Coral is Dying. Thoughts?

[dbg]

I recently moved the rock that was in my sump into my display. It was a bit nasty looking, having a thin layer of silt on it, but I needed the space to put my algae scrubber into the sump. The day after I put the scrubber in, the coral in the display was looking a bit wilted: the starbursts wouldn't come out, the mushrooms were all shriveled, the pulsing xenia had all of its "arms" clamped down, and the kenya tree coral was wrinkled up. However, the zoanthids never once looked unhealthy...could they have released some chemicals into the water to kill the other coral? I have the zoanthids atop a rock all by themselves, at least 15 inches away from all the other coral, but I don't know whether they would still feel the need to compete against the other corals.

I checked the pH, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate, and all were fine; pH was 8.3, and all the others were 0 ppm. So, I figured one of three things must have happened:

1) Something in the rock from the sump leached out into the display when I moved it up there (I have since taken the rock OUT!!!)
2) The sponge I had the algae scrubber pump sitting on (to keep it from vibrating) leached something into the tank (I have also taken this out!)
3) The PVC glue from the DIY algae scrubber leached into the tank (unlikely, as my whole system is made w/ pvc glue, and it was fine before hand)

???????????????????????????

This happened last week, and as of today I have done a 20 gallon water change and added two bags of activated carbon to the sump to try and clear up whatever is in the water. Also, I don't have a way of measuring dkh, but I have been adding buffer to my water change water to (hopefully?) make sure its in range. I use only RO/DI water for all top offs and water changes...

What do you think happened??!

Thanks,
Dylan =)

 

[peterthegamer]

I would say maybe something bothered them like palys. You might have had palys on the rock and they released toxic stuff. Not really sure, did you see anything strange?

 

[fishroomlady]

I'm guessing some of the stuff that was stirred up from moving the rock has angered your corals.....I think they'll be ok, just do what you've planned and then see how they react.

 

[dbg]

I would say maybe something bothered them like palys.

maybe a stupid question, but I don't know what palys are?? sorry lol!! I just don't see how I could have had bad organisms in the rocks... they were dry on my porch for about six months before I put them in my tank with live sand and cycled for well over three months with no fish... but, I guess they could have picked something up from the live sand...?

Here are some pics of them:
the starbursts have almost come back out, but not completely, and the mushrooms still look pretty bad.

If you look at this full tank shot, you can see how clean my rocks are, and they used to be covered in a light algae bloom... whatever was on the rocks I pulled out, it even killed off most of the algae on these rocks!!!

 

[tyler1503]

I would say no to something leaching from the PVC. If it was going to leach, it would have nearly instantly. It's possible for something to leach from the rocks, but I'd say if it was going to, it would have already as well.
My best guess would be when you removed the rock from the sump, that thin silty layer of detritus has caused a spike in something most likely nitrate. Check your parameters again and also check nitrate and phosphate if you can. Most LFSs will test your water for free so it's also a good idea to get them to do it and compare your results to there's.
The water changes and carbon are a great start.
I see a clown in the FTS, is he ok? Do you have any other fish or inverts?
Oh, and palys are a small single polyp coral very similar to a zoa

 

[Mike J.]

By your description and the algae dying off. I'd guess you introduced a toxin - maybe from the sponge? You are doing the right thing with carbon and water changes. More water changes might be in order. You should never dose anything unless you know what you are dosing it for. Hold off on dosing until you can test for it.

 

[dbg]

I see a clown in the FTS, is he ok? Do you have any other fish or inverts?

That's the weird thing- all the fish are fine (thankfully)! I've got some hermits, 1 tomato clown, 2 firefish, and 2 sixline wrasse. They all seem perfectly fine; they're eating normally and swimming strong.

Would palys be able to release toxins?

I'd guess you introduced a toxin - maybe from the sponge?

The corals look a little bit better today; mushrooms are still completely bunched up, but the xenia and starburst look a little better than they did, and my zoanthids actually look completely healthy and oblivious to anything going wrong.

Think it would help to put a carbon pack in the overflow box to add some extra filtration?

 

[tyler1503]

[aQUOTE=dbg;1877755]That's the weird thing- all the fish are fine (thankfully)! I've got some hermits, 1 tomato clown, 2 firefish, and 2 sixline wrasse. They all seem perfectly fine; they're eating normally and swimming strong.

