Coralvue Hydros vs. Apex

[Jon's Reef]

Partially true but hydros is just beginning to release components. A sense box has been planned since the release.

If it’s not for sale on the shelf, it doesn’t exist.

But they are also backed by a good company that seems willing to do what needs to be done.

As a distributor, they have a history. As a product developer what have they made?

 

[[Cameron]]

Not really what I was trying to say.
To be blunt - dealing with customer service at Neptune reminds me of a used car dealership... they blame the customer for every failure regardless of the facts. I wouldn't use one of their products if you gave it to me for free.
The Coral View Hydros is still pretty new and it's hard to say where it will be in a couple of years.
GHL is top notch in my opinion, but comes at a price (both $$ and a degree of complexity that can take a while to learn).

I agree. GHL was born out of industrial applications and they are engineered to be relied upon in those environments. That industrial design permeates their interface for better and worse as well.

Apex is mostly consumer grade tech and built to be consumer friendly. Much of their future sales focus is built around having more features which inevitably comes with more support problems. I suspect their customer service is run ragged with general questions from new reefers so much so that it impacts customers with meaningful problems something I doubt GHL has to deal with.

 

[shred5]

If it’s not for sale on the shelf, it doesn’t exist.

As a distributor, they have a history. As a product developer what have they made?

You can say that about any company. They all had to start somewhere. Has nothing to do with failing.
You fail because of a bad product. You fail with bad marketing. Heck with good marketing you can succeed with a bad product.

Also they have Don and in my opinion is one of the smartest guys anyone will talk with.

Also they do have brands of their own like IceCap. I do not know how much of the manufacturing they have to do with IceCap but it is theirs. Some of it is rebranded product.

 

[Jon's Reef]

Also they do have brands of their own like IceCap. I do not know how much of the manufacturing they have to do with IceCap but it is theirs. Some of it is rebranded product.

From the Coralvue website:
CoralVue is the exclusive global distribution partner for the IceCap brand.

Yes, everyone starts somewhere. Controllers are one of the hardest things to design and get right. It sank Vertex. Product development is a different ballgame. They are not only proving the product, but also their processes... and their people. They have good sales, marketing and customer support as a distributor. But it is a different skill set to develop a product and deal with manufacturing logistics. From this perspective it is an "internally funded startup".

Going back to the original thread topic. Would you recommend a first gen product from a new R&D company to a novice reefer? or a proven tech? I would say buy the proven tech... if money is a concern, buy a used one from someone on the forum.

Let the early adopters work out the kinks, give it time for the other accs (ex sense box) to come out. See what the aftermarket value is going to look like.

 

[shred5]

From the Coralvue website:
CoralVue is the exclusive global distribution partner for the IceCap brand.

Yes, everyone starts somewhere. Controllers are one of the hardest things to design and get right. It sank Vertex. Product development is a different ballgame. They are not only proving the product, but also their processes... and their people. They have good sales, marketing and customer support as a distributor. But it is a different skill set to develop a product and deal with manufacturing logistics. From this perspective it is an "internally funded startup".

Going back to the original thread topic. Would you recommend a first gen product from a new R&D company to a novice reefer? or a proven tech? I would say buy the proven tech... if money is a concern, buy a used one from someone on the forum.

Let the early adopters work out the kinks, give it time for the other accs (ex sense box) to come out. See what the aftermarket value is going to look like.

They own them.
They bought the brand many years ago.

 

[DaddyFish]

Well, I pulled the trigger on a HYDROS system today. I have A LOT of sensors I want to install, including some DIY ones.
The Sense-4 becoming a reality soon will determine if I keep it, or buy an Apex to replace it.

 

[reeferKen]

Reasons Mr. Paletta gave up the Apex at 35:50

 

[reefiniteasy]

Hydros Control XS is out in stores in 2 weeks.

 

[burningmime]

I'll weigh in on the Trident vs. other Kh testers thing. I own a Trident, and if I were to do it again, I'd pick anything else. In fact, if anyone wants to swap 1:1 a Trident + Dos for a Kh Keeper, PM me.

The issue with the Trident is that you can't DIY your reagents, so you have an ongoing $200-$300 / year cost. Even if all you want is the alk testing -- the alk reagent has a bunch of extra junk in it besides just acid and water. I also have fears about what to do when something goes wrong, and there are more moving parts in the Triden than its competitors. That one's mostly a theoretical issue.

The other parts of the Apex are good, though.

 

[Jon's Reef]

there are more moving parts in the Triden than its competitors

Is this true?

Trident has 1 pump, 5 valves and the sample stirrer. Very simple design from the hardware standpoint.

I do not know how many parts are in others, but for sure they use 3 pumps.

 

[burningmime]

Is this true?

Trident has 1 pump, 5 valves and the sample stirrer. Very simple design from the hardware standpoint.

I do not know how many parts are in others, but for sure they use 3 pumps.

I'd say a solenoid valve is a moving part as much as a pump. Regardless, my primary concern is reagents.

 

[reeferKen]

remember when Apex killed Sanjay Joshi's tank.....1.04.00 mark

 

[Mjl714]

Well, I pulled the trigger on a HYDROS system today. I have A LOT of sensors I want to install, including some DIY ones.
The Sense-4 becoming a reality soon will determine if I keep it, or buy an Apex to replace it.

Well, what do you think of the Hydros?

