Clownfish behvior change and white poop

[LMDAVE]

I've been having my ocellaris clown pair for a week. My first pair in my DT after cycle.

They have been very active, and eating a lot now after a 2 first days of not eating much. I'm feeding them Rod's Fish only food.

I notice the white poop yesterday. Very small less than 1/4" but hanging in place, and once again today. The behavior change is some spastic movements and darting forward about 5 inches real fast. Today it's changed a little more, she has been sitting in the powerjet flow for about 3 hours, stays in that same area. The other smaller clownfish is normal behavior, and no signs of anything.

I just set up my QT tank today. The only medicine I have on hand is Cupramine.

Is this something I should take immediate action on or observe for a few more days?

Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10
pH 7.9
Temp 78
Sal 1.025

 

[Cnidoblast]

Paging @Humblefish to the E.R

 

[Big G]

Swimming into a powerhead's flow is a symptom unique to velvet. Here's the link to treatment for marine velvet from our own Humblefish. It's important to note the survival rates are much higher if after a freshwater dip, you give the fish a bath in acriflavine. Then copper for 30 days. All the fish will need to be treated and the display tank will need to be "fallow" (fishless) for 76 days to starve out the parasite.
The white poop if stringy is symptomatic of internal parasites that you can treat after the velvet if time allows.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/velvet-amyloodinium-ocellatum.217570/#post-2499399

Emergency Treatment for Marine Velvet Disease

I recently acquired 3 fish - Longnose Butterfly, Kole Tang, Naso Tang - with velvet. None showed visible physical symptoms right away, but they all came from a tank where velvet was known to be present so I just patiently waited. Before & after pictures will follow immediately after this write-up.

In short, the Butterflyfish didn’t make it; however the two tangs did. The only difference in their treatment was I used formalin (with Methylene Blue) on the butterfly in a bath solution, whereas the tangs got acriflavine (with NO Methylene Blue). It’s also worth noting that the butterfly & Kole Tang showed symptoms the worst, whereas the Naso only had moderate visible symptoms. Tangs are also generally considered hardier than butterflyfish, so there’s that factor to consider as well. Anyway, here is the treatment I used on them:

The short version:

• 5 minute freshwater dip
• Immediately afterwards, perform a chemical bath (in saltwater matching SG/temp the fish came from). You have two options:

1. Acriflavine (preferred) - Do the bath for 75-90 minutes, but remove the fish immediately at the first sign of distress. Aerate heavily both before & during the bath, and temperature control the water. The following products contain acriflavine: Acriflavine-MS and Ruby Reef Rally. DO NOT mix acriflavine with any other chemicals.
2. Formalin - Do the bath for 30-60 minutes max, but remove the fish immediately at the first sign of distress. Aerate heavily both before & during the bath, and temperature control the water. The following products contain formalin: Formalin-MS, Quick Cure, Aquarium Solutions Ich-X, Kordon Rid-Ich Plus. Use protection (rubber gloves, face mask, eye protection, etc.) whenever handling formalin as it is a known carcinogen! However, you can add Methylene Blue to the formalin bath (1 capful per 2-3 gallons of bath water.)

• After the bath, place the fish in a QT pre-dosed at 80mg/gal using Chloroquine phosphate. In theory, copper (exs. Cupramine, Coppersafe, Copper Power) should work just as well as CP. However, due to how fast velvet can reproduce you don’t have the luxury of slowly ramping up the copper level as is normally advised. Therefore, the fish needs to be placed in a QT with copper already at minimum therapeutic levels. This is the advantage CP has over copper in this particular situation.
• While in QT, use a wide spectrum antibiotic (exs. Seachem Kanaplex, Furan-2) for the first week to ward off any possible bacterial infections. Secondary bacterial infections are very common in fish with preexisting parasitic infestations such as velvet.
• Keep the fish in CP or copper (at therapeutic levels) for one month. However, you can transfer the fish into a non-medicated holding tank for observation after just two weeks (explained below). DO NOT lower the CP or copper level before transferring.

 

[Big G]

Here's a thread discussing dosing of Cupramine. Do you have the correct test kit to check for therapeutic levels?
Suggest special attention to post #4
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/dosing-cupramine.296117/

 

[HotRocks]

+1 @Big G definitely some sort of parasitic infestation in the gills. Swimming in powerhead definitely stressed or deprived of oxygen. Sounds like the fish may also need metroplex and focus mixed in with food if an internal parasite is present (white stringy poop).

 

[LMDAVE]

I do have cupramine and the sea hum test kit. I never used it before. Velvet sounds serious. Is there more can can look fornto be certain?