Would palys be able to release toxins?

The corals look a little bit better today; mushrooms are still completely bunched up, but the xenia and starburst look a little better than they did, and my zoanthids actually look completely healthy and oblivious to anything going wrong.

Think it would help to put a carbon pack in the overflow box to add some extra filtration?[/QUOTE]

Some palys and zoas have one of the most (If not THE most. I can't quite remember) potent toxins in the natural world. A simple search on here or google on palytoxin will give you plenty of information about it nearly killing people. Although I don't think that's what's going on here.
Luckily your fish and inverts are ok. That makes me think it is nitrate or phosphate from the detritus shook loose from the rock you moved. Fish can handle a lot higher levels than most corals. At this point, some extra carbon won't hurt, but remember to change it often.
Water changes will be your best friend at the moment

 

[dbg]

Thanks so much for the advice, tyler1503! I'll hopefully get it better soon then... I'll letya know! =)

 

[Zeko]

It is the worlds second deadliest poison its called pollytoxin look it up to be on the safe side for yourself incase you got very unlucky and got some polys with the toxin but many lfs and online stores be sure its not present in the corals as many now a days are tank raised and is only carried in few outa most but then again you never no it wouldn't hurt to look it all up to be on the safe side but if you have any cuts on ur hands and have had your hands in the tank and are not feeling any of the symptoms then i highly doubt it is that I would just say you stired stuff around a bit and have irritated your corals i would do a 30 to 40% water change and just run carbon and wait a week or 2 to do another be sure to not do to many water changes cause you can eventually while out all the good bacteria in your tank or a good amount and start another cycle

 

[Zeko]

And also id like to ask how long your tank has been up and running cause those rocks are very clean and white looking almost new and if thats the case you really messed up

 

[tyler1503]

It is the worlds second deadliest poison its called pollytoxin look it up to be on the safe side for yourself incase you got very unlucky and got some polys with the toxin but many lfs and online stores be sure its not present in the corals as many now a days are tank raised and is only carried in few outa most but then again you never no it wouldn't hurt to look it all up to be on the safe side but if you have any cuts on ur hands and have had your hands in the tank and are not feeling any of the symptoms then i highly doubt it is that I would just say you stired stuff around a bit and have irritated your corals i would do a 30 to 40% water change and just run carbon and wait a week or 2 to do another be sure to not do to many water changes cause you can eventually while out all the good bacteria in your tank or a good amount and start another cycle

I don't mean to disregard what your saying, but doing more than 1 water change every week or 2 won't kill off any nitrifying bacteria. The only way that will happen is if your draining enough water to expose the rock and letting the rock completely dry out before adding clean water which can take quite a while, like an hour or more to have a small amount of die off.
No worries DBG
The more water changes you can do, the better. Maybe start with a few larger ones, say about 30-40% 3 or 4 days apart then slow down to maybe about 10-20% a week. The larger ones will help rid your tank of possible phosphate or nitrate and help balance your other parameters. The smaller ones you slow down to will help keep the numbers balanced. I used to do daily 5% water changes on my reef and it looked awesome. Great colour and steady growth.
Just my opinion

 

[Zeko]

I didnt say dont do a water change every week or 2 re read it i said do it i do my water change normaly every 2 weeks i was just saying one of them do about 40% then wait a week or two and do another one

 

[dylanisapain]

Perhaps it was the Zoanthids? It sounds like your tank was thriving before you introduced the Zoanthid. There are some articles out there that discuss how high flow rate can cause the Zoanthid to release more toxins. Maybe it needs to come out of the tank (even if it was a killer deal on coral!) Especially because the other coral hasn't gotten any better, even with the additional water changes/ addition of carbon to the tank.

When you get down there... let me know how it goes!

 

[dbg]

And also id like to ask how long your tank has been up and running cause those rocks are very clean and white looking almost new and if thats the case you really messed up

The rocks had algae on them before this all happened. Whatever is in the water wiped out all the algae as well. I had the tank up and running with live rock in the sump, live sand, and Marco Rock for about 5 months before I added ANY fish or coral to the tank.


The last couple days now I've been doing 5 gal water changes every day. I don't think it would start a mini cycle though, as almost all of the nitrobacter are located in the sand and rock