 

[Sarcazian]

IT is a part of my job along with electrical engineering, used to install DSL and owned part of a ISP.

Better get used to it because everything is going WiFi even light fixtures. Not having to run control wiring saves a fortune. We are starting to install more and more light fixtures that are WiFi. Eventually everything is, so get used to it. Move forward or fall behind.

It is funny now we have to worry about routers. If you are seriously worried then use a controller as a way to monitor and not control because anything can fail.

People should always have a backup plan because stuff fails no matter what it is.

Also the Alerts let you know so much more than a heart beat.

Not to mention Cloud.

Hydros is newer so yea they have to prove themselves long term. But they are also backed by a good company that seems willing to do what needs to be done.

Questions that may be a silly one.

#1. Since the Hydros is cloud centric I am guessing that it sends an SMS/email (from the cloud) if your device has stopped communicating for a period of time? I suspect so given your Alerts/heart beat statement. This would at least let you reboot the router the device is connected to - assuming that you are home..

#2. Does the Hydros not have local commands that it can execute one if the wifi goes down? Even my Kasa power strip has scheduled locally that do not need wifi. If my powerhead needs to go off and on 10x a day it still will.

 

[DaddyFish]

Well, what do you think of the Hydros?

I'm still waiting on the pre-ordered Hydros Control-XS to arrive. There's lots of expensive shiny pieces in pretty boxes, but I'm not starting the install until I know I have enough Sense ports to handle what I already know I'm implementing. I will have a Control-8 (Control-4 plus Control-XS).

 

[shred5]

Questions that may be a silly one.

#1. Since the Hydros is cloud centric I am guessing that it sends an SMS/email (from the cloud) if your device has stopped communicating for a period of time? I suspect so given your Alerts/heart beat statement. This would at least let you reboot the router the device is connected to - assuming that you are home..

#2. Does the Hydros not have local commands that it can execute one if the wifi goes down? Even my Kasa power strip has scheduled locally that do not need wifi. If my powerhead needs to go off and on 10x a day it still will.

Yea if it is disconnected from the cloud it will let you know.

If WiFi should go down it will run normally anything hooked up to the head unit.
Anything hooked to WiFi strip will remain in its current state.

 

[burningmime]

Yea if it is disconnected from the cloud it will let you know.

If WiFi should go down it will run normally anything hooked up to the head unit.
Anything hooked to WiFi strip will remain in its current state.

Wait, if the internet goes down, or just the router? I'm sure I'm not the only one whose ISP goes down at least once every few months for several hours. Even if it's just wifi, I don't want to worry about my tank overheating/flooding if my router gets unplugged. Human error (me cleaning under my desk and disturbing it) scares me more than mechanical failure, although both are going to happen to my router.

Do you have a land line for phone? well what if your cell drops you could die. I wouldn't trust it better get rid of your cell phones.

That's a silly comparison. My cell phone can be off for a few hours without me dying. Heck, I go days in the woods without cell service.

Anything can fail. What if your plug strip fails. What if the power goes out. What if your wall outlet fails?

A short time without electricity (especially if your powerheads have backups) isn't a major concern. A tank might survive 2 hours without power. It won't survive 2 hours of the heater being stuck on. It won't survive being dosed a full jug of alk. My floors won't survive my ATO being on for 2 hours. Failing "on" is worse than failing "off"

 

[n2585722]

A short time without electricity (especially if your powerheads have backups) isn't a major concern. A tank might survive 2 hours without power. It won't survive 2 hours of the heater being stuck on. It won't survive being dosed a full jug of alk. My floors won't survive my ATO being on for 2 hours. Failing "on" is worse than failing "off"

I have the Hydros and use it for ATO and AWC. Those pumps are controlled via the drive ports. As far as the heaters fo I would not rely on the controller alone to turn them off. I set the temp on the heater a couple degrees above the setting on the controller. I use two different outlets for the heaters. As far as power failures go. I live in Texas and we just went through several blackouts. A couple were as long a 4 hrs in length. The Hydros went through them all without any issues. I cannot say the same for all the electronics I have including another brand of controller. Looks like I came out of it without loosing anything. It did take almost a complete day for the heaters to finally catch back up to the original settings and that was after adding in an additional heater that I don't usually have in the tank. The tank was low temp for almost a week But so was the whole house.

 

[burningmime]

I have the Hydros and use it for ATO and AWC. Those pumps are controlled via the drive ports. As far as the heaters fo I would not rely on the controller alone to turn them off. I set the temp on the heater a couple degrees above the setting on the controller. I use two different outlets for the heaters. As far as power failures go. I live in Texas and we just went through several blackouts. A couple were as long a 4 hrs in length. The Hydros went through them all without any issues. I cannot say the same for all the electronics I have including another brand of controller. Looks like I came out of it without loosing anything. It did take almost a complete day for the heaters to finally catch back up to the original settings and that was after adding in an additional heater that I don't usually have in the tank. The tank was low temp for almost a week But so was the whole house.

Right; but those things failed *off*. A heater or doser being stuck *on* can nuke the tank faster than off.

 

[n2585722]

As I said my ATO and AWC pumps are not on the Wifi outlets. they are on the drive ports on the Control 4. The heaters are on the power strip but also have their own thermostat set a couple degrees higher than the setting on the controller. So if the outlet is stuck on it will use the internal thermostat on the heater until the wifi strip is restored.