Copper treatment

[Maritimer]

Ich can encyst for up to ... what is it, 72 days? Copper is only effective on free-swimming ich parasites, so if there are cysts on your glass/in your filter/in your PVC hidey-holes after 14 days, and you remove the copper but return the fish . . .

Even the two-week end-of-copper transfer to another QT, it seems to me, is something of a hybrid tank-transfer-method. You've waited until the ich parasites have all dropped off of the fish, and you're moving the fish to a parasite-free environment, rather than back into the tank they just came from.

~Bruce

 

[Humblefish]

Even the two-week end-of-copper transfer to another QT, it seems to me, is something of a hybrid tank-transfer-method. You've waited until the ich parasites have all dropped off of the fish, and you're moving the fish to a parasite-free environment, rather than back into the tank they just came from.

Just want to point out this method works only if:

1. QT #2 is at least 10 feet away from QT #1 (original treatment tank). Also, nothing can be reused between the two QTs. You want to transfer the fish only.
2. Copper level MUST be monitored daily to ensure the fish has been in therapeutic copper for the full 14 days. If the Cu level dips even slightly below therapeutic, the 14 day clock must restart.

In short, this method allows NO margin for error.

 

[Maritimer]

Excellent points, as ... well, yeah . . . pretty much always!

~Bruce

 

[govolsguy31]

Just want to point out this method works only if:

1. QT #2 is at least 10 feet away from QT #1 (original treatment tank). Also, nothing can be reused between the two QTs. You want to transfer the fish only.
2. Copper level MUST be monitored daily to ensure the fish has been in therapeutic copper for the full 14 days. If the Cu level dips even slightly below therapeutic, the 14 day clock must restart.

In short, this method allows NO margin for error.

If a fish is already not eating before being quarantined, is Hypo-salinity a better choice than Copper treatment for Ich?

 

[melypr1985]

If a fish is already not eating before being quarantined, is Hypo-salinity a better choice than Copper treatment for Ich?

That depends on if you do or do not have the option of getting them to eat before treatment. Generally ick isn't an emergency and you can take the time to get a fish to eat before treating. Since hypo doens't treat all strains of ick, I never consider it better than copper or TTM. If you want/need to avoid copper then I would suggest TTM over Hypo.

 

[govolsguy31]

That depends on if you do or do not have the option of getting them to eat before treatment. Generally ick isn't an emergency and you can take the time to get a fish to eat before treating. Since hypo doens't treat all strains of ick, I never consider it better than copper or TTM. If you want/need to avoid copper then I would suggest TTM over Hypo.

Thanks Meredith. I don't want to hijack this thread. I've got something going on. I'll post a new thread and tag you guys.

 

[GoVols]

Thanks Meredith. I don't want to hijack this thread. I've got something going on. I'll post a new thread and tag you guys.

Go Big Orange

 

[Humblefish]

Copper sticky has been adjusted to reflect some new information: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/copper-treatment.193343/

 

[AllSignsPointToFish]

So, I'm trying copper first in this quarantine. The QT tank was cycled (ghost feeding) and the chelated copper levels are in the range of 1.4 mg/L. So far, both clowns and the Scopas tang have been eating very well despite the copper. I will add a little more copper today or tomorrow to bring the level into the therapeutic range.

 

[jeff williams]

I absolutely recommend 30 days in therapeutic levels of copper before you remove it. If you are able to transfer the fish into another QT (sterile), then you can do that at the 14 day mark, but you need to be able to observe the fish for 2 more weeks before putting them into the display. Transferring them to the new, sterile QT will get them out of the copper right away and is a fine method as long as you can observe them for the next two weeks. Otherwise you can just do water changes and run cupusorb or polyfilters to pull out the copper. This is a fine method as well.

So just adding a poly filter with no carbon or cuprisorb will absorb copper? My HOB filter with a filter cartridge no carbon in it is going to affect my copper levels?

 

[melypr1985]

So just adding a poly filter with no carbon or cuprisorb will absorb copper? My HOB filter with a filter cartridge no carbon in it is going to affect my copper levels?

This is what I was referring to http://www.marinedepot.com/Poly_Fil...Media-Poly_Bio_Marine-PB1111-FIFMMEPM-vi.html

 

[LeonThePeon]

Can a fish that already had an episode of velvet/ich and gone through the copper treatment - get velvet/ich again? Just curious as to whether the fish would develop an immunity (like chicken pox) or is it more like the flu and can get it over and over? (Noticed 2 white spots on the pectoral fin of my Yellow Tang and wanted to see if I need to get it out (again...)

 

[Maritimer]

Yes - especially if the fish has gone back into a display tank that already has ich or velvet present in it. The best way to eradicate those parasites from a display is to remove all fish until the parasites in the tank all die of starvation. In the case of velvet, that'll be about six weeks, up to 76 days for ich.

Fish can develop a temporary resistance to both pathogens, but it's not complete, and from what I understand, only seems to last about six months.

~Bruce

 

[Humblefish]

^^ Agree with Bruce. Copper (at therapeutic levels) only eradicates the parasite at that time; it isn't like getting a flu shot which provides immunity.

If the fish is exposed to ich again, he gets ich.

 

[melypr1985]

^^ Agree with Bruce. Copper (at therapeutic levels) only eradicates the parasite at that time; it isn't like getting a flu shot which provides immunity.

If the fish is exposed to ich again, he gets ich.

Agreed.

 

[Balz3352]

So how long is suggested to watch them after the 30 days of treatment. Also could you just keep them in the copper for the extra period of time as long as they are eating and such?

 

[Maritimer]

Copper is toxic. Fish tolerate it better than invertebrates (including parasites), but it's not very good for the fish, either. I think that's the primary reason to pull copper after 30 days. Another 2-4 weeks of observation wouldn't hurt - and if you could do that in a separate tank (remove the fish from the copper-containing environment directly to a new, clean QT) that might be better, as it would circumvent the possibility of a few long-duration encysted ich parasites hanging around your copper tank's walls or such.

~Bruce

 

[Humblefish]

Copper is toxic. Fish tolerate it better than invertebrates (including parasites), but it's not very good for the fish, either. I think that's the primary reason to pull copper after 30 days. Another 2-4 weeks of observation wouldn't hurt - and if you could do that in a separate tank (remove the fish from the copper-containing environment directly to a new, clean QT) that might be better, as it would circumvent the possibility of a few long-duration encysted ich parasites hanging around your copper tank's walls or such.

+1

 

[jeff williams]

Humblefish you mention not eating as a sign for cu sensitive, are there other signs as well. I was wondering if cu sensetivity could also resemble ick symptoms, such as scratching flashing and heavy gilling ?

 

[melypr1985]

Humblefish you mention not eating as a sign for cu sensitive, are there other signs as well. I was wondering if cu sensetivity could also resemble ick symptoms, such as scratching flashing and heavy gilling ?

not the flashing or scratching... but heavy breathing is sometimes a symptom, lethargy or laying on their side. If you suspect copper sensitivity you can try moving the fish displaying symptoms of it to a non-medicated tank and see if their condition improves.