Coral Quarantine Tank - Still have issues.

TinpanVA · Oct 9, 2014

The Tank - 12 x 12 x 12 rimless with a HOB filter which contains a bag of carbon, the stock filter, and rubble. Standard heater which is maintaining a stable 77-78deg. Flow is provided by a MP10. Lights are Rapid LED's in a DIY housing. Tank is currently 6 months old.

The Problem - All SPS corals that have been placed in the QT so far have retracted all polyps and slowly starved to death [i assume]. Zoas that have been placed in the QT close up and never open, but in the 2 months that they have been in there haven't died, just stay closed up. Mushrooms, Yuma's to be exact, seem unaffected so far and look fine.

Corals were pulled from my display which is 2 and a half years old, very healthy and stable. Display lights are AI Vega, so it's a similar source. When I first set the QT up, I pulled water from the display to fill it. Even still, I ended up with a small ammonia spike and some algae. Both cleared up around week 6. The first month or two I was mixing up fresh saltwater for the waterchanges, I use Red Sea Coral Pro for the display so that's what I used for the QT also. Waterchanges are done weekly, and tested. Because of the RSCP my calc and alk got higher in the QT than I felt was needed because there were no corals to use up the ions. So for the last 2 months or so, I've just been pulling water from the display to do the water change in the QT and putting fresh SW back into the display only. This has stabilized the QT to maintain the same levels as is in the display.

Things I've already tried - Added the MP10 to increase flow. Originally the LED's were set to around 40-50% power, I have ramped those up to around 75-80% thinking it needed more light. I have no indication of too much light, no burnt tips or bleaching. As mentioned before, now using "dirty" water from the display for waterchanges. I've added more rubble, but not rock. Tested for stray voltage.

Parameters -
Salinity stays between 1.025 & 1.026
Temp stays 77 - 78
Nitrates a little high at 12 ppm, slowly getting these down, was 16ppm last week. But the same as the display tank.
NH3 - 0
pH 8.01 (same as display)
KH - 9.13 dkh
PO4 - 0
Ca - 400ppm
Mg - 1640ppm

SPS that have been tested are some Monti Cap, Nectar of the Gods, and some bird nest. All should be pretty hardy. Interesting note, the Zoa that I had in the QT which stayed closed for months but remained alive was moved back to the display where in a matter of 2 days opened back up.

To show the health of the main display

Also wanted to mention, since I felt the corals were starving, I put in a lawnmower blenny to provide "food" and keep any algae in check.

Reefkeepr1986 · Oct 9, 2014

It could be lack of nutrients in the QT!! that's good that you added a fish in the QT but try adding a small school of green chromis or some fish of your liking (3-5) and have that be a source of nutrients for your corals!! And for nitrates IMO is wayyy too high and does affect the corals!! Another thing you will need to test your Ph at night in the QT to see if there is a drop in PH due to not having "Enough" live rocks to help buffer your water!! Try adding a nice porous Rock to help ph stay consistent!! And from the evidence on the zoa closing in the QT could be because of high nitrates? I have had in my past other tanks some of my Zoa's close and melt away due to high nitrates!!
Is there a skimmer running in the QT? I would run a skimmer to help control excess nutrient buildup?? Hope that helps?

TinpanVA · Oct 9, 2014

Couple of very good points there! I know pH swings at night, but never occurred to me to check it to see what the difference was. As far as adding more fish, keep in mind this is only a 7 gal tank. Live rock is already in the works, just waiting for it to cure. I have a couple of spare nano skimmers here that I didn't like for the biocube, will look into adding one just to see what it cleans up.

I tend to get that tunnel vision when trying to figure out problems, fresh eyes help!

Thanks

fishroomlady · Oct 9, 2014

your display tank is stunning! I'm curious as to the comment made in that it was noted that QT could be too clean with lack of nutrients but yet your nitrates are high, that doesn't jive. I can't comment on the ph but it makes sense to check that. I also agree that adding some biological filtration to the QT may be helpful. could there possibly be too much flow in the QT? at least for the zoas? just a couple of thoughts

Reefkeepr1986 · Oct 9, 2014

Your welcome and hope all turns out cherry?? Keep us posted?

