stuff is cheap and comes in powder form. Doesn't smell like Easter eggs either.