I was think it was an inestial thing that metroplex or prazonole will be needed, but i read not to use them with copper.

 

[Deinonych]

Can you post a video of the behavior? Clownfish can be weird sometimes. A video can be extremely helpful with diagnosis.

 

[HotRocks]

I do have cupramine and the sea hum test kit. I never used it before. Velvet sounds serious. Is there more can can look fornto be certain?

I was think it was an inestial thing that metroplex or prazonole will be needed, but i read not to use them with copper.

If you dose metro into water column, it's almost guaranteed bacterial bloom. @4FordFamily has had success in mixing with food and feeding during copper treatment. If it is indeed velvet you have very little time 24-48 hours to get them into therapudic copper. I would push it hard, clowns do very well in copper.

 

[Big G]

I do have cupramine and the sea hum test kit. I never used it before. Velvet sounds serious. Is there more can can look fornto be certain?

I was think it was an inestial thing that metroplex or prazonole will be needed, but i read not to use them with copper.

Velvet is rampant in the industry these days. It kills rather cruelly and quickly. The link posted above will bring you up to speed.

 

[LMDAVE]

Video of behavior, its the lighter orange one.

 

[Humblefish]

It is odd how they are just hanging in front of the flow like that. I'm assuming they weren't QTd??

 

[Deinonych]

Any other changes in behavior? Any flashing, excessive yawning, piping (gasping at surface) or hiding? I assume from your initial post that they are still eating well, correct? The swimming in flow is a bit odd, but not necessarily indicative of disease.

 

[LMDAVE]

Well, the other smaller one swims all around, he only got in the view because he saw me giving the one attention. No, they weren't QT'd. The were in copper at LFS, a well trust store in my area. I just got my QT tank set up today.

I just dosed the copper in the QT, should I let it settle overnight and move both of them in there in the morning? Is this something that looks like velvet for certain or should I monitor more?

 

[Humblefish]

I just dosed the copper in the QT, should I let it settle overnight and move both of them in there in the morning? Is this something that looks like velvet for certain or should I monitor more?

I would probably wait to see if further symptoms develop. Read these two threads:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/velvet-amyloodinium-ocellatum.217570/

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/brooklynella.247938/

 

[LMDAVE]

Any other changes in behavior? Any flashing, excessive yawning, piping (gasping at surface) or hiding? I assume from your initial post that they are still eating well, correct? The swimming in flow is a bit odd, but not necessarily indicative of disease.

Yes they are eating better than ever the last couple of days. Just the one with the problem was jittery yesterday and seeing this today with the flow. No hiding, sometimes they hang out up top but nothing abnormal. Just where she's doing now.

 

[LMDAVE]

I would probably wait to see if further symptoms develop. Read these two threads:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/velvet-amyloodinium-ocellatum.217570/

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/brooklynella.247938/

Thanks, I'll read them in detail and monitor more tomorrow. Big G already had me reading some of it.

 

[Deinonych]

I would probably wait to see if further symptoms develop. Read these two threads:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/velvet-amyloodinium-ocellatum.217570/

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/brooklynella.247938/

+1

It's your call, but my personal approach is "treat the known." Sometimes the best approach is to do nothing until you know what you are dealing with.

 

[Crashjack]

+1

It's your call, but my personal approach is "treat the known." Sometimes the best approach is to do nothing until you know what you are dealing with.

+1

I’m not one of the experts but have dealt with ocellaris clowns and intestinal parasite infections. O. clowns act weird anyway. My two swam into the current in my QT for two days. I re-directed the current, and they quit cold-turkey. They will go through stages of feeding and then not feeding with intestinal parasites. They will also become lethargic and then sometimes snap out of it. Metroplex or General Cure mixed with food will eliminate the intestinal parasites. When I had to treat my O. clowns for intestinal parasites, I knew the treatment was working when the clown that had been most effected began kicking the crap out of the other clown. I would treat for intestinal parasites and unless you are treating for external parasites prophylacticly in a QT, wouldn’t worry about treating for anything else.

 

[LMDAVE]

I didn't see any new signs this morning, no visual signs on the clown's scales/body. This is a video of their feeding this morning. (She's the one on the left/middle during feeding). I don't want to panic that I have a full out emergency already so even though I have my QT with copper going, I'm not ready to transfer them just yet. I would like to hope it's maybe a intestinal parasite that can be treated with medicated food...if even that. I'm going to LFS after work today. But let me know what you think from the feeding this morning.

 

[Deinonych]

I don't see anything particularly worrisome in that video. I'd continue to observe for the time being. As you stated, you have a QT at the ready should you need to act quickly.