Squishie89 · Oct 9, 2014

Was this tank or filtration possibly used with chemicals harmful for corals/inverts like copper? It is definitely sounding like something is wrong with the QT given that when you put the zoas back in the display the perked up pretty quick.

TinpanVA · Oct 10, 2014

fishroomlady said:
your display tank is stunning! I'm curious as to the comment made in that it was noted that QT could be too clean with lack of nutrients but yet your nitrates are high, that doesn't jive. I can't comment on the ph but it makes sense to check that. I also agree that adding some biological filtration to the QT may be helpful. could there possibly be too much flow in the QT? at least for the zoas? just a couple of thoughts

Agreed, I would think between the nitrates and the fish there would be plenty of coral food. As far as flow goes, I added the mp10 well after the tank was set up. I actually added it thinking it was too little flow. It's set on the 3rd led, 10% matbe?

Squishie89 said:
Was this tank or filtration possibly used with chemicals harmful for corals/inverts like copper? It is definitely sounding like something is wrong with the QT given that when you put the zoas back in the display the perked up pretty quick.

Previous owner never treated with copper or anything else like that. The HOB was all bought new. I agree about the zoas, had some SPS do the same thing, closed for weeks in the QT and opened within a day or two when back in the display.

Can someone chime in on the "proper" way to check for stray voltage? I just can't think what else it could be that would make the corals open right back up once in the display.

TinpanVA · Oct 11, 2014

Today i pulled out the ole multimeter and checked voltage but not sure how to interpret it. Everything unpluged, negative lead in the negative side of a receptacle, positive end in the tank. Results = 7.5 vac. With only the mp10 voltage goes down slightly to 4.0 vac. MP10 + HOB filter = 6.9 vac. Add the heater and shoots up to 30 - 32 vac with heater on and up to 40ish with the heater off. 9.37 ohms from tank to ground and no continuity. And all this means?

TinpanVA · Oct 11, 2014

To further complicate things, I replaced with a larger heater I had as a spare, everything else plugged in as well. Heater off = 12.2 vac, heater off with my hand touching it = 10.2 vac, heater on =14.5 - 15vac

TinpanVA · Oct 11, 2014

The interesting thing to me and it may mean nothing at all, with the first heater plugged in the voltage in tank went up when heater was off, second heater voltage dropped when heater was off.

TinpanVA · Oct 17, 2014

Went ahead and replaced heater with the spare and let that run several days. Nothing really changing. The only other thing I can think of is changing lights, I have my HQI light off the biocube that's not being used. Just need to DIY a way of hanging it which should be bad.

Is there a remote possibly it would have something to do with the hob filter? It has a sponge, bag of carbon and a bag of rubble (came with filter). With me doing weekly waterchanges could I cut that off a week to see if anything improves?

Squishie89 · Oct 17, 2014

TinpanVA said:
Went ahead and replaced heater with the spare and let that run several days. Nothing really changing. The only other thing I can think of is changing lights, I have my HQI light off the biocube that's not being used. Just need to DIY a way of hanging it which should be bad.

Is there a remote possibly it would have something to do with the hob filter? It has a sponge, bag of carbon and a bag of rubble (came with filter). With me doing weekly waterchanges could I cut that off a week to see if anything improves?

Remote possibility? I would say yes. When was the last time the media was changed (any of it)?

TinpanVA · Oct 17, 2014

The sponge is 6 months old but washed out every week, carbon gets changed every other week. Rubble just gets rinsed each week.

TinpanVA · Oct 20, 2014

FWIW, I let the tank run without the HOB filter for 3 days, polyp retraction actually got worse. The only thing left was the LED light, pulled that out yesterday and did a quick DIY bracket to mount my old HQI fixture obove the QT. Found a Phoenix 14k bulb that I had only used a month or so and got it up and running late yesterday, by the time I had cut off the lights last night, I already had polyps extending. I'll look again tonight, but early assumption is the DIY LED's just aren't strong enough for the SPS. Keep ya posted.