Copper treatment failed, or didn't???

[Wowkuh]

So I did copper treatment with copper power for about 14 days, used a Hannah copper checker.

I have 1 achilies tang, 1 purple tang, and 2 blue hippos. Before copper treatment blue hippos looked bad with what seemed to be ich, and the achilies had just a few small dots under 10 And the purple never showed signs.

After 14 days of copper all fish looked GREAT. Transfered them to a sterile tank. this how I transferred them, caught them with a net, plopped them into a bucket with temp, salinity and copper matching the QT. Then picked them out of the bucket with my hands and plopped them into copper free temp/salinity matching holding tank where they stayed for about 48hrs. For that 48hrs, I took the other QT (where they were treated with copper) took all the equipment and filled the tank up with tap water and bleach and turn all the equipment on, let it run for a few hours. From there, i drained the tank, rinsed tank and equipment very well. Took all equipment apart so it could dry well. I let it dry out for about 48hrs. Set it back up. Added dry rock (dried for MONTHS) net the fish (with a brand new net) plopped them back in. I added the rock for surface area for BB to grow as my DT (which is more than 10' away) goes fallow

All was well for a couple weeks. And BAM my blue hippos have "ich" again.....maybe it isnt ich?? BUT my achilies and purple have NO signs.

But here's the thing that got me thinking....maybe I wasn't unsuccessful. BEFORE copper treatment blue hippo and achilies have "ich". AFTER copper treatment just the blue hippos have ich and my achilies and purple show no signs.

This "ich" starts off looking like a very bad case of ich, maybe even velvet. Then almost half fall off and what's left is pointy ich. And again its just on blue hippos.

Needless to say, once I spotted this "ich" I started copper again. Its been about a week in theroputic copper. And that's where I stand till this day. Maybe it's not ich?

 

[HotRocks]

Have you treated these fish with a de-wormer?

If it was ich it would be highly likely you'd see it on the Achilles.

Hippos are oddballs and hard to guage for parasites. They love to hide. Wedge themselves between rocks etc. Causing irritation to slime coat.

 

[Brew12]

It is only on his head area?

The black and blue sides of a hippo tang normally show parasites very easily.

 

[Wowkuh]

Have you treated these fish with a de-wormer?

If it was ich it would be highly likely you'd see it on the Achilles.

Hippos are oddballs and hard to guage for parasites. They love to hide. Wedge themselves between rocks etc. Causing irritation to slime coat.

They have been eating GC soaked foods with focus on and off. But it was inconsistent as there was a lot going on at the moment and I just ruled out the fact they had worms or any internal issues because tthey they NEVER showed signs. And yes. They got a FW dip a couple times to confirm they were fluke free. However. Ive actually started feeding GC soaked foods again and its been consistent for about a week, not sure I have to check my notes. I log everything I do lol.

 

[Wowkuh]

It is only on his head area?

The black and blue sides of a hippo tang normally show parasites very easily.

No its actually everywhere. But its hard to get a picture of these guys and at certain angles and these are the best pics I got.

 

[4FordFamily]

Hippo tangs also somewhat frequently display copper poisoning symptoms which present as small goose bumps on the skin instead of white spots of mucous. Hard to tell for sure but I second that the Achilles would be showing spots as they’re the best “ichometer” you could ever find.

Copper poisoning generally subsides a month or so post-treatment.

 

[Brew12]

Hippo tangs also frequently get copper poisoning symptoms which present as small goose bumps on the skin instead of white spots of mucous.

This is what I am thinking, too.

Unless your hanna checker is bad or you have a copper resistant form of ich (not confirmed they even exist) I don't believe this is ich. I'm leaning to stress or copper related.

 

[Wowkuh]

Hippo tangs also frequently get copper poisoning symptoms which present as small goose bumps on the skin instead of white spots of mucous. Hard to tell for sure but I second that the Achilles would be showing spots as they’re the best “ichometer” you could ever find.

Thats why got me thinking its not ich you know? The fact that I was so carful with everything, the transfers, sterilizing etc. they've been back in the tank for about 3-4 weeks and within that time. The achilies and purple hav been spotless.

 

[Wowkuh]

The spots you see are actually bubbles. I can confirm that

 

[Wowkuh]

This is what I am thinking, too.

Unless your hanna checker is bad or you have a copper resistant form of ich (not confirmed they even exist) I don't believe this is ich. I'm leaning to stress or copper related.

Here's the thing tho. they've been in copper free tank for a few weeks until this appeared again. Still poisoning? This I also what i really noticed. When the rock was in there. There REALLY utilized the rock and and wedges them self's at night time or when spooked. Achilies and purple never really did that.

Edit. just read that copper poison can last 1monh post treatment.

 

[Wowkuh]

So what shall I do. I'm sure you guys will say continue copper till 14 days and do the whole transfer again just for good measure.

But wont that be bad for the fish due to long exposure time. Plus them getting treated a couple times. Literally treated, transferred, tank to tank, a few weeks go buy and treated again go through more tank transfer etc. All that treatment and inconsistentsy can't be good for a fish. Plus me too because is very time consuming lol

@HotRocks
@4FordFamily
@Brew12

 

[Brew12]

So what shall I do. I'm sure you guys will say continue copper till 14 days and do the whole transfer again just for good measure.

But wont that be bad for the fish due to long exposure time. Plus them getting treated a couple times. Literally treated, transferred, tank to tank, a few weeks go buy and treated again go through more tank transfer etc. All that treatment and inconsistentsy can't be good for a fish. Plus me too because is very time consuming lol

@HotRocks
@4FordFamily
@Brew12

It's a tough situation. If they were my fish I would pull the copper ASAP and treat with antibiotics. I would treat with General Cure, Kanaplex and Furan 2 for a week and see how things look.

Again, this is what I would do. I could easily justify completing another 14 day treatment followed by another transfer. It just isn't what I